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Ah, one more thing. I've noticed I very often have my right shoulder too high at power pocket time, compared to many other pros. I have suspicions this is either bad muscle memory, or perhaps also related to that reach back timing, where earl gets me slightly too weight back and (perhaps) slightly tilts me. I may try to focus on that too, not exactly sure how, but it surely plays a role in where my arm ends up (mostly collapsed).
Also noting that my arm definitely seems worse in the videos I posted, compared to others, but since the hip seemed better, I thought that was a better signal.
Ah, one more thing. I've noticed I very often have my right shoulder too high at power pocket time, compared to many other pros. I have suspicions this is either bad muscle memory, or perhaps also related to that reach back timing, where earl gets me slightly too weight back and (perhaps) slightly tilts me. I may try to focus on that too, not exactly sure how, but it surely plays a role in where my arm ends up (mostly collapsed).
Also noting that my arm definitely seems worse in the videos I posted, compared to others, but since the hip seemed better, I thought that was a better signal.
I'd personally be focusing on quality rather than quantity right now.
1. You are not walking/marching/heaving the weight back naturally balanced on top of the rear leg coiling back inside your posture like medicine ball girl.
2. Posture/posture control: Part of the problem and your rising shoulder is the lack of side bend going back into the backswing and forward into the throw. So the disc has no choice to go all the way around your body, and your throwing shoulder has nowhere to go but up. As a result, you're getting almost nothing out of your core/oblique slings. Need to get side bend and while you're at it I'd recommend focusing on nose over toes and towing your elbow over the front foot more vertically like a golfer. Dingle arm pairs well with the side bend drill(s).
IMO/experience it's easier to work on those with less stagger- put ball of rear foot closer to the front ankle relative to the target line.
You are starting in a very wide stance and already turned back, and your rear foot just slips out in transition.
If you are going to start in that wide a stance, I'd recommend you reverse stride into the plant. I'd also focus on the target before starting a backswing.
If you do a more traditional standstill I'd start in a narrower stance and focus on the left lower arm moving targetward toward your left hip, instead of it spinning further away from target.
Just practice this little motion at 9m40s:
A few small improvements, I believe:
* Looking targetward to start swing; not turning back too early (or as badly)
* Left arm in better position than before (this is side-effect, I'm not doing it intentionally)
* More on ball of left / back foot (actually a big change, hard to stay consistent yet)
* Getting a little more into the pocket than before (but not nearly internally rotated enough -- still a ways to go)
* (Not seen) not letting my thumb slip to the edge in backswing
I'd recommend you reverse stride into the plant. I'd also focus on the target before starting a backswing.
and focus on the left lower arm moving targetward toward your left hip, instead of it spinning further away from target.
Initially looking at the target caused all kinds of other bad effects, but practicing that motion triggered some new feelings, it eventually morphed into what my my head and left arm are doing now. I focus on looking at the target, I believe this sets my momentum forward better. I then... hard to describe, focus on keeping my center of gravity moving along that line. That's what it feels like. What it looks like is my left arm does this (slow) swim motion entirely on its own -- I did not intentionally move it that way at any point.
I don't think your rear leg is feeling the loading/unloading/bracing of the backswing on the correct swing path.
I keep a 20lb kettle bell in the garage. I do dingle arm with it, when doing so being on my back heel and straightening that back leg feels VERY unnatural, while staying more on the ball of the left foot feels natural. So I do those before throws, it also helps as a warm up. Seems to be helping, but taking time. I can't fix it fully yet, but I can see and feel it better now.
Note how low your elbow goes and the shoulder is externally rotated and disc is wing up. Your thumb has no real leverage or load/coil in the power pocket to eject the disc back out.
Note how Simon has internally rotated shoulder in the power pocket and disc is wing down, the arm/disc is internally loaded/rotated to spring/uncoil/eject back out with the thumb able to push against the disc outward.
This is where most, nearly all of my focus is now. I've also noticed several of the slow improving youtube coaches are focusing on to the arms swing plane, and how to get the arm into position, keep the elbow in position, etc.
So basically alternating between getting into the elbow forward pocket position 100% with arm, and then more "guiding" it via this advice (start there, swing back, try and get back). Seems still a lot of room to improve using advice already given, but also since I'm still grinding, and seeing some progress, figured I'd post an update anyways.
