Age Protected Amateurs Playing a 4th Round of the Weekend

[Central Scrutinizer]

The Sound of Air Escaping an Open Balloon

I just played in back-to-back NADGT B-tiers in the MA-40 division (I'm 49) at Meyer Broadway Park (Three Rivers, MI) where there are two 18-hole courses on a beautiful property. The north course is more open and easier with some elevation, but not nearly as much as the south course, which is also a lot more difficult.

I felt like my rounds 1 and 2 (Saturday, north course) and round 3 (Sunday, south course) were me playing at my potential and doing fine. Then the air let out of the balloon for round 4 and I shot my worst-ever rated round in 24 years of sanctioned play.

I came back from lunch and found myself tight all throughout my core, lower back, and my usual bad left hip. I hobbled. Couldn't shake it, and also couldn't throw hard at all. Found myself in the schule a lot. The only thing that didn't really suffer too badly was putting, but that's what I do.

I remembered that this also happened to me at both of these events last year at age 48.

I couldn't help but wonder if this happened to anybody else playing either MA-40 or MA-50 both days at 2022 and/or 2021's Meyer Broadway NADGT events.

There were a total of six participants who played both days in either 2022 or 2021 (all MA-40), and I was the only one who did it both years. It turns out that everybody who played on both days did worse in their 4th round than their 3rd. 4 out of the 6 participants had their worst round of the whole weekend for that 4th round. Nobody's 4th round was better than 3rd best out of 4.

Here are the round ratings of all participants, both years.

2022 (north course, then south course)
Me: 900, 917, 906, 822
"JK": 872, 850, 841, 835
"BA": 829, 837, 854, 835

2021 (south course, then north course)
Me: 927, 927, 921, 866
"JS": 866, 927, 948, 907
"TL": 878, 878, 880, 744

To be fair, the differences between BA's rounds don't vary enough to be significant. He played essentially the same all weekend. You could say that JK's difference was small, but it's interesting to see a 1 or 2 stroke slide between each of the rounds.

The rest of us really tanked between rounds 3 and 4. I remember that both JS and TL had gotten hurt somewhere in their legs over the course of that final round. It was stiffness and fatigue for me for both years.

The point of all this? For one, I am done playing back-to-back tourneys where I'm going to play a fourth round in two days.

Second, maybe a good discussion to have is holding age-protected amateur tournaments with just one round? Yes, this includes juniors, especially the younger ones, like MJ-12 and younger. My son has played in a couple of Eagles' Wings regional juniors tourneys (Holland, MI) which are just 1 round and it's fantastic..

I played in a 1-round flex start c-tier a couple of years ago and loved how it was done after one round. In fact, I won the MA-40 division that day out of 5 or 6 of us and the round rating was tied for the best I've had since coming back to play as an old guy. Strangely enough, though, it's tied with a two-round, one-day event at Flip City, where I also shot a pair of 935's. I can't fathom coming back to play a second day of 2 rounds there!! (Meyer Broadway south has comparable elevation.)

Thoughts?

 

[Central Scrutinizer]

I dug up one other back-to-back tourney situation here in town, the Kzoo Championship at Robert Morris, followed by the Parchment Championship at Spring Valley (which has 24 holes). Short tees at both, most of which are fairly easy.

I have six MA-40 or MA-50 participants in 2021 who played them both.

MA-40
"DN" 951, 951, 943, 932
"JD" 924, 964, 954, 965 (Hooray!)
"LF" 951, 857, 911, 879

MA-50
"CN" 856, 856, 954, 825
"RW" 856, 789, 868, 814
"KV" 749, 776, 793, 782

Here we see JD as the only participant out of 12 in the sample size I've encountered thus far who did better in round 4 than he did round 3. He's a super good am masters player in this area (and a great guy, like every one of these guys), so if anybody would pull this off, I'm not surprised he did.

 

[ray1970]

I'm MA50.

I can do two rounds in a day or one round a day over a three or four day period. Back to back two round days would be rough on the body.

That being said, putting together four solid rounds over three days would likely be difficult and I could easily see having one round that was a little off, especially if you weren't feeling very chipper that round.

