"Fun Factor" in hole design

[DoWork]

Nice, Chuck. Though I'm thinking of fun as separate from challenge. Of course, everyone's taste and idea of fun are different.

But sometimes you see a holes that's reasonably short with a big elevation drop---many shots will make a run at the basket. It's fun to watch, and do; much for fun than an equally-aceable level hole. The scoring spread isn't much---lots of 2s or 3s---but it's fun.

I haven't played the hole in the chicken house, but I imagine it might have a fun factor, beyond what it would if a tornado removed the structure and just left it flat and straight.

Hampton Park, the former annual temp course in Charleston, SC, had a hole that teed between two massive live oak branches; over a cement pond with a 30' water fountain in the center, to the basket. I'm not sure what the scoring spread was, but it was a blast to throw.

I'm inclined to think a course can be forgiven for a couple of high-fun, poor-scoring spread holes. Of course, the best holes are both fun and competitive, but all holes can't be the best.

We have a hole like that (#15) at Magic. It's a 600' downhill that gains probably 100+' in elevation right down a ski trail. It's got a crazy view and lots of potential for wind gusts, as your disc is in the air for what seems like 3 minutes sometimes. It is SO MUCH FUN to throw from 15 because there's just so much air between you and the basket- I've seen 700' neutral putters thrown and I've seen mega os drivers get picked up by the wind and thrown over the trees lol... you never know what you're gonna get or have to throw based on conditions. It's just so dynamic of a hole but so simple and beautiful, it definitely embodies what I consider to be the fun factor or the wow factor. Even people who don't disc golf go there to sit and take in the view.

https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=69947&stc=1&d=1574251929

 

[Casey 1988]

So then what is a poorly executed hole, something short and open but not please try the ace run short so in the mid 200 foot range to 375 foot length that is a easy par 3 that if the hole is then in the mid 200 to no more then 300 foot open hole should be a par 2 as even unskilled players do not often miss more then getting a 3 on that unless very windy whatever that is for the player.

 

[DavidSauls]

I have a very subjective definition of a bad hole: it's one I don't enjoy playing. This usually falls into one of two categories:

(1) Boring holes, where the score is almost always the same, and there's nothing special about the throw. In particular, an open flat shot of such length that I can rarely get a 2, but almost always get a 3.

(2) Luck holes, where the width or shape of the fairway mean a good score is more a result of good fortune than good execution. Holes that, even if I get lucky and get a birdie, I didn't enjoy it.

 

[Casey 1988]

I have a very subjective definition of a bad hole: it's one I don't enjoy playing. This usually falls into one of two categories:

(1) Boring holes, where the score is almost always the same, and there's nothing special about the throw. In particular, an open flat shot of such length that I can rarely get a 2, but almost always get a 3.

(2) Luck holes, where the width or shape of the fairway mean a good score is more a result of good fortune than good execution. Holes that, even if I get lucky and get a birdie, I didn't enjoy it.

You said the first one better then I could.
the second type, I am not as good as others on this site so I do not want to say a particular hole is luck based but the obvious ones that are luck based in a poke and pray or in a you will go ob or have disc lost over water more often then not for 90% of all disc golfers excluding the top 10% players unless the design of course holes is needed for those top 10% in big top level NT/PT tournaments.

 

[BogeyNoMore]

(1) Boring holes, where the score is almost always the same, and there's nothing special about the throw. In particular, an open flat shot of such length that I can rarely get a 2, but almost always get a 3.

It's amazing how a few (and I literally mean very few), well-placed, old growth trees can keep a hole from falling into this category... by creating some likelihood of scoring a 4.

I can't believe I'm saying this but...
trees (and the cousins bushes and shrubs) make DG worth playing.

 

[DavidSauls]

It's amazing how a few (and I literally mean very few), well-placed, old growth trees can keep a hole from falling into this category... by creating some likelihood of scoring a 4.

I can't believe I'm saying this but...
trees (and the cousins bushes and shrubs) make DG worth playing.

Alas, we don't always have those old growth trees available....and aren't patient enough to wait for them.

But you're right about the trees. We need them. We curse them. We love them. We complain about them.

In short, we're married to them.

 

[Monocacy]

We have a few of those on our course. We call them "decision trees".

For the most part, they don't involve tee shots, but fairways shots on higher-par holes. This means you want your drive to not just land in the fairway, but in the sweet spot of the fairway to make the second shot easier.

Which, to me, is the fun of par 4s & 5s---that second shot is always a bit different, so you can't play it over and over and know exactly what to throw; and the better the drive, the easier the second shot, while a not-quite-perfect drive means a more challenging second shot. . . .

Yes, this is exactly what I like about some of my favorite holes. A new adventure every time you play so it never gets boring.

 

[Casey 1988]

Yes, this is exactly what I like about some of my favorite holes. A new adventure every time you play so it never gets boring.

I agree as this is why one of my favoriet holes at Powerhouse Ally in Oahe Downstream State Park is this way, also I made that hole. The dead limb that was there for 10 years was gone in 2017 but none the less the hole is still difficult for a short hole due to all the OB right near the basket but not so close as to make the hole too difficult for a player that is not super good at disc golf. More like bike path and a fence make the hole challenging and sometimes the fence is OB others the road 6 feet past the grass is the OB depending on the level of tournament.

That is hole number 16 with short B tee being 301 feet and the main A tee being 357 feet.

 

[BryanC]

We have a hole like that (#15) at Magic. It's a 600' downhill that gains probably 100+' in elevation right down a ski trail. It's got a crazy view and lots of potential for wind gusts, as your disc is in the air for what seems like 3 minutes sometimes. It is SO MUCH FUN to throw from 15 because there's just so much air between you and the basket- I've seen 700' neutral putters thrown and I've seen mega os drivers get picked up by the wind and thrown over the trees lol... you never know what you're gonna get or have to throw based on conditions. It's just so dynamic of a hole but so simple and beautiful, it definitely embodies what I consider to be the fun factor or the wow factor. Even people who don't disc golf go there to sit and take in the view.

https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=69947&stc=1&d=1574251929

What course are you talking about? There appear to be two courses called Magic Mountain that are at ski resorts. One in Vermont and one in Idaho. The hole 15 that you describe looks pretty fun to me!

 

[DoWork]

What course are you talking about? There appear to be two courses called Magic Mountain that are at ski resorts. One in Vermont and one in Idaho. The hole 15 that you describe looks pretty fun to me!

This is the one in VT.

We have several big downhills but 15 is my favorite, as it's the first downhill after working your way uphill on 11-14, and it's the biggest view. The basket is down in the middle of that clump of birches (pic included), behind a gigantic rock. It's such a fun hole!

DGCR isn't letting me attach pics right now, sorry about that.