Unsanctioned single division cash tournament

[Turnipseed]

I want to organize one. Single division because there is no way to fairly create or police divisions in an unsanctioned tournament, especially with cash on the line. The challenge is attracting lower level players. My idea is to keep entry low, payouts shallow, then put cash ctps on every hole. This will attract players with a shot at winning since they will get a decent payout despite low entry, and hopefully lesser players who will have a shot to win something and be engaged in every hole even when far out of the running.

As a very rough example:
30 players @$30 = $900
$270 to ctps @$15 per
$630 to payout of the top 10

Thoughts? Objections? Ideas for improvement?

 

[thirtydirtybirds]

I feel like that would bring out regular tournament players more than lower level players. In my area there would be probably 15-20 players in the hunt for the payout, and most of the ctp would go to those same players, especially on longer holes, leaving little to nothing to entice myself, a low/mid tier am player, to come out for it.

Really though it depends on how balanced your area is with play level, and if the local players are welcoming or cliquey.

 

[Turnipseed]

I feel like that would bring out regular tournament players more than lower level players. In my area there would be probably 15-20 players in the hunt for the payout, and most of the ctp would go to those same players, especially on longer holes, leaving little to nothing to entice myself, a low/mid tier am player, to come out for it.

Really though it depends on how balanced your area is with play level, and if the local players are welcoming or cliquey.

What would entice you to play in a cash tournament? Can you think of any way to fairly divide players that doesn't depend on trusting their integrity or honesty?

 

[brutalbrutus]

Instead of doing the normal divisions you could do just Pro and Rec. All the pros and advanced guys will play pro just so they wont get howled at by their friends for playing Rec. At most events I play in, the tops of Int and Rec aren't much different on the scoreboard and they should really be in same division for an event like this anyway, so Int guys "playing down" isn't a big deal, imo...

 

[DavidSauls]

The top players will take most of the CTPs, too. I'm not sure the lure of possibility winning 1 or 2 will be enough to draw players who don't have a chance to win the event.

Of course, players are driven by all sorts of motivations, and some will. But for many, it's not just the prizes, it's the competition; they won't want to play in divisions they can't compete in.

 

[Turnipseed]

Brutus and David. You are both probably right. What do you think about bigger payouts and no ctps in pro and smaller payouts plus ctps in am?

 

[thirtydirtybirds]

The top players will take most of the CTPs, too. I'm not sure the lure of possibility winning 1 or 2 will be enough to draw players who don't have a chance to win the event.

Of course, players are driven by all sorts of motivations, and some will. But for many, it's not just the prizes, it's the competition; they won't want to play in divisions they can't compete in.

Agreed. I like to play, and I like to play competitively sometimes, but this type of event just doesn't seem fun to me. I look at it as donating $30 to people for being better than me, and I wouldn't have a chance to win, unless lots of folks don't show, or I shoot some kind of magical tree free tailwind on every drive blowing right towards the pin on every hole round.

There has to be some kind of skill division to maintain fun and fair competition, otherwise it turns in to "donate to your local top players day". If there was a KILLER player pack I might consider it.

 

[ru4por]

Lower level players are driven by players packs.....IMO. A guaranteed payback. $30, no players pack, shallow payouts with high rated players taking all the money does not sound like the recipe for lower rated players to flock.

I play unsanctioned tournaments that use PDGA ratings, why not just do that?

You likely take out me and most of the guys I play with as well. As MA55, MA60M+ guys, most of us can't hang with AM1 players.

 

[brutalbrutus]

What would entice you to play ?

Beer?...

Actually I don't drink but I could see quite a few guys around here show up for some free beers. Or maybe a decent cooked lunch.

 

[thirtydirtybirds]

You know what, now that I think about it, I have a question for OP? What is it you want this tournament to do in regards to your local players? Just be a fun event? Bring in newer players to competition? Something else?

If it's the first two, I would play a single division tournament for charity. Prizes could be donated by local businesses, donated lunch, maybe even small player pack stuff as well. All proceeds going to charity (winners choice of legitimate charity would add some spice), I'd throw 30 bucks and a day on the course at that.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Here's an idea stolen from barrel racing that Pete May explained to me. Tom Monroe used a similar system for events he ran in Florida in the 80s. Play one round for seeding into top third, second third and bottom third. 65% of total purse goes to top third, 25% to middle third and 10% to bottom third. In your example, $585, $225 and $90. During the second round, have the bottom third only playing for 9 $10 CTPs. Pay out 5 of the 10 in the top third using normal payout tables. For the middle third, mix it up with 8 $15 CTPs just for them and pay 3 places say $40/$35/$30 so no one directly makes more than last cash in the top third.

 

[Turnipseed]

I play unsanctioned tournaments that use PDGA ratings, why not just do that?

A significant number of nearby players are not pdga members

 

[ru4por]

Here is an unsanctioned singles going down in the next few weeks around here.

Players will have strokes added or subtracted to their starting score based on their PDGA rating. If you do not have a PDGA rating you can still play, but Brian will make up a really high rating for you.

970 and Above +10
961 - 969 +9
952 - 960 +8
943 - 951 +7
934 - 942 +6
925 - 933 +5
916 - 924 +4
907 - 915 +3
898 - 906 + 2
889 - 897 +1
879 - 888 + 0
869 - 878 -1
859 - 868 -2
849 - 858 -3
839 - 848 -4
829 - 838 -5
819 - 828 -6
809 - 818 -7
798 - 808 - 8
788 - 798 - 9
787 and Lower -10

 

[Turnipseed]

You know what, now that I think about it, I have a question for OP? What is it you want this tournament to do in regards to your local players? Just be a fun event? Bring in newer players to competition? Something else?

If it's the first two, I would play a single division tournament for charity. Prizes could be donated by local businesses, donated lunch, maybe even small player pack stuff as well. All proceeds going to charity (winners choice of legitimate charity would add some spice), I'd throw 30 bucks and a day on the course at that.

Goal is to be fun and a little bit different. And to eliminate plastic payouts.

 

[Turnipseed]

If you do not have a PDGA rating you can still play, but Brian will make up a really high rating for you

Based on what?

 

[Turnipseed]

Here's an idea stolen from barrel racing that Pete May explained to me. Tom Monroe used a similar system for events he ran in Florida in the 80s. Play one round for seeding into top third, second third and bottom third. 65% of total purse goes to top third, 25% to middle third and 10% to bottom third. In your example, $585, $225 and $90. During the second round, have the bottom third only playing for 9 $10 CTPs. Pay out 5 of the 10 in the top third using normal payout tables. For the middle third, mix it up with 8 $15 CTPs just for them and pay 3 places say $40/$35/$30 so no one directly makes more than last cash in the top third.

I like it.

 

[Turnipseed]

^ except the bottom third would only be playing nine holes. Howbout 18 $5 holes?

 

[Cgkdisc]

^ except the bottom third would only be playing nine holes. Howbout 18 $5 holes?

No, they play 18 holes but CTP only on 9 holes. But you could do 18 x $5, too. Thinking about it further, you might want to have $10 for finishing first so that their two round score will matter.

 

[ru4por]

Based on what?

Lol......just read that part. I don't suggest giving noobs a very high rating. I think an experienced TD could pretty fairly judge a players rating by asking how long they have been playing, where they play, what kind of scores they have been shooting......

 

[Turnipseed]

Lol......just read that part. I don't suggest giving noobs a very high rating. I think an experienced TD could pretty fairly judge a players rating by asking how long they have been playing, where they play, what kind of scores they have been shooting......

Again, I am unwilling to rely on the honesty of the players.