Frank Delicious
Banned
- Joined
- Mar 23, 2006
- Messages
- 16,244
Why does this thread keep name changing?
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veganray said:PDGA-sanctioned events are provided liability insurance by the PDGA, a (maybe the) non-trivial benefit of sanctioning, unless you are one of those deluded souls that believe that the mathematically-bankrupt ratings system is worth more than teats on a bull.
Working Stiff said:That being said, the PDGA isn't driving anything. The local clubs are the organizations that are attracting new players, and a higher % of them simply won't join the PDGA. Local clubs will get stronger, the PDGA will get weaker. That really doesn't scare me. Back in the day around 50% of the St. Louis Club belonged to the PDGA. That number is more like 20% now even with hosting an A tier that forces you to be a member to participate in. To me as the sport grows the PDGA becomes less relevant. If the PDGA wants to do things to speed up a process that is already happening, more power to them.
JHBlader86 said:As much as I'd like to see an ADGA, I think we first need to work our way from the ground up and form an Amateur Committee within the PDGA that focuses on Ams needs by helping to create either regional Amateur Tours, or helping to promote Amateur only events, and attracting sponsors for Am only events. It would be pretty sweet though to see different regions with an amateur tour to help promote the sport alongside the pros National Tour.
JR said:JHBlader86 said:As much as I'd like to see an ADGA, I think we first need to work our way from the ground up and form an Amateur Committee within the PDGA that focuses on Ams needs by helping to create either regional Amateur Tours, or helping to promote Amateur only events, and attracting sponsors for Am only events. It would be pretty sweet though to see different regions with an amateur tour to help promote the sport alongside the pros National Tour.
If a split is some day deemed to be necessary a committee may be a good step if it is made up of the people that will form/run the ADGA initially so that they get experience. I'm not sure if the PDGA wants them to gain contacts to prospective sponsors though.
JHBlader86 said:JR said:JHBlader86 said:As much as I'd like to see an ADGA, I think we first need to work our way from the ground up and form an Amateur Committee within the PDGA that focuses on Ams needs by helping to create either regional Amateur Tours, or helping to promote Amateur only events, and attracting sponsors for Am only events. It would be pretty sweet though to see different regions with an amateur tour to help promote the sport alongside the pros National Tour.
If a split is some day deemed to be necessary a committee may be a good step if it is made up of the people that will form/run the ADGA initially so that they get experience. I'm not sure if the PDGA wants them to gain contacts to prospective sponsors though.
The split shouldnt be one where the ADGA and the PDGA are trying to compete against one another. The two organizations should simply be about working to promote the sport for their respective targets. The best solution, although still not possible at the moment, would be if the PDGA were able to create branches throughout the country instead of just one centralized location. If we had a PDGA North, South, East, West then we wouldnt have near as many issues as we do now.
JR said:JHBlader86 said:JR said:JHBlader86 said:As much as I'd like to see an ADGA, I think we first need to work our way from the ground up and form an Amateur Committee within the PDGA that focuses on Ams needs by helping to create either regional Amateur Tours, or helping to promote Amateur only events, and attracting sponsors for Am only events. It would be pretty sweet though to see different regions with an amateur tour to help promote the sport alongside the pros National Tour.
If a split is some day deemed to be necessary a committee may be a good step if it is made up of the people that will form/run the ADGA initially so that they get experience. I'm not sure if the PDGA wants them to gain contacts to prospective sponsors though.
The split shouldnt be one where the ADGA and the PDGA are trying to compete against one another. The two organizations should simply be about working to promote the sport for their respective targets. The best solution, although still not possible at the moment, would be if the PDGA were able to create branches throughout the country instead of just one centralized location. If we had a PDGA North, South, East, West then we wouldnt have near as many issues as we do now.
I'm just afraid that from a sponsor point of view we're gonna seem like two smaller groups that are separate and thus less interesting source of revenue. And I'm not so sure that the ADGA/PDGA operation would run so smoothly thanks to partially different and potentially conflicting needs. What would the reason of creating ADGA be if there wasn't a problem currently because the PDGA is spread too thin? My opinion. There remains a lot to do and the staff ain't large enough IMO to exploit every opportunity. I just think that a split would divert too much power and staff to different activities at a time when there's too much on the plate already. Could the PDGA do better with the current resources? Yes just like any organization. But IMO the PDGA should be closer to some other organizations but are there other more skilled people to be staffing the PDGA available? I have no clue about that.
