Man dies while playing disc golf

[bradharris]

A little more info based on my experience as a juror in a negligence case.

The plaintiff has to prove two things

1. The standard operation and
2. That violating the standard caused harm

In the case for which I served, the term for #1 was "Standard of Care" for a medical professional. This is where expert witnesses are called in to try to establish the standard among the defendant's peers.

Phone records and other data will be reviewed to determine if the power company took reasonable action in leaving this wire unattended. From the limited information we have, it's hard to say from the outside looking in. But everything from that day will be scrutinized to find just where the ball was dropped.

Then in the second part, both sides will argue the cause and effect. In this case, was the power company's negligence the cause of the victim's death? This is where the trespassing argument will come into play. The power company will say that the victim was at fault for being in a closed area.

In my case, had we found that the doctor had violated the standard of care (we didn't), we then would've had to assign a percentage of the blame. In my case it was to three different entities, the patient, the doctor, and the mamography dept at the hospital (where the defense tried to deflect blame). If the percentage of blame for the defense was greater than 50%, they would be required to pay that percentage of the settlement amount.

So the victim here will probably have a small percentage of the blame for entering the park illegally. However the power company seems to be shouldering the majority of blame for leaving the downed wire live in a public space.

 

[Osmo]

I think the issue is that, technically, the park closes at midnight. So, you could argue that he was trespassing.

I still don't feel that satisfactory because the line was also down while the park was still open.

Like someone brought up, if the gates close at midnight they could have been playing before it was technically was closed and finishing a round.

Regardless, it sat for 12 hours.

 

[Osmo]

A little more info based on my experience as a juror in a negligence case.

The plaintiff has to prove two things

1. The standard operation and
2. That violating the standard caused harm

In the case for which I served, the term for #1 was "Standard of Care" for a medical professional. This is where expert witnesses are called in to try to establish the standard among the defendant's peers.

Phone records and other data will be reviewed to determine if the power company took reasonable action in leaving this wire unattended. From the limited information we have, it's hard to say from the outside looking in. But everything from that day will be scrutinized to find just where the ball was dropped.

Then in the second part, both sides will argue the cause and effect. In this case, was the power company's negligence the cause of the victim's death? This is where the trespassing argument will come into play. The power company will say that the victim was at fault for being in a closed area.

In my case, had we found that the doctor had violated the standard of care (we didn't), we then would've had to assign a percentage of the blame. In my case it was to three different entities, the patient, the doctor, and the mamography dept at the hospital (where the defense tried to deflect blame). If the percentage of blame for the defense was greater than 50%, they would be required to pay that percentage of the settlement amount.

So the victim here will probably have a small percentage of the blame for entering the park illegally. However the power company seems to be shouldering the majority of blame for leaving the downed wire live in a public space.

Id assess the blame 75% for the Power Company and 25% for the victim.

25% for being on public ground after closing.
75% for gross negligence in leaving a live wire unattended for 12 hours. 3 of which were only during its closed hours before the young mans life was stolen and the fact that this wire would probably have gone unattended for another 5 hours when the park would have reopened to the public to a live wire on the ground.

 

[jsc430]

^ Four elements of a negligence case are:

1. Duty - some duty to prtect, act, serve, rescue, etc
2. Breach of that duty
3. Damages - some harm, any kind financial, physical, metal, etc
4. Causation - the breach caused the damages

HOWEVER, there are several doctrines and state laws that follow them, that dictate a percentage of the harm/fault for all involved parties, including the victim in a negligence case. I won't bore you but Kansas follows the 50 percent bar rule, meaning a damaged party cannot recover if he is 50 percent or more at fault, but if he is 49 percent or less at fault, he can recover, though his recovery is reduced by his degree of fault.

I'd say that would be a close one. Both are prolly 50-50 liable in my opinion with the facts i have now. But yea, let the litigation begin.

 

[zenbot]

Can you tell if a downed wire is live? I only remember watching a GI Joe PSA and it moved around and made a lot of noise.

 

[jsc430]

^if you have a multi-tester or something. But just by normal senses, probably not

 

[elnino]

yeah that is sad but i wonder how his best friend is dealing with trying to save his friend and even risking his own life to try and save him! very sad, tragic.

 

[agibson]

yeah that is sad but i wonder how his best friend is dealing with trying to save his friend and even risking his own life to try and save him! very sad, tragic.

Yeah, it must really suck.

I don't even know how he _could_ have saved him without tools.

If they're in the right position (e.g. standing up or something) you might have a (extremely dangerous!) shot at taking a running start and crashing into them, hoping you can knock them free. But, extremely dangerous obviously. And, if he's laying on the ground or similar, there might be almost no way.

