Think I figured out the grip slip!

[HyzerUniBomber]

http://www.heavydisc.com/2014/11/right-pec-and-some-grip-answers.html

Video and some screen caps... think I might have worked it out thanks to an email from a reader.

Slightly happy, even though it's cold and dark!

 

[TAFL]

Cool! If it stays dry on Saturday, I'll try this out.

 

[Nick481]

Very good info. Definitely going to try it as ive just been trying to clamp down through the whole throw.

 

[PWaggoner]

Good job! I know I didn't move my plant foot a little on a standstill throw. Went outside and it helps a ton. Does your foot have to do that in a x step or do you do the reach back right before you plant then swing?Or do you put your foot down reach back, move the right foot forward a little and then swing?

 

[TalbotTrojan]

Great light bulb moment. I am going to have to play around with thus a bit. I think that this along with balance and bracing may be the answer to my distance woes.

 

[slowplastic]

What distance difference do you see on something like a Buzzz and a Teebird for when you get that late squeeze compared to before?

 

[KRATC]

Quick question. I know this is just a drill, and drills are there to help you learn the concept and such. Some of your shots seemed to be coming out a little nose-up or anny. When you are throwing, do you find yourself accidentally throwing annys? I know that is something I struggle with on occasion (along with most other things).

Thanks for these videos and your effort!

 

[Romans 5-8]

I don't think it's necessarily the grip pressure, but the timing of the snap. Pulling on a straight line is massively important. It's setting yourself up for the snap, however you do it, no matter what pressure, pulling through straight has improved my accuracy more than anything.

As long as you are gripping tight at the end and it is ejected out bc your elbow then wrist acts as a double lever. Bam bam, your the disc has no choice but to rip out if your form is solid. Which mine isn't all the time, but at least I know what I did wrong. In my experience it has never been a huge deal with grip pressure.

I will definitely give this a go, I'm willing to experiment for sure. I just don't think it's a breakthrough lightbulb moment. I never grip super tight when my disc is by my peck. I always read and learned to increase the grip at the end of the throw anyway right? Set your grip where you want it and grip it to rip it at the snap point.

Cool video though, I love to see new stuff, just don't think it's gonna be a huge difference. My thought when standstill is to keep the disc close to my chest on the pull through, it is super hard to do that with 100% pressure the whole way...seems unnatural.

Is that something many people do? Grip full strength the whole way? Just curious.

 

[Romans 5-8]

I hope someone understands what I meant in the previous post. It's hard to explain, if you know what I mean.

 

[Kodachrome]

Is that something many people do? Grip full strength the whole way? Just curious.

i would hope not. it's pretty counterproductive. i would always have a firm grip but not to the point where i felt i was "trying" to press the disc - i was a landscaper so it just felt natural - now that i'm a gimp because i have a desk job i've loosened up a bit more for sure. i know i threw farther when i was landscaping this summer though.

i'm personally of the opinion that your wrist should never be curling in so far that you lose grip strength-my grip strength is actually greater when my wrist is slightly cocked inward, but not too far. watch the lead card driving video again on youtube from EO2013. look at their wrists. none of them curls in to the point where it would have an influence on grip. the wrist action in a throw should be quite small. they are in a powerful zone; they never let their wrists bend in far enough to lose that strength.

i feel that if one is gripping at max strength they would not be able to hold on through that slight levering action.

 

[HyzerUniBomber]

Good job! I know I didn't move my plant foot a little on a standstill throw. Went outside and it helps a ton. Does your foot have to do that in a x step or do you do the reach back right before you plant then swing?Or do you put your foot down reach back, move the right foot forward a little and then swing?

The back swing is timed to be exactly opposite of the plant foot moving forward.

 

[HyzerUniBomber]

What distance difference do you see on something like a Buzzz and a Teebird for when you get that late squeeze compared to before?

The difference between 3 and 4:00 seems to be at least 25', sometimes a bit more.

 

[HyzerUniBomber]

Quick question. I know this is just a drill, and drills are there to help you learn the concept and such. Some of your shots seemed to be coming out a little nose-up or anny. When you are throwing, do you find yourself accidentally throwing annys? I know that is something I struggle with on occasion (along with most other things).

Thanks for these videos and your effort!

