2017 Next Generation Disc Golf Top Prize: Car

[loki the trickster]

There is no sandbagging in AM1, that's just terminology people use to perpetuate the culture of trying to move people up. Your estimate of 10-15% in the pro field that aren't really competing is far too low. Take the recent Nashville open, the first tournament i looked at to illustrate this point, http://www.pdga.com/tour/event/30800. Every player sub-973 fails to cash and even those in the 970s have to shoot well above their ratings to finish in the back of cash. The top few guys get everyone's money, plus the added cash that the club put in, and the sport is somehow better for this?

Don't misunderstand me, if people want to play pro who are rarely going to compete, it doesn't bother me one bit. But i would like to see a shift in the culture such that some of those guys on the lower end of pro would feel ok playing am if they want to.

Dont get me wrong i do understand what your saying. And i do agree with a more competitive am1 and forcing the lower half to am2 where they will also be more competitive. The problem is the pdga does not have anything concrete regarding Division versus rating. If there was something more concrete like something along the line of bump spots both up and down in place.

 

[lyleoross]

Two interesting points by bnbanbury, the concept of bagging isn't defined by the rules, it's a player defined topic. It is more harmful than good.

The separation between real pros and the rest of us is just going to grow. There are a lot of players who consider themselves pro who won't be accommodated in five or ten years. That includes into the GM field. We are going to be looking at 1,000 rated players as the norm for pros there, if I read the cards correctly.

 

[lyleoross]

Dont get me wrong i do understand what your saying. And i do agree with a more competitive am1 and forcing the lower half to am2 where they will also be more competitive. The problem is the pdga does not have anything concrete regarding Division versus rating. If there was something more concrete like something along the line of bump spots both up and down in place.

You may not need to. While it will be painful, those low rated pros will be pushed down or out. New players will look up and realize it's not worth it. There will be exceptions, but that's the case in any sport.

 

[DavidSauls]

So how would you feel if the only people who win in your feild are sand bagging and always block the top by playing amateur so they could win?

I am sure there is 15-20% of the amateur feild that has the ability to play pro just as there is 10-15% of pros that dont have the ability to play in the pro feild.

Myself, I don't believe there's a such thing as sandbagging in sanctioned events. Nor have I ever felt entitled to win, or have a chance at winning, in any of the amateur divisions I've played.

Nor have I in any other individual or team sports I've been part of. Sometimes the reality is that you're a bottom-half competitor, and any win against he dominant players or teams is a thrilling upset.

At any rate, a 936-rated Advanced player rarely has to beat anyone above a 970 rating, and that's close enough that a hot event by the weaker player, or a bad event by the better player, can produce an upset.

 

[Discslinger12]

Tardis

 

[bnbanbury]

Just wanted to bring this thread back around a little bit to the original discussion about the Next Generation Tour specifically since Feldberg did another appearance on Smashboxx last night to talk about more details about the tour.

He said that the tour has decided to sanction the final as a B tier. Per Dave, this is will be run as a B tier to allow any qualifiers who are not PDGA member to still play in the Final.

He also said that some number of qualifiers for the championship will get their travel expenses paid to go to the final, although i'm not exactly clear on how many that will be.

The last piece of information, which was also mentioned by Timg in the DGCR announcements thread, is that the top 5 finishers in the national championships will get a DGPT tour cards which will reserve them a spot in every DGPT event.

I think that's it. Timg noted that the website should go live next week.

 

[bnbanbury]

Website is now live for the tour: http://nextgendiscgolf.com. Regions outlined, qualifier and regional dates announced, and a lot of information in the competitor handbook.

 

[bnbanbury]

Interesting information on cost published in the competitor handbook. Initial qualifiers will be $48 to enter, regional qualifiers will be $125, and the final will be a $180 (plus the cost to get to AZ of course). 1st place of each stop gets their entry to the next stop paid for but assuming you simply qualify for each stop you have $353.00 in entries to cover plus travel. Curious to see how many ams can swing this kind of thing.