 

[ru4por]

I am an out of shape 58 year old. I get it. I would argue that many 49 year olds will struggle in the third round, where you might not. Any qualms here are personalized by your age, athleticism and conditioning. Coming off a winter that I added 15 pounds, I can definitively state the weight cost me my first A Tier win of the year. I had a three stroke lead going into the third and final round on Sunday. I was tired, sore and stiff for that round and lost by two. Early releases, low shots, poor footwork and a decrease in concentration plagued that round. But that is ALL on me, I need to train and exercise to win. Nobody's Fault but Mine.

I am absolutely against limiting holes or rounds for old guys. I will not address juniors. I am all for being in better shape and the advantage going to those who train and exercise for success. I want tournaments to be a weekend test. If that is too much I want my B Tier tests to be two rounds. I also want Worlds to be 6+ rounds over 4+ days. I think they should be a physical contest as well as a mental one.

Just my opinion, but I feel your pain brother.

 

[timothy42b]

I keep in good shape for my age (69) and think my body would hold up.
Concentration? not a chance. That's what goes first for me.

 

[ray1970]

Concentration? not a chance. That's what goes first for me.

Not sure if it the exact same thing you are talking about but I know if I string together a few good rounds I can become complacent. In other words, I've been playing so well that I am maybe feeling overconfident that I can continue such good play without actually having to pay attention to what I'm doing.

 

[Central Scrutinizer]

I am an out of shape 58 year old. I get it. I would argue that many 49 year olds will struggle in the third round, where you might not. Any qualms here are personalized by your age, athleticism and conditioning. Coming off a winter that I added 15 pounds, I can definitively state the weight cost me my first A Tier win of the year. I had a three stroke lead going into the third and final round on Sunday. I was tired, sore and stiff for that round and lost by two. Early releases, low shots, poor footwork and a decrease in concentration plagued that round. But that is ALL on me, I need to train and exercise to win. Nobody's Fault but Mine.

I am absolutely against limiting holes or rounds for old guys. I will not address juniors. I am all for being in better shape and the advantage going to those who train and exercise for success. I want tournaments to be a weekend test. If that is too much I want my B Tier tests to be two rounds. I also want Worlds to be 6+ rounds over 4+ days. I think they should be a physical contest as well as a mental one.

Just my opinion, but I feel your pain brother.

Fair enough. It's going to be my responsibility to choose tourneys that suit my strengths, and if there are back-to-back B-tiers at 2 rounds each, going forward I'm going to choose the course I like better and just play one of them.

I'm in decent shape actually, just not certain parts of my muscular-skeletal system. I work in a vending machine warehouse and lift stuff all day long on my feet. My nearly 10-hour shift Monday after that 3rd and 4th round was way tougher than that 4th round!!

 

[DavidSauls]

1-round tournaments have several drawbacks, including the question of whether they're worth the travel time to only play 1 round.

My knees have finally given out but until a year or two ago, in my early 60s, I could play 4 rounds with little drop-off, even on a grueling course. And I'm not in great shape. (Time commitment for a full weekend, on the other hand, became an issue).

But what I hope to see, as the number of tournaments continues to explode, is more variety in the offerings -- 4-round weekends, 1-round flex-starts, and everything in between. No one system is going to work for everyone.

 

[ru4por]

Fair enough. It's going to be my responsibility to choose tourneys that suit my strengths, and if there are back-to-back B-tiers at 2 rounds each, going forward I'm going to choose the course I like better and just play one of them.

I'm in decent shape actually, just not certain parts of my muscular-skeletal system. I work in a vending machine warehouse and lift stuff all day long on my feet. My nearly 10-hour shift Monday after that 3rd and 4th round was way tougher than that 4th round!!