I'm 41 now. I'm definitely a bit more persistently sore in the arm and knee. Nothing bad, no swelling, etc. I think its just overuse; difficult to take time off when the progress is coming. Spend more time warming up, practicing only ~1-2x a week max, and limiting my throw count. I do wish my body could take more, at this point I actually enjoy the practice. Wherever I end up, learning about this pursuit and the level of dedication it takes, how small the improvements are, etc, has been a rewarding process.
Also picked up a tech disc (topping out around 57mph); used it a few sessions but stoppped, because it turned into what field sessions do -- throwing too hard over and over, and expecting different results. Its on the shelf until the visual improvements stop tracking. My current belief is my right arm not getting fully into the pocket, not getting into that internally rotated position in the pocket pointed out by SW22 earlier, to be the limiter on my distance. So I guess, there's really no reason to think about distance measuring or achievement until that's changed. My primary goal at this point is to, in whatever way possible, get my arm fully into the pocket with my shoulder still internally rotated. Feels like I'm about half-way there comparing current videos with the a few months back.
A few small improvements, I believe:
* Looking targetward to start swing; not turning back too early (or as badly)
* Left arm in better position than before (this is side-effect, I'm not doing it intentionally)
* More on ball of left / back foot (actually a big change, hard to stay consistent yet)
* Getting a little more into the pocket than before (but not nearly internally rotated enough -- still a ways to go)
* (Not seen) not letting my thumb slip to the edge in backswing
Initially looking at the target caused all kinds of other bad effects, but practicing that motion triggered some new feelings, it eventually morphed into what my my head and left arm are doing now. I focus on looking at the target, I believe this sets my momentum forward better. I then... hard to describe, focus on keeping my center of gravity moving along that line. That's what it feels like. What it looks like is my left arm does this (slow) swim motion entirely on its own -- I did not intentionally move it that way at any point.
I keep a 20lb kettle bell in the garage. I do dingle arm with it, when doing so being on my back heel and straightening that back leg feels VERY unnatural, while staying more on the ball of the left foot feels natural. So I do those before throws, it also helps as a warm up. Seems to be helping, but taking time. I can't fix it fully yet, but I can see and feel it better now.
This is where most, nearly all of my focus is now. I've also noticed several of the slow improving youtube coaches are focusing on to the arms swing plane, and how to get the arm into position, keep the elbow in position, etc.
So basically alternating between getting into the elbow forward pocket position 100% with arm, and then more "guiding" it via this advice (start there, swing back, try and get back). Seems still a lot of room to improve using advice already given, but also since I'm still grinding, and seeing some progress, figured I'd post an update anyways.
I'm 41 now. I'm definitely a bit more persistently sore in the arm and knee. Nothing bad, no swelling, etc. I think its just overuse; difficult to take time off when the progress is coming. Spend more time warming up, practicing only ~1-2x a week max, and limiting my throw count. I do wish my body could take more, at this point I actually enjoy the practice. Wherever I end up, learning about this pursuit and the level of dedication it takes, how small the improvements are, etc, has been a rewarding process.
Also picked up a tech disc (topping out around 57mph); used it a few sessions but stoppped, because it turned into what field sessions do -- throwing too hard over and over, and expecting different results. Its on the shelf until the visual improvements stop tracking. My current belief is my right arm not getting fully into the pocket, not getting into that internally rotated position in the pocket pointed out by SW22 earlier, to be the limiter on my distance. So I guess, there's really no reason to think about distance measuring or achievement until that's changed. My primary goal at this point is to, in whatever way possible, get my arm fully into the pocket with my shoulder still internally rotated. Feels like I'm about half-way there comparing current videos with the a few months back.
I'm not a physician but the way you are lunge/extending off the rear leg was much harder on my plant knee than a more natural walking/figure 8 action, or equivalently the "drift and drop" like a pitcher's stride. Throwing hard with your action there will likely add road miles onto that knee quickly.
You still need to work on the Elephant walk/reverse stride using your momentum on the rear side. You need to feel the relationship between the throwing arm and rear leg "walking it back."
I think it's going to be harder for you to learn the better action due to the way you are setting up there because you are already stacked up fully loaded back without the natural walking action.
