Installing tee pads

[Dan Ensor]

I'm helping install pads. I've done some concrete work, so I have some idea what's going on (I'm not the brains behind the operation, though:thmbup. But I was wondering what things should be kept in mind when installing pads. Things I'm thinking about are how to put a pad in on a slope (dig it, build it up, or dig half to build the other half?), and how to finish it. I'm sure there are other things I wouldn't even know to think about, though.

... specific questions are nice, I guess

-How do you dig and frame pads on left-right slopes?
-Front-Back?
-Back-Front?
-What kind of texture are we looking for on the finish? Just broom finished, or do we want to knock that down a little after it's broomed?
-If something needs built up, can we just put fill underneath it, or does it need to be more substantial?
-When is it time to be concerned with erosion?
-How many questions am I forgetting to ask?

 

[attik34]

I'll throw in a question for our project.

-Does anyone have any experience with putting numbers or anything carved into the pads, and whats the easiest way to make it look good?

 

[BogeyNoMore]

Search for posts from Bultx1215 - seems this dude knows about concrete.

 

[sneakytiki]

I've heard that drawing penises in the wet cement makes for a stylish and quite comical tee pad, according to the 14 year olds at a certain unnamed park.

 

[Bultx1215]

-How do you dig and frame pads on left-right slopes?
-Front-Back?
-Back-Front?
-What kind of texture are we looking for on the finish? Just broom finished, or do we want to knock that down a little after it's broomed?
-If something needs built up, can we just put fill underneath it, or does it need to be more substantial?
-When is it time to be concerned with erosion?
-How many questions am I forgetting to ask?

How much you dig depends on how much slope you want on the tee. Forms can match any slope, so they aren't the deciding factor, nor do you want everything perfectly level. 1" of fall in 10' is the least amount you can have so it will drain properly. A pic of the area would help greatly.

Texture you want is a medium to medium rough broom finish. You MUST use a synthetic fiber broom to get it, too. Natural fiber concrete brooms use horse hair and while it makes an excellent broomed finish, its too smooth for DG apps. We just has a municipality do a course here and they used horse brooms for all the pads and they are too smooth.:\

You want to float it and hit it with the broom after you only leave an 1/8" footprint....yes, you can step on it to find out, just float out all prints before you broom it. To gauge if its ok or not, if the broom is dragging up rocks or tons of sand, you are too wet. It should groove up the top layer of cement and a small amount of sand....all sand and you need to float it out and wait some more. For best results, use a straight masonry brush to splash some water on the concrete before brooming. The broom should be wet, but never dripping. Just push the broom away from you and look at it....if you have timed it right, another pass, pulling to you will finish it off nicely. If you like what you get with the first pass, fine, pull the broom off. Overlap the passes by at least 4-6".

You will want to experiment a little to see what you want...just don't take too long. Concrete waits for no one. If its too dry, splash more water on and use the broom to scrub it back and forth many times to work up the top cream...then DRAG the brush back to you only...see if that looks OK. If not, flood with water and float it vigorously and broom immediately behind with single passes, again, only pulling them to you.

Another key to keeping the broom finish like you want it is to keep everyone off the finished product for 3 days. I know everyone wants to play immediately, but all that does is knock the finish down and smooth it out. Concrete hits 75% of its strength in 3 days. After that time is when you can play.


Once you have pulled the forms, backfill all edges up to at least an inch of the top. Erosion will become an issue when it gets under your pads. Then they will need more attention.

 

[attik34]

I've heard that drawing penises in the wet cement makes for a stylish and quite comical tee pad, according to the 14 year olds at a certain unnamed park.

I was planning on using penis roman numerals for the hole numbers

 

[Pwingles]

Re: left-right slopes

Railroad ties can be used with pieces of rebar to build a wall, something for your dirt to butt up against and keep your pad level and help reduce erosion

 

[Pwingles]

I've heard that drawing penises in the wet cement makes for a stylish and quite comical tee pad, according to the 14 year olds at a certain unnamed park.

Im 29 and youre welcome

 

[Dan Ensor]

I was planning on using penis roman numerals for the hole numbers

I don't know ... they're only 5'. I don't want #18 to reflect poorly on my manlihood.

 

[Dan Ensor]

@bul
Synthetic to make to highs and lows further apart than horse hair, right? How deep do you try to broom it? I was thinking somewhere in the 1/16" range.

Do you edge your pads? Pros/Cons?

How deep do you pour them?

There are some places that we absolutely cannot go with the natural slope. From what I've gathered, I'm thinking the "right" way to do it is to build up the low side, not dig out the high side. But I'm sure that's not an absolute.


For clarity's sake, I'm just worried that we're going to be blindsided by some unforeseen challenge after the truck's been ordered.