This all day. Absolutely. I choose my tournaments based on course, drive time, calendar, who is playing, depth of field, TD and potential for points. Fortunately around me and probably you too, we have the ability to chose from a wide variety of events. We have a core of a few handfuls of 50+ and 60+ that communicate and annually play certain events, in this corner of the state. Usually those that cater to the old guys. Early tee off, close starting holes, short tee pads.... There was a group on DGS that tried to identify geezer friendly events and encourage a bunch of us to reward that with participation. The benefit was larger 50+ and 60+ divisions. That group has kind of fallen out of use. We are an important group to all TD and clubs, or should be.

https://www.discgolfscene.com/clubs/Michigan_Masters_and_More

 

[DavidSauls]

I'll sidebar that a few years ago I played a 4-round tournament, but the MA50s were scheduled to play only 3 rounds. Which was just as well with me. Then I tied and got into a 7-hole sudden death, finally losing at the furthest point of the course, so that and the walk back just about amounted to a 4th round anyway. Sigh.

 

[BillFleming]

I'm 62 with a bad back and I play in MA60 division. My back aches after carrying my bag, especially if I have to do two rounds in one day...much less multiple rounds in two days. I've learned to reduce my bag after the first round, I know what I'm going to throw so I take out any discs that I won't be needing to lighten up my bag. But still, two days - three rounds, my back is aching badly. But it's my choice to play those rounds.

As I get older, I have options....play only those courses where I can use a cart. Play those tournaments where there are fewer rounds - maybe one a day. Lighten my bag and only carry discs that I really need with no backup discs....instead, if I lose one I work with the ones I have. Or just accept that I'm going to ache after playing and just have fun doing the best I can.

 

[ru4por]

I'm 62 with a bad back and I play in MA60 division. My back aches after carrying my bag, especially if I have to do two rounds in one day...much less multiple rounds in two days. I've learned to reduce my bag after the first round, I know what I'm going to throw so I take out any discs that I won't be needing to lighten up my bag. But still, two days - three rounds, my back is aching badly. But it's my choice to play those rounds.

As I get older, I have options....play only those courses where I can use a cart. Play those tournaments where there are fewer rounds - maybe one a day. Lighten my bag and only carry discs that I really need with no backup discs....instead, if I lose one I work with the ones I have. Or just accept that I'm going to ache after playing and just have fun doing the best I can.

Preach brother.

Ice, stretching, Motrin, a hot tub, rest, smart food and keep the post round Oberon to three.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

Preaching to the choir here, hear... haha. Timely post.

I've hit a rough patch, put on some weight (20lbs) after losing about 15lbs in the pandemic (Limited store trips = less junk food)... I work all day on my feet, bust my back tradesman style, knees are getting bad... I'm paying for my bad form and overthrowing 10-15yrs back. My form has fallen apart in the last 6 months, horribly. Haha

I cringe at the epic tourneys, I can do two rounds on a long course but back to back on the weekend for 4 and I probably will pass on it. I hate to say it but the pain (and sucking) take some of the joy out of it.

It's weird to round this corner, me an my old dog practically lived at the disc golf course after 4pm and we wouldn't leave in until dark. I'm only 45 FFS. I feel like a little shine is wearing off the sport for me. I enjoy doubles more than ever though .

The tourney 24disc bag is relegated to practice, long live a nutsac with 6-8 discs. Tactical decisions help. I guess if there is no shortage of people signing up there is no reason to change the schedule. I don't believe in one round tourneys, it caters to the locals who already know how to throw it and gives you no chance at redemption. However if there's two courses, one long and one short I would happily play two short and one long in MA40 +. Let those young folks play two on the longs and two on the shorts. I don't know many guys 50+ that can throw much over 300..

That being said I got carded with my buddy John Anthony last time at the long ball golf course for a tourney (horning in on my div) and he whupped me, he's 60+ I believe and got me by 8 strokes and we throw the same distance. Great guy, really enjoyed the round.... But I got schooled.

I look at these fine older gentlemen and think "whatam I complaining about!" And "I sure hope I'm still playing in 15-20yrs."

What were we talking about?

 

[autocrosscrx]

I just started tourneys last month. I'm 43 and feel like I'm in good shape. I've also lost 20 lbs over the last 5 or so months, in part because of disc golf. The flip side of that is that I'm 140 lbs, so my loaded bag and a stool is over 10% of my body weight. I also have 2 plates and 6 screws in my leg and associated knee/hip/back problems. Two rounds with all the things associated with tournaments on a long course about cooked me. Especially the one a few weeks ago where we hit 90 degrees and I shot +19 in the second round on an 8,000 foot layout with steep elevation. It was 32k steps for 2 rounds. I actually played 27 the next day, but it was later in the evening, and very casually on sub 2k foot 9 holer. I don't think I'd want to have to play another round the next morning on a long layout and I'm not sure I could play 2.