In the dark, etc. it may be way too risky to even think about it.

A horrible tragedy.

 

[Osmo]

ANyone in the KC area have any updates?

 

[Jukeshoe]

Can you tell if a downed wire is live? I only remember watching a GI Joe PSA and it moved around and made a lot of noise.

Classic! This PSA was actually something I thought about when I first saw the thread.

 

[scarpfish]

Knowing the way that government entities and corporations run their affairs, they'll be investigating this for weeks. Right now, they're all in "cover our asses" mode.

 

[Rob Martin]

http://kcfdc.org/forum/index.php?topic=9328.msg75880;boardseen#new

Topic: The Fallen: Nick Moeder memorial

 

[KniceZ]

Many of you have no clue how the power company works during and after storms. My father worked for the power company for years and actually had a heart attack working long hours trying to get the power back up.

Power companies work on a priority basis. They try to get the most customers back up as fast as possible. The article says nothing about what type of power line involved. Was it a local line the park had strung up to feed a light or shed or a major power line the transited the park. The priority that downed wire would get would be completely different depending on the specific situation.

As for 12 hours being excessive, that's also typically public response. I've been without power to days after major storms. With a downed power line in our neighborhood. But so was about half the rest of the county. Power crew are only allowed by law, to work so many hours before they have to take a rest for their safety.

I'm not saying the situation shouldn't be investigated; but without more info such as the type of power line, how long were other residences in the area out of power, how many power crews were available and how long they had worked; we're all just doing what American's do best - blame someone else or the "big company". Why are we so quick to absolve the individual of any responsibility for their actions. And why can't we show more respect and sorrow for the victum and learn from this.

My lesson - don't go play DG at 3 am after a storm in a park that's closed.

 

[zenbot]

Good insight. Thank you, KniceZ.

 

[Kenny53691]

My lesson - don't go play DG at 3 am after a storm in a park that's closed.

Great point! but there are quite a few people that don't follow the rules...

 

[tbird888]

My lesson - don't go play DG at 3 am after a storm in a park that's closed.

With the legal system as messed up as it is, personal responsibility is no longer a part of Americans' vocabularies in general.

 

[Osmo]

Many of you have no clue how the power company works during and after storms. My father worked for the power company for years and actually had a heart attack working long hours trying to get the power back up.

Power companies work on a priority basis. They try to get the most customers back up as fast as possible. The article says nothing about what type of power line involved. Was it a local line the park had strung up to feed a light or shed or a major power line the transited the park. The priority that downed wire would get would be completely different depending on the specific situation.

As for 12 hours being excessive, that's also typically public response. I've been without power to days after major storms. With a downed power line in our neighborhood. But so was about half the rest of the county. Power crew are only allowed by law, to work so many hours before they have to take a rest for their safety.

I'm not saying the situation shouldn't be investigated; but without more info such as the type of power line, how long were other residences in the area out of power, how many power crews were available and how long they had worked; we're all just doing what American's do best - blame someone else or the "big company". Why are we so quick to absolve the individual of any responsibility for their actions. And why can't we show more respect and sorrow for the victum and learn from this.

My lesson - don't go play DG at 3 am after a storm in a park that's closed.

So are you saying a Power Line down around 4-6PM in the afternoon in a public park would not be a number one priority? Or damn near close to a number one priority?

To make it clear, its reported that the power line being down was relayed to the power company and the fire dept around 3-4PM.

 

[Osmo]

With the legal system as messed up as it is, personal responsibility is no longer a part of Americans' vocabularies in general.

no one said he was without some blame.

but lets not act like he was playing disc golf on a highway and was hit by a car. he was in a public park.. the last place you would expect to trip over a live wire.

 

[tbird888]

no one said he was without some blame.

I never said anyone said that. I said that's how it will be handled in court, where this is inevitably headed.

 

[scarpfish]

The article says nothing about what type of power line involved. Was it a local line the park had strung up to feed a light or shed or a major power line the transited the park. The priority that downed wire would get would be completely different depending on the specific situation.

Messages left on the KCFDC board indicate that the incident happened on Hole 1 of the course. If this was the case, this was a small line that provided power to lights at the park's tennis courts, ball fields and not much else. You can see the line here going from left to right. That is Hole 1's tee box at the corner of the tennis courts.

So no, it wasn't likely a line that was keeping anyone's house dark, but if the line wasn't a first priority to repair, it should have been a first priority for the authorities to keep people out of a public park (which was open for more than seven hours after the line fell) until it was fixed.