[Innova] 9 speed -1turn +3 fade

[xtnrocks]

I've looked at the inbounds flight guide and noticed that 9 speed -1 turn +3 fade discs are missing. Am I missing something? I bag eagles and wraiths, and either valks, sidewinders, or roadrunners. Really like the feel of nine speeds in my hand. The orc and viking and thunderbird are close to this slot, but given the popularity of the other -1+3 discs( eagle,wraith, destroyer, boss) why no nine?

 

[bradharris]

Simple answer: Nothing Innova has produced demonstrates those particular numbers.

It's not as simple as just dialing up a set of flight numbers and having a disc made. The flight numbers, I believe, are determined after initial production.

In the current lineup, the Thunderbird is probably your best bet.

 

[SD86]

I've looked at the inbounds flight guide and noticed that 9 speed -1 turn +3 fade discs are missing. Am I missing something? I bag eagles and wraiths, and either valks, sidewinders, or roadrunners. Really like the feel of nine speeds in my hand. The orc and viking and thunderbird are close to this slot, but given the popularity of the other -1+3 discs( eagle,wraith, destroyer, boss) why no nine?

Interesting point. The pros seem to go with X,5,-1,3 (for Innova that's the Wraith, Destroyer, Boss) the most in their drivers. The Orc is 10,4,-1,3 but is it popular with the pros?

But you're right... the 9-speed discs are among the most populated region of the disc golf sphere, along with speed-7. The Viking is 9,4,-1,2, which is the closest to the numbers that I've seen so far (admittedly, have not checked other brands closely). I personally suspect that 9,5,-1,3 is not as effective as the higher speed discs, but will not bet the mortgage money on that.

By the way, I love the 9-speeds as well. I either own or have thrown every Innova speed-9 disc, the Valkyrie is my all-time favorite disc, and Marshall's Flight Guide has the MVP Amp (and Volt and Tesla) rated speed-9, though they're advertised as speed-8.

 

[JOEMAMA]

Check out the Millennium Orion LF. That should be exactly what you're looking for.

 

[clard]

Check out the Millennium Orion LF. That should be exactly what you're looking for.

Yep. P line or G line PDs will also fit the bill.

 

[RistoS]

By the way, I love the 9-speeds as well. I either own or have thrown every Innova speed-9 disc, the Valkyrie is my all-time favorite disc, and Marshall's Flight Guide has the MVP Amp (and Volt and Tesla) rated speed-9, though they're advertised as speed-8.

The Tesla would be about speed 10.

 

[Pbmercil]

Interesting point. The pros seem to go with X,5,-1,3 (for Innova that's the Wraith, Destroyer, Boss) the most in their drivers. The Orc is 10,4,-1,3 but is it popular with the pros?

The Orc was THE high speed driver of choice when it first came out. Innova's development of the bigger drivers (particularly the wraith and destroyer) made it obsolete, but at the time it came out that was everyone's go to for big distance.

Flight numbers are arbitrary, and that goes double when your comparing across brands. Looking at flight ratings will get you in the ball park of what you're gonna get out of a disc, but its not nearly accurate or consistent enough to really look at as a way to build a bag or select discs.

 

[SD86]

The Tesla would be about speed 10.

I don't disagree at all. Just stating where Marshall's Flight Guide had some of the MVP discs.

 

[SD86]

The Orc was THE high speed driver of choice when it first came out. Innova's development of the bigger drivers (particularly the wraith and destroyer) made it obsolete, but at the time it came out that was everyone's go to for big distance.

Flight numbers are arbitrary, and that goes double when your comparing across brands. Looking at flight ratings will get you in the ball park of what you're gonna get out of a disc, but its not nearly accurate or consistent enough to really look at as a way to build a bag or select discs.

Agree about the Orc.

As to flight numbers, I agree with some of what you say, and respectfully disagree about some of it. I find the flight numbers using the Innova system to be pretty good. Not perfect, of course, as nothing is, and certainly there are inconsistencies within production runs of molds. Numbers change, too, as the Tern went from 12,6,-4,2 to 12,6,-3,2 and in Champion went to 12,6,-2,2.