We have an Ironman tourney this summer at The Claytons. 3 rounds in 1 day. I don't think I could swing that even if I want to.

With that said, I don't think 1 round tournaments appeal to me. I didn't get into the Tennessee States, but I hope to play a round a day tourney soon to see what that is like.

 

[Central Scrutinizer]

Yeah, the more I think about one round tourneys, one thing sticks out to me. You play that round, then you don't get that second round where you're carded with others near your score and the ensuing friendly competition.

One day of two rounds, even on a hilly course, still works for me. I did great at Flip City last year on Father's Day. Cart and all. A second straight day of that at Flip City would be absurd now. 1999? I played 4 rounds in one day at DeLaveaga. Edit: I still bag a Soft Magnet I bought that day that works magically for short distance turnover wizardry!

 

[biscoe]

I like one round events for convenience/quick competition fix.

One round a day over multiple days is fine if the course is huge.

I dislike multi-day events where I play one round a day on courses that would allow for 2.

 

[thecandydan]

Thoughts?

You're preaching to the choir with me, disc golf is supposed to be fun. My son & I generally favor one round events although less because of physical issues and more because two round events around here last from dawn to dusk and take up an entire day.

Also, when disc golf was in its infancy and two rounds became the norm most of the courses were shorter and easier. Pros come to Idlewild now and play one round of 18 holes (like they do everywhere on the DGPT). We threw KY State Dubs at Idlewild last year and it's two rounds of 24 holes. He was so tired after one round that he left the bag in the car and played the second round with four discs (his day went from drudgery to fun after that). That's another thing that's changed, players weren't carrying heavily loaded bags as often back then.

No complaints from me, plenty of variety in local events so it's easy to pick and choose what you want to play.

 

[runningDoc]

i'm down for just one round tournaments as an option..

i'm an in shape mp40 player who can handle 4 rounds in two days but it's more of a time commitment issue for me. im not excited about spending a whole day (or even worse a whole weekend) playing disc golf with random people and having to pay for it.

the majority of the time i've played tournaments have been great and i've made life long friends with new cardmates, but the 10% of the time you'll get carded with real d bags or the weather is terrible and now you just paid time and money to endure it.

the one round tournaments i've joined have been the best compromise. it's at most only a 3hr round and you can still do something before/after the round…. brunch with the wife before… catch the afternoon football game after… etc.

 

[Dcinmd]

Oh it happens to me all of the time, to the point my significant other keeps on preaching to me about playing two day or back to back events.

"I told you so"... lol

Sometimes it can happen in a single day, great first round and tank the second.

At 51, my knees are in poor shape which then effects the hamstrings and hips then move to the lower back.

Good news is last week a got a cortisone shot in both knees, first time since Feb of 2020. They feel like a million bucks atm. And I am down 10 pound from 2019. Looking forward to the 3 day A-tier tournament this weekend.

From my last back to back adventure last Nov, on a shorter course but 22 holes with a fair amount of elevation.

Day 1 MA50
72 = 862
72 = 862

Day 2 MA40
65 = 933 (tied for the lead)
74 = 873 (No longer in the lead : ( ). Went +9 thru a 6 hole stretch to finish +8 for the round. No legs

 

[timothy42b]

Not sure if it the exact same thing you are talking about but I know if I string together a few good rounds I can become complacent. In other words, I've been playing so well that I am maybe feeling overconfident that I can continue such good play without actually having to pay attention to what I'm doing.

Some years back - quite a few I guess - I attended a clinic by Willie Mosconi. I wasn't a serious pool player but when someone of that caliber comes to your area you don't miss it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willie_Mosconi

He told us he doesn't practice, he just plays matches. He said he already knew how to shoot pool, no need to practice the physical skills, but he only had so much concentration, and he needed to save it for the actual competition.