Is THIS what we want?

[txmxer]

This is a perfect example of why we can't have nice things (or a reasonable discussion about DG and course design elements).

 

[Hampstead]

????

 

[txmxer]

For those that care about the pro game (which is a small subsection of those using the courses and buying the equipment) one of the biggest draws is that the pros are using exactly the same equipment from discs to bags to shoes to baskets. This is why the ratings system was such a stroke of genius that creates such buy in to the lower level players. On any given day in competition you can see how you would have fared against the best. Change one bit of that formula and you change all.

This is wisdom.

 

[DavidSauls]

Anyway, the real reason for the post is to comment on the artificial bunker in use at Goat Hill. It was a row of large potted bushes/plants, held in place by some kind of larger landscaping bricks. I thought it was a nice take on the mozzarella sticks. Obviously, not a part of course design, but a nice way to spruce up a course for the pros. Trying to stay on topic in this thread. What thinks some of the golfers here?

Didn't see them, but I don't see much distinction between using a pre-existing feature, and adding features that would play exactly the same. Other than aesthetics.

 

[DoWork]

This is a perfect example of why we can't have nice things (or a reasonable discussion about DG and course design elements).

To be fair, most of us are having a very reasonable discussion and the rest is harmless/hilarious enough.

 

[ru4por]

I was pleased to see that feature. I'm surprised that this is the first time I've seen it, as it seems like some sort of potted shrubbery would be the first temp feature that would come to mind when attempting to add a guardian to a basket. Perhaps keeping them watered is too much of a challenge on most courses.

The issue that I have with "mozzarella sticks" is they frequently seem to be installed in such a way as they provide almost no impact on play. The round treated posts that are sometimes used look nice enough, but unless they are combined together, or not much more than a disc width apart, they simply aren't wide enough. I recall USDGC combined 5+ of them to replace a dead guardian tree on one hole in 2019, and that seems to work well. The other hole where they had scattered single posts, they just didn't provide enough of an obstacle. Same with the obstacle from the OP of this thread, but also butt ugly.

An aside: Based on commentary, I think it might have been Philo, I don't think the Goat Hill feature was added for putting, but rather to close off an easier line to the basket from the tee, blocking some ground play.

Every year we buy a spruce or arborvitae to put on the front porch and toss some Christmas lights on. We then put the shrub away in the garage and make it dormant. We then plant the shrug in the yard in the spring.

I hope that is the idea at Goat Hill. Make use of these shrubs for the pro event and them use them as landscaping on the golf course.

It just makes too much sense. I too thought the shrubs were to alter the drives, not the putts. Seems to have worked for the FPO side. Sorry, that is all I watched.

 

[ru4por]

To be fair, most of us are having a very reasonable discussion and the rest is harmless/hilarious enough.

If you block OMD, this is a great discussion. :thmbup:

 

[txmxer]

To be fair, most of us are having a very reasonable discussion and the rest is harmless/hilarious enough.

It was a weak attempt at humor.

It is harmless in the big scheme, but it gets old as this thing comes in waves. In 3 months OMD will be claiming all the top designers support the small baskets (again).

 

[Innova63]

Since I have OMD blocked, I am moderately curious, has he started arguing with Chuck K or John H?

 

[DavidSauls]

Since I have OMD blocked, I am moderately curious, has he started arguing with Chuck K or John H?

He cited an article by Houck to support his case, and by extension that the top designers agreed with him, but the article said nothing of the sort (as Biscoe pointed out), and Houck showed up to say the same.

So not so much an argument, but just another point refuted.

 

[araytx]

To sum up the topic.

-We have only 15% that like the current trend of disc golf course design in general (poop sticks/raised baskets/miles of rope/baskets placed on top of mounds/etc.).

-We have the best course designers in the world in favor of making putting challenging for the pro players by changing to a smaller/different target.

-We have almost all the top pro's and many am's as well wanting a change to start at least on the top level.

-We have 3 bots and 2 novice trolls on DGCR against the idea.

Give it up dude. Baskets are not changing anytime soon for the pro's. They are too busy rolling in money to do anything about it. It'll be a couple years I think before anything could happen. No need to worry about seeing a pro miss a 20 footer yet.

I guess I do not see how those two statements OMD espoused continually don't contradict one another. They seem antithetical to me.

On top of "not any time soon" and "a couple years" also seemingly contradictory. Is he trying to make a circular argument?

 

[DavidSauls]

"Rolling in money" yet "wanting a change" is a rare situation.

 

[Hampstead]

OMD just wants attention. Consistency of thought be damned.

 

[oldmandiscer]

No one is arguing that statement. What we fail to understand is how you can not see the fallacy of all your other arguments having taken that statement into account.

A basic tenet of capitalism is demand driving innovation. If the manufacturers, of which I'm one, don't feel the need for the innovation, chances are there isn't the demand. You can of course prove me/us wrong by incorporating the Skinny Perfect for Pro's Disc Golf Basket company and test the market demand.

I wouldn't personally invest in it but there is at least one other in this thread that might.

McBeth should have been the one to have done it. Cam Todd was years ago on the smaller basket train, but since then I think McBeth maybe along with Uli to some extent have taken the torch (as far as the big name pro's anyways).

Cam Todd even did develop his own smaller basket, but I don't know the full story behind it. Wether it was ever PDGA certified or what, never looked that far into it.

 

[oldmandiscer]

For those that care about the pro game (which is a small subsection of those using the courses and buying the equipment) one of the biggest draws is that the pros are using exactly the same equipment from discs to bags to shoes to baskets. This is why the ratings system was such a stroke of genius that creates such buy in to the lower level players. On any given day in competition you can see how you would have fared against the best. Change one bit of that formula and you change all.

Some truth to that, which is why McBeth makes what he does. But at the same time we already have 50 other basket designs out there and usually are different week to week. Though not as drastic as a spec change.

So whats one more or a dozen more designs? I say let the market decide, the PDGA specs are outdated.

 

[oldmandiscer]

I guess I do not see how those two statements OMD espoused continually don't contradict one another. They seem antithetical to me.

On top of "not any time soon" and "a couple years" also seemingly contradictory. Is he trying to make a circular argument?

Two years is not anytime soon. Manufacturers can't even keep up with making discs now. They have no reason to make a change. So yeah I think at least a couple years/not anytime soon.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Perhaps narrowing the type of discs allowed for elite play to putterish rim configurations would increase the number of putts? Then, every throw would be a putt. You would get even more scoring separation since even fewer players could reach the distances the elite players can throw with rounder rimmed discs.

 

[ejvogie]

Perhaps narrowing the type of discs allowed for elite play to putterish rim configurations would increase the number of putts? Then, every throw would be a putt. You would get even more scoring separation since even fewer players could reach the distances the elite players can throw with rounder rimmed discs.

Cap them at a speed 4? opcorn:

 

[Cgkdisc]

Cap them at a speed 4? opcorn:

Probably need a spec that includes rim config and disc height.

 

[oldmandiscer]

Perhaps narrowing the type of discs allowed for elite play to putterish rim configurations would increase the number of putts? Then, every throw would be a putt. You would get even more scoring separation since even fewer players could reach the distances the elite players can throw with rounder rimmed discs.

Disc manufacturers would never go for that. They sell Destroyers and Zueses because of the newbies see the pros throw them. Disc manufacturers would rather all events switch to cones or tones then limit their highest selling discs.