Glad to help, I think I am honestly ranging in the area I'm throwing in. If I were to really uncork a shot in that parking lot, I'd be losing discs. Throwing the other direction, I have accidentally hit the apartments.

In regular rounds, I only pop up shots if I get lazy or think I can flip up a disc too easily.

The annie shot in the video was a super turny/domey mid, but I definitely do have a nasty habit of rolling my wrist with putters.

 

[HyzerUniBomber]

i would hope not. it's pretty counterproductive.

Nobody can ever suggest that I learn things the easy way. My form changed a bit as I guided deeper into the right pec, which required for a more bent wrist.

My solution was to try to get a very firm grip earlier, and maintain the pressure through the motion. Clearly it doesn't work.

Some guys like Searching for Silky, delay the extension and get huge power from the passive loaded wrist. Some, like AJ are way more straight wristed. You can come at from different ways, but I guess the take away is not to try to squeeze during the bend... or don't bend.

 

[HyzerUniBomber]

Another big gun with substantial wrist loading.

 

[rhatton1]

That's an interesting take on it, I had always gone for loose, loose, loose past the body (I played around once upon a time with it so loose that the disc would just hang off my fingertips, there was a top bomber who did this too - was it Chris Voights?)and then grip it and rip through the pivot as it was explained to me that loose muscles can move faster than tight and you can get more whip through the lower arm as a result (think this was a very early lightbulb moment given to me by JHERN over at DGR) , but just playing around with the grip strength as you've shown there with the wrist at different angles shows a massive difference in grip power and I can see what you're saying with once you've gripped early you can't increase the strength later so you've pretty much shot your bolt.

Makes me wonder about the handshake position and getting the nose down, if you are actively trying to get into the handshake position before the backside of the disc is starting to come round then you may be losing grip strength as a result - this goes hand in hand with the key turn/thumb push idea through the HIT, as that motion will force the wrist down into the handshake position and nose down meaning you don't have to be in it beforehand therefore maximizing grip strength potential once you activate the muscles.

Possibly - typing as I think about it so not sure if this makes sense.

 

[sidewinder22]

Is that something many people do? Grip full strength the whole way? Just curious.

I'd say many players do grip full strength all the way when they don't know better. I remember a few years ago I was getting golfer's elbow because I had a death grip on the disc from the get go. After staying looser it disappeared. Staying loose to firm is the way to go until the power zone then hard. Looser for more distance, firmer for more accuracy.

 

[Aim For The Chains]

one overlooked part of grip is HOW you are applying the pressure. If you grip too tightly with the wrong muscles you hinder how loose the wrist lever can be to impart force on the disc. One of the BEST videos still to date on this topic IMO when it comes to showing how the wrist/forearm tendons should be loose like you are gripping a fork/pencil etc. Control = power.

 

[SpringDgLover]

The difference between 3 and 4:00 seems to be at least 25', sometimes a bit more.

When you say 3 and 4, where is this clock located, what is this referring to? Also the curling of the wrist to me seems a bit over blown and more prone to mistakes. This idea that someone can "control" their grip strength at the very end of their hit is silly. Considering a good players arm speed cant be 60+ miles an hr. You are looking for tendon bounce not an artificial curl snap effect. That's why you are turning things over and gripping things into Apartment complexes.

 

[rhatton1]

This idea that someone can "control" their grip strength at the very end of their hit is silly.

No it's not.

Do it with a disc at incredibly slow speed with your hand starting already way past the right pec almost at it's full extension position. initiate the pivot and clamp down as the you feel the weight shift of the disc - you can throw surprisingly far like this.

Find this feeling and reinforce it.

Add more and more motion but keep the feeling at each introduction of more motion.

in time the feeling of gripping at the hit becomes part of your drive and you can feel if you haven't achieved it before the discs flight shows you you haven't.

Blake T's hammer drills can work this feeling to an extent as well although don't quite get the full hit feeling down as this is a secondary extension after the first.

You can really work on it by just dangling the disc from your fingertips up until the lower arm chop is shooting out at which point you have to grip down hard to prevent the disc just flopping out of your hand. (Can anyone remember the big gun that drives like this, I'm sure Chris Voight used to but I can't find any video showing it. )