But I have found so far that the numbers overall do a good job of getting relative speeds (which we all know is less actual speed and more the power needed to get to speed) and glides correct. Maybe disc golf needs the equivalent of an "Iron Bryon" of real golf in order to make across-the-board ratings, but I can't complain about the system, and I do think it works pretty well.

 

[eric40817]

Wouldnt a C-CD2 or a P/G-CD fit this one pretty well? I was under the impression that Discmania made these discs to fill that void on Innovas side. Even an SL if you can find an actual SL

 

[Brodysseus]

Yep. P line or G line PDs will also fit the bill.

G-Line PD was the first thing that popped into my head.

 

[Pbmercil]

But I have found so far that the numbers overall do a good job of getting relative speeds (which we all know is less actual speed and more the power needed to get to speed) and glides correct. Maybe disc golf needs the equivalent of an "Iron Bryon" of real golf in order to make across-the-board ratings, but I can't complain about the system, and I do think it works pretty well.

Well the speed rating is mostly arbitrary. There is somewhat of a pattern (speed = rim size) but then you have multiple speed classes with a huge variance in rim size, even though the bigger rimmed drivers in that speed are clearly faster/longer. Then you have the correlation between HSS and glide, which is nearly perportional, and the fade rating is pretty arbitrary too.

I use a combo of Inbounds universal flight chart (which is pretty good for the most part) and rim size off the PDGA specs when comparing and contrasting drivers. Works way better then any manufactures flight chart.

 

[PMantle]

Maybe disc golf needs the equivalent of an "Iron Bryon" of real golf in order to make across-the-board ratings, but I can't complain about the system, and I do think it works pretty well.

I would love to see retained speed. Throw discs from a machine at X mpg and then check the speed at varying distances.

 

[Broken Shoulder]

The flight numbers are a general guideline, not a hard and fast rule. I've thrown a few Roadrunners off the shelf that are overstable. The molding inconsistency alone renders a lot of it pointless. I've got PDs that turn out of the box, and one that's almost a Firebird. I've got a Wraith that you'd swear was an Xcal.

Grab a Thunderbird, PD, OLF, Orc... something near that speed range and generally close to the numbers you're looking for, and try it. From there, you can get a sense of how others of that mold would fly based on weight, dome, PLH, etc.

 

[kevdiv48]

Check out the Millennium Orion LF. That should be exactly what you're looking for.

Yep. P line or G line PDs will also fit the bill.

Yup, MOLF or lighter SOLF, or lighter P- or G-PD will work well.

 

[ODRB]

Yup, MOLF or lighter SOLF, or lighter P- or G-PD will work well.

Yup.

OLF is exactly those numbers. M and S beat to flippier pretty quick. 1.2 and 1.3 QOLFs start pretty HSS, but develop turn while keeping the late fade. They are worth the work.

PDs aren't right on that number, but G and P develop turn pretty quickly. the S takes longer to get there, but is more reliable and will stay in the sweet spot longer.

Orcs are faster still, but fly very similar lines to QOLFs.

 

[whentherainscome]

The 1.2 QOLFs fit this. For a short time I had a lower PLH champ Thunderbird that flew like a seasoned Eagle. I'm not sure if they naturally beat in to that flight or not if you start with an overstable one.

 

[xtnrocks]

Thanks for all the suggestions, I am thinking 175 champ sidewinder or valk right now, the alphabet soup of other brands leaves me rather confused. It's the width of nine speed rims that I really like for good release timing. Tens make me feel like i might as well stick with Wraiths.

 

[xtnrocks]

Millennium orion lf sounds really good. What does the lf stand for? Also what plastics? Not much experience with this brand, so any other info would be appreciated.

 

[slowplastic]

Thanks for all the suggestions, I am thinking 175 champ sidewinder or valk right now, the alphabet soup of other brands leaves me rather confused. It's the width of nine speed rims that I really like for good release timing. Tens make me feel like i might as well stick with Wraiths.

Nice, I was going to say GPD or champ Sidewinder...I never got a chance to really beat in the champ Sidewinder that I had for a bit, but it was definitely 9/5/-1/3 (and I have thrown a used star one that was 9/5+/-3/1 so it's not my arm) for the first few weeks.

The Lat64 Saint can be another good disc in this range, as it beats in it seems to get to a fade of ~2 though...very straight. Not fantastic in the wind but very straight glidey disc at power on a mild hyzer flip.