Throwing 90m (295') - how to improve?

[Arezaki]

Hi!

It would be super cool if anyone took their time criticizing my form in the two videos below. I throw about 90m (295') on flat ground and want to improve.

I can see some of the things I have to work with (like a surprising rounding), but I don't know how to tackle it all. Give me everything you got.

Sideways: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DaVgpwwSNNY&feature=youtu.be

Behind: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgbP_3S6eaI&feature=youtu.be

Let me know if there are any problems with the videos.

 

[sidewinder22]

Get your nose over your toes and shoulder to swing in a pendulum and left arm in tight. Probably need slower and understable discs.

 

[Arezaki]

Get your nose over your toes and shoulder to swing in a pendulum and left arm in tight. Probably need slower and understable discs.

Thanks for the reply! Could you elaborate "get your nose over your toes"? When do I need to do that?

Thanks again.

 

[sidewinder22]

Shift balance to front leg before swing.

 

[Arezaki]

A update

Have been working on a lot of different things since last time. Filmed my self today, but I did not get the technique to click, so it is no point in uploading the videos. Been working on shifting my weight to the front, moving the hip and shoulder at first, lagging behind with my arm, referencing to the thread "the kinetic sequence". As I understand it, this is what it means to get the nose over toes? When done correctly, you should feel that you are holding your arm back in a way, leading with the shoulder?

Been trying to do this during practice, and felt that my arm lagged and was heavier at release. Has not been consistent, but am working on it. Have gotten a disc to fly 96m (315') measured with a golf range finder here the other day. Had also been managing to throw beside the pin of a 97m hole many times, although I have not measured if the distance is correct on the layout. My longest flying disc is a GStar Corvette 14 5 -2 2. Although it is a super-fast disc, it is understable enough to fly flat for long, and I think the speed is just helping me.

Thanks for the picture of me, SW22. Did not actually see it before now. It did not show up before I logged in making this comment. Macbeth clearly has more weight onto the front foot than me and is leaning more forward, shoulders more down (no comparison otherwise ...). Just to keep practicing.

 

[Arezaki]

New video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=664KOLK0VUg

From the side and behind. Behind was not in slow motion. Mind the sound.

Think there is some improvement here. Still a high shoulder, but I am working on it.

How is the weight shift? Still not there? But maybe a little better.

Every comment helps.

 

[sidewinder22]

Much better. Work on staying more balanced/centered moving over rear foot.

 

[DiscFifty]

I'm no form expert, but to my eyes that form looks capable of throwing much further than 300. However...I did spot one thing (obvious) in both old and new videos that will probably add another 25-50ft (maybe much more) on your throw once you "get it". You are not coiling your wrist....at...all. So you're replying on pure arm speed to propel the disc.

The act of coiling your wrist at the right time, typically right before you eject the disc, will snap the disc out of your hands with more speed and more spin, causing your disc to glide more. In the old days (a few years ago round here..lol..), it was popular to think "no need to coil your disc, it happens naturally when you throw". Nope..that myth has been busted over and over. Several bombers saying something similar clearly showed them coiling the disc right before they eject the disc. For sure watch Eagle and Simon in these videos and check out that wrist coil, and more importantly WHEN they are coiling their wrist. Don't be surprised if you lose some control/accuracy as you dial this in. You might think it's a grip lock, when in reality you're just releasing the disc late. It will take some time for your brain to adjust to what's happening.

Btw... a good drill to improve snap imop is to throw putters over and over, especially from a stand still. And constantly trying to beat your furthest throw. Eventually you'll notice how easy it feels to lob out 200-250ft+ putter throws.

 

[sidewinder22]

I'm no form expert, but to my eyes that form looks capable of throwing much further than 300. However...I did spot one thing (obvious) in both old and new videos that will probably add another 25-50ft (maybe much more) on your throw once you "get it". You are not coiling your wrist....at...all. So you're replying on pure arm speed to propel the disc.

The act of coiling your wrist at the right time, typically right before you eject the disc, will snap the disc out of your hands with more speed and more spin, causing your disc to glide more. In the old days (a few years ago round here..lol..), it was popular to think "no need to coil your disc, it happens naturally when you throw". Nope..that myth has been busted over and over. Several bombers saying something similar clearly showed them coiling the disc right before they eject the disc. For sure watch Eagle and Simon in these videos and check out that wrist coil, and more importantly WHEN they are coiling their wrist. Don't be surprised if you lose some control/accuracy as you dial this in. You might think it's a grip lock, when in reality you're just releasing the disc late. It will take some time for your brain to adjust to what's happening.