Should the PDGA be doing something else or changing priorities? Quite possibly but I'm not an expert on that except sponsors outside of the sport would help. Media visibility has really really worked for Finland. Our growth rate in players is probably the highest among countries with established player base if not the highest overall growth rate has been increasing each year and now there are estimates of over 30000 players vs 15000 last year. Major newspapers have written a lot of articles so basically most if not each Finn has had an opportunity to read about the sport. Radio interviews and TV coverage? Check. Done. Maybe the Finnish Frisbee Association should be consulted. Maybe the president Sami Poimala has interesting things to say. They've made progress and had success why not learn from them?
JHBlader86 said:JR said:JHBlader86 said:JR said:JHBlader86 said:As much as I'd like to see an ADGA, I think we first need to work our way from the ground up and form an Amateur Committee within the PDGA that focuses on Ams needs by helping to create either regional Amateur Tours, or helping to promote Amateur only events, and attracting sponsors for Am only events. It would be pretty sweet though to see different regions with an amateur tour to help promote the sport alongside the pros National Tour.
If a split is some day deemed to be necessary a committee may be a good step if it is made up of the people that will form/run the ADGA initially so that they get experience. I'm not sure if the PDGA wants them to gain contacts to prospective sponsors though.
The split shouldnt be one where the ADGA and the PDGA are trying to compete against one another. The two organizations should simply be about working to promote the sport for their respective targets. The best solution, although still not possible at the moment, would be if the PDGA were able to create branches throughout the country instead of just one centralized location. If we had a PDGA North, South, East, West then we wouldnt have near as many issues as we do now.
I'm just afraid that from a sponsor point of view we're gonna seem like two smaller groups that are separate and thus less interesting source of revenue. And I'm not so sure that the ADGA/PDGA operation would run so smoothly thanks to partially different and potentially conflicting needs. What would the reason of creating ADGA be if there wasn't a problem currently because the PDGA is spread too thin? My opinion. There remains a lot to do and the staff ain't large enough IMO to exploit every opportunity. I just think that a split would divert too much power and staff to different activities at a time when there's too much on the plate already. Could the PDGA do better with the current resources? Yes just like any organization. But IMO the PDGA should be closer to some other organizations but are there other more skilled people to be staffing the PDGA available? I have no clue about that.
Should the PDGA be doing something else or changing priorities? Quite possibly but I'm not an expert on that except sponsors outside of the sport would help. Media visibility has really really worked for Finland. Our growth rate in players is probably the highest among countries with established player base if not the highest overall growth rate has been increasing each year and now there are estimates of over 30000 players vs 15000 last year. Major newspapers have written a lot of articles so basically most if not each Finn has had an opportunity to read about the sport. Radio interviews and TV coverage? Check. Done. Maybe the Finnish Frisbee Association should be consulted. Maybe the president Sami Poimala has interesting things to say. They've made progress and had success why not learn from them?
That's why we dont need a split yet, but we need a permanent committee within the PDGA to oversee amateur growth specifically through more cooperation with local clubs. I know what clubs dont like to see is the PDGA's name put on their tournaments when the PDGA staff themselves have nothing to do with the tournament other than sanctioning it. What the committee and eventual ADGA would do is to actually show real support for these local clubs through marketing and sponsorship help. The committee/ADGA would be on their phones and computers contacting businesses in the area trying to attract sponsors instead of having the local club do all the work. It takes part of the burden off the club, and it would be a true ADGA event because the ADGA personally helped grow and oversee the tournament.
wordveganray said:Every opinion here seems to favor a more sprawling, decentralized org (or orgs) to run our sport, and I couldn't disagree more. Whatever issues you have with the man (and there are many to be had), the PDGA never functioned more efficiently & sanely than when it was run by two people out of Brian Hoeniger's basement. What the org needs is not more committees, subcommittees, paid consultants, or, FSM forbid, a second org with the bloated bureaucracy (including the inevitable resource-leeching consultants & executives) that comes with it, but a leader with the sack to choose a focused course & a scaling back toward a monarchical system to allow him to implement it without having to kowtow to every special-interest group that wants a bigger piece of the extremely tiny pie. The culture of trying to please everybody all of the time, as well as allowing representatives of these 'disenfranchised' groups to dictate the course of what should be a professional organization, need to go.