 

[Bultx1215]

@bul
Synthetic to make to highs and lows further apart than horse hair, right? How deep do you try to broom it? I was thinking somewhere in the 1/16" range.

Do you edge your pads? Pros/Cons?

How deep do you pour them?

There are some places that we absolutely cannot go with the natural slope. From what I've gathered, I'm thinking the "right" way to do it is to build up the low side, not dig out the high side. But I'm sure that's not an absolute.


For clarity's sake, I'm just worried that we're going to be blindsided by some unforeseen challenge after the truck's been ordered.

No. Synthetic makes a more aggressive finish. Hair brooms are for a nice, smoother finish. I use poly brooms on parking lots, roads, driveways and places that get heavy wear or require lots of traction. Horse brooms make for great broom finish sidewalks, patios, etc....places that you could walk barefoot for example.

How deep is however deep the broom goes with its own weight into the cream (top) layer. 1/16or a tad deeper is fine...the key is to watch for rocks and for it pulling all the sand up. That is too deep and too wet. Float that out and wait a bit.

All concrete flat work should be edged at forms, no exceptions. Gives a better look and allows easier removal of forms. Before you broom it, take your water brush, wet it, shake it out and use it to broom all the edges. Just run it parallel to the forms. The big broom will straighten the pattern out. That way, you won't get any shiny spots...everything will be nice and uniformly broomed. Use a 1/2" radius edger. The box store 1/4" edgers make for a crappy edge.

No need to go over 4" in depth for the most part. If you have an edge that looks like it could wash out easily, you can deepen that edge3-6" deeper and a shovel wide. 4" will give you 2" cover top and bottom for your rebar or mesh. That is perfect.

You can build up the low side easier most of the time. Just be sure to compact everything. A vibratory plate will do it easily. If you are building up more than just a few inches, you will want to use something other than just dirt, unless your dirt is super stable, meaning extremely low or zero clay content. Always overbuild your buildups. I would go out away from the tee pad about 3-4 feet before I started sloping it back down to natural grade. Makes the area more stable, prevents washouts and bad fall edge for those with long follow throughs.

 

[Bultx1215]

Two things I forgot. Once you pour the pad, before anything is done, take a hammer and tap the sides of the forms. This will help settle the edge and take out some of the air pockets. After you screed or strike it off, you will want to use a jitterbug or tamper on it. You can rent these if someone doesn't have it. They knock the rocks down deep, leaving you a mostly rock free cream layer on top to work with. After its jitterbugged, then you start your floating.

 

[Bultx1215]

FWIW, here is a thread on finishing I did a while back. May give you some clues about what I am rambling about.


http://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8678&highlight=concrete+101

 

[Dan Ensor]

Ok. Sounds about like I thought it would be. Pouring will be cake. Getting everything ready sounds like a nightmare. Good luck Attik


Ok ... so if we fill one side, we need to feather it out several feet before sloping it back to grade. If we dig one side out, do we need to dig it out for several feet before going back to grade?

 

[sneakytiki]

Im 29 and youre welcome

29, with the sense of humor of two 14 and a half year olds. I love it.

 

[Bultx1215]

Ok ... so if we fill one side, we need to feather it out several feet before sloping it back to grade. If we dig one side out, do we need to dig it out for several feet before going back to grade?

Pretty much. You don't want to crowd the tee pad...being that its a runway/launch pad. If it was a patio or something, you could crowd it a bit and simply build a retaining wall to either contain the hill or contain the fill. Some like to run through on their initial drives. With either a wall on the back or a drop off up front, it could get a little dangerous.


Don't forget to backfill after the forms are pulled. Halfway up the concrete at minimum and no higher than an inch from the top. Keeps the tripping down and protects the lower edge from washout.

 

[Redmones12]

Talk to your local electricity company they pull out a lot of old poles that are soaked in creosote which make for amazingly long lasting walls to support your pads. The trick to a pad is try not to dig deeper then you have to otherwise you will need to compact the ground, and a hand tamper won't do you need a power tamper for under concrete if you can't try only filling with pea stone gravel. Also be super careful about leveling your pads an in level pad by more then an inch over 10ft could make for a weaker pad. We couldn't get a concrete truck for the pads we poured at Merrill park in hamburg so we mixed ours by hand with 3/2/1. 3 parts gravel/2 parts sand/1 part Portland cement the advance to this was if we thought the pad might be driven on or at risk we could up the Portland to increase its strength. We also spoke to a local well drilling company for used 1" pipe for our retaining wall stakes they have us 30+ 15ft sections of used steel pipe and then we spoke to a concrete company and they donated $600 worth of rebar for our pads in the woods which we put into H patterns so if a tree falls the pads should survive. Your best friend in pad construction is pea stone gravel especially if you are worried about soft ground.