Btw... a good drill to improve snap imop is to throw putters over and over, especially from a stand still. And constantly trying to beat your furthest throw. Eventually you'll notice how easy it feels to lob out 200-250ft+ putter throws.

The OP is hugging himself and dragging the disc around the left shoulder, instead of keeping the upper arm wide to allow the lower arm/disc to swing into center chest and load naturally. Dave makes no mention about coiling the wrist actively in that vid.

Just bending the wrist will not do much without fixing the issue with the upper arm/shoulder joint collapsing. The when can't happen properly without the power pocket space available to swing into/out from.

It's been my experience that trying to consciously curl your wrist leads to a very unnatural feel during the pull through. The muscles of your arm are going to perform their best if they are more relaxed. Most of your power is coming from your torso anyway.

I don't believe that you would get any more spin from a curled wrist either. The spin is imparted when the disc forcibly rips from your grip - not wrist flick per se.

Some natural wrist curl is going to happen as you begin to accelerate our arm forward due to the inertia of the disc. Trying to mess with the disc's own momentum by applying your own muscle power to it would seem to be detrimental to timing and fluidity of motion throughout the pull.

Hope that made a little sense.

 

[DiscFifty]

The bend, coil, etc, will happen naturally over time and you won't even have to think about it. But the concept of it should be introduced early on as it's not something you can do right away and expect immediate results. And the op obviously has zero wrist bend/coil. Based on the 2 videos and the close up photo, well... I think they speak for themselves.

 

[sidewinder22]

The bend, coil, etc, will happen naturally over time and you won't even have to think about it. But the concept of it should be introduced early on as it's not something you can do right away and expect immediate results. And the op obviously has zero wrist bend/coil. Based on the 2 videos and the close up photo, well... I think they speak for themselves.

Simon has no wrist curl until the elbow starts extending out away from center to release. Eagle does appear to curl in. PP doesn't.
So where's the myth?

The wrist will not or can not physically load at the right time, if the upper arm/shoulder are collapsed. You can load the wrist straight or curled.

Wrist is pretty straight.

 

[DiscFifty]

Most elite players bend the wrist, it's 100% obvious. In this attached pic of Paige, the disc is probably hitting her forearm. Maybe she doesn't coil as much all the time, who knows. I'm sure it's something that happens without them knowing it and probably only happens "when they need to do it". I could show photo after photo of most of the current popular players and they all bend the wrist for the most part. If you really need to see that, I will be glad to do it, just give me some time.

 

[DiscFifty]

Here's Seppo Paju....he's another huge bomber. That's all for now... lol..

 

[sidewinder22]

It's called lag/inertia - which bends the wrist back as you accelerate the arm.

 

[SaROCaM]

Most elite players bend the wrist, it's 100% obvious. In this attached pic of Paige, the disc is probably hitting her forearm. Maybe she doesn't coil as much all the time, who knows. I'm sure it's something that happens without them knowing it and probably only happens "when they need to do it". I could show photo after photo of most of the current popular players and they all bend the wrist for the most part. If you really need to see that, I will be glad to do it, just give me some time.

To prove wrist curl you attached a pic of Paige that is a still frame that comes from the gif in the post right above yours that shows she is NOT curling her wrist.

 

[DiscFifty]

I have no idea if it's the same actual throw or not, obviously the same tournament. (I captured the frame from a video, not a gif btw) If your eyes see she is not bending the wrist in the photo I attached, that's ok. In my opinion it's a more than obvious bend. Plenty other vids show paige bends the wrist, I'll post another pic later.

 

[SaROCaM]

I have no idea if it's the same actual throw or not, obviously the same tournament. (I captured the frame from a video, not a gif btw) If your eyes see she is not bending the wrist in the photo I attached, that's ok. In my opinion it's a more than obvious bend. Plenty other vids show paige bends the wrist, I'll post another pic later.

Video, gif, whatever, the gif probably comes from that same video...look at the post above yours. That is the same shot, same background banner, etc. You can see she isn't coiling the wrist.

 

[DiscFifty]

Video, gif, whatever...look at the post above yours. That is the same shot, same background banner, etc. You can see she isn't coiling the wrist.

0k.. did the gif capture every frame of the throw? Are you saying in my attached photo there is zero wrist bend?

 

[sidewinder22]

0k.. did the gif capture every frame of the throw? Are you saying in my attached photo there is zero wrist bend?

You think she is actively bending the wrist back there, correct?

 

[DiscFifty]

You think she is actively bending the wrist back there, correct?

Actively is the perfect word to discuss this. I think she has no idea she is doing it and I think it's exactly what you said earlier.. "It's called lag/inertia - which bends the wrist back as you accelerate the arm."

Some pros exaggerate this dramatically. After dinner I will post more examples.