 

[biscoe]

Ams have as much disposable income as pros in this game. Well- maybe not the top ams since a whole lot of them are teens at this point.

 

[bnbanbury]

Ams have as much disposable income as pros in this game. Well- maybe not the top ams since a whole lot of them are teens at this point.

Sure i agree, I mean i can get myself to Arizona if i want to. I guess maybe the better question is, with the prize pool being so top-heavy I am curious to see if they sell these events out when it would seem that a number of people may decide that this is not worth the amount of money it would take to pursue this.

Pros are a little bit of a different situation when at a big event the top 20 guys are getting $1000+ in payout. In big am events there are typically 6 or 7 young guys who are really in the hunt so it makes me curious if the other ams are willing to invest that kind of money to see this thing through for a handful of discs.

 

[biscoe]

If this year's events are anything like last year's all participants will be amply rewarded. No Feldberg clinic at lunch though.

Hundreds of am players are willing to go play mediocre courses in bowling green every year for a nice players package and little chance to win anything else- I suspect these events will do just fine.

 

[DanJon]

Ams have as much disposable income as pros in this game. Well- maybe not the top ams since a whole lot of them are teens at this point.

To the last point, that's what parents are for.

Do you think the teenagers traveling to (and winning) the top AM events are funding that with a paper route?

I wouldn't be surprised to see a 15, 16 or 17 year old win this thing.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Quite a few Ams are getting some level of sponsorship also.

 

[Lazerface]

It would be cool if something like this tour developed into a type of web.com tour and players could earn their PDGA card. I know there is about 1000 other things that have to happen to make that a reality, but it would be cool. They are sort of doing this by giving top finishers DGPT cards.

Maybe the PDGA should start upping the qualifications for their events and just do away with C-Tiers completely, or make them AM only events. A pro event should require added cash. I guess that could have a negative affect on growth, but it's worth a discussion.

The reality seems to be that we are in a stage where growth/exposure should be the foundation for all PDGA decisions, which could mean having as many events as possible, but as a fan I want to see the professional side turn into something more legitimate and eventually a complete separation of AMs and PROs, where you have to earn your spot in the pro events. There are multiple issues of course: The PROs need the money from the AMs; TDs need large numbers of players at their events to bargain sponsorship support; manufactures are less likely to support PRO only events (maybe) because it turns into a marketing venture only because PROs don't buy discs.

I would like to see the PDGA NTs/Majors absorbed by the DGPT or DGWT (not sanctioning, just control). The PDGA has done an excellent job with the National Tour and that has nothing to do with it. I just think the "private" tours are more likely to up the game when it comes to payouts/event quality/media/etc and are much more likely to create an environment where TDs of these events are able to profit.

 

[DavidSauls]

One of the interestingly appealing aspects is the 54 player cap in qualifiers. Even if you don't want to or expect to qualify for the next level, this should make for a nice pace-of-play.

 

[bnbanbury]

One of the interestingly appealing aspects is the 54 player cap in qualifiers. Even if you don't want to or expect to qualify for the next level, this should make for a nice pace-of-play.

I agree, the qualifiers are the most appealing of the tournaments to me.

 

[PWaggoner]

I'll be much more inclined to proceed to the next level if I win my entry fee.

 

[PWaggoner]

I agree, the qualifiers are the most appealing of the tournaments to me.

Why?

 

[bnbanbury]

Why?

Well, as you mention, if i were to have my entry fee paid to the next round i might feel differently about it. Barring that, its really a cost/benefit for the other 2 stages. $300 plus travel for 2 tournaments is a lot to shell out, particularly when the payout is as top-heavy as it is.

 

[puck'n'disc5]

I noticed that many of the qualifiers are on weekdays. I wonder how that may affect participation numbers. Also, are these 1 round or 2 rounds events?