Penal Design

[MikePinchico]

You have to park it safe with a 300' drive in front of the OB, then make it a least 15' to the OB circle. The only way for birdie is making a 40-50' putt. Making an ace would take an act of god.

 

[sidewinder22]

OIL City?

 

[optidiscic]

I always felt well done punitive design should add to your scorecard and not subtract from your bag

This is why I don't like some aspects of Maple Hill and Paw Paw where disc loss can happen on hole 1 for instance

 

[optidiscic]

You have to park it safe with a 300' drive in front of the OB, then make it a least 15' to the OB circle. The only way for birdie is making a 40-50' putt. Making an ace would take an act of god.

how close is the basket to the oob?

I like the placement concept

 

[Peterb]

Dela has fast rollaway greens and side canyons that will make a missed birdie putt a sure bogey. It also has roots that can screw you. But then again, the hazards are the same for all playing. You need to manage your game to what is there.

The bigger issue with dela is that its most enjoyable shot, top of the world, is backed by the parking lot and easily reachable with a wayward drive. That's why I usually chuck a midrange off of it but it would be fun to see a bubble boss fly there as you drive towards hole 20's basket. That would make it a true par 4 at least with a nice dogleg right to the basket and a tree filled canyon between you an the pin.

 

[MikePinchico]

how close is the basket to the oob?

I like the placement concept

325-335'

 

[optidiscic]

325-335'

wait how many feet is the basket from the marked oob and how long is the entire hole?

 

[MikePinchico]

To the corner of the telephone poles is about 325', the current pin location is 366' from the tee pad. The pin will stay the same distance but will be surrounded by OB

 

[optidiscic]

Dela has fast rollaway greens and side canyons that will make a missed birdie putt a sure bogey. It also has roots that can screw you. But then again, the hazards are the same for all playing. You need to manage your game to what is there.

The bigger issue with dela is that its most enjoyable shot, top of the world, is backed by the parking lot and easily reachable with a wayward drive. That's why I usually chuck a midrange off of it but it would be fun to see a bubble boss fly there as you drive towards hole 20's basket. That would make it a true par 4 at least with a nice dogleg right to the basket and a tree filled canyon between you an the pin.

I like the penalty for overthrowing....I actually think it's a better design feature than throwing over water/oob

unless the basket sits precariously close to the oob where a long shot brings the oob back into play on the comeback putt/approach

 

[optidiscic]

To the corner of the telephone poles is about 325', the current pin location is 366' from the tee pad. The pin will stay the same distance but will be surrounded by OB

so the pin is surrounded by oob...but how far is the basket from the oob?

 

[MikePinchico]

The pin will be in a 30' circle within the OB. From the OB line to the circle: 15-25'

 

[optidiscic]

This all brings the concept of penalizing reckless play....which I am in favor of

Too often a designer does not bring punishment for reckless play into their design

 

[optidiscic]

The pin will be in a 30' circle within the OB. From the OB line to the circle: 15-25'

gotcha...an island green within an oob area

so essentially you have added the potential for penalizing bad shots to the drive and approach...thus dressing up a pig of a hole into a true risk/reward scenario

throw a 250 foot safe drive and you have a riskier upshot.....throw big to give a simpler approach and you risk off the tee

well done :clap:

 

[sidewinder22]

I like the penalty for overthrowing....I actually think it's a better design feature than throwing over water/oob

unless the basket sits precariously close to the oob where a long shot brings the oob back into play on the comeback putt/approach

You might like Hawk Hallow then. I'm not sure any course can beat Iron Hill for max natural punishment without disc loss though.

 

[MikePinchico]

You would not imagine how hard it is to accomplish what you are saying when you have to cater to ball golfers. I did not mean to give you a hard time, but I'm well acquainted with yellow rope. Opti, you have great thread topics. Suggestion, let your thoughts on threads simmer for a few minutes (maybe even hours). I thought you were attacking yellow rope and I got nervous.

 

[optidiscic]

You would not imagine how hard it is to accomplish what you are saying when you have to cater to ball golfers. I did not mean to give you a hard time, but I'm well acquainted with yellow rope. Opti, you have great thread topics. Suggestion, let your thoughts on threads simmer for a few minutes (maybe even hours). I thought you were attacking yellow rope and I got nervous.

No I was trying to bring up all the different ways people incorporate penalty into design....all of them are flawed in some way and I was wondering what other designers do. I like a taste of everything to be honest...well except for lost discs and thorns

 

[optidiscic]

I will throw out a hole that is perhaps too punitive

a certain hole at Renny where if you get an unfortunate kick and roll....your disc will roll waaaaay down a hill and gain enough speed to make it through a mini forrest of sapplings as it rolls ever downward finally it will end up in a gulch at the base of the hill...when you go to retrieve your disc yo discover yellow rope

It happened to me and I was in awe that Stan Mcdaniel was sick enough to go down there and gold rope a ditch at the base of a hill on the other side of a wall of sapplings

I cried I moaned I hated disc golf that day

the slope, the sapplings, the rope all would have been ok if utilized alone but the combo of the three was just over the top...especially considering you could feasibly end up down there on a not so bad shot or even a missed putt if I recall correctly.

 

[joshmo65]

OIL City?

:wall:


The only course which I thought did an awesome job of this, and I am surprised you didn't mention it, is Nockamixon. I love how some of the fairways are cleared, but boulders off to the side punish you for bad shots. I don't exactly recall, but if there traps in the middle or edges of fairways with boulders, it would limit a run up and would force people to throw from a standstill, which I think is absolutely awesome. I would love to see more bunkers.

 

[tarel]

I played the front 9 or 10 at iron hill was not impressed. I drove home. Was tight long fairways that were kind of lackluster and actually quite boring. Best part was the 2 practice baskets. At least it did not have stupid yellow rope.

 

[fishmich]

birchfeild park(devils den) in lansing does a great job of adding some interesting OB and making you think about your shot. island holes, sandtraps, gardens, mando walls, and fountains offer some nice looking challenges.