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Dang BroDave that sounds horrible. I could only imagine those guys in a room together.
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Springwood Players Course extinct!
- Thread starter Tenacious EJ
- Start date
So is the course actually gone?
Tenacious EJ
Par Member
No. I live within sight of it, and know of people playing on it this morning. Thanks for reloading the older information! As a side note, due to the changes, a lot of the old pics need to be replaced. How do we go about deleting the old photos?
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Please email me (via the "Contact Us" link) and let me know what the changes are. It might be best to retire the existing page and create a new one depending on how extensive the changes are.
I'll email you a general rundown of the changes when I get a chance. The changes aren't drastic (two holes will be new since original #3 and #13 will be two holes each, hole #5 got axed are the biggies) but it might warrant a new page since the old course got off to such a rocky start.
Tenacious EJ
Par Member
It would probably be best, but I don't think all the changes have been completed yet.
avillion23
Newbie
Well, since I have been name dropped I feel the need to chime in. I don't have much of a presence on this site because I choose to disc golf more than write about it, plus with job and family there just isn't much extra time to armchair QB.
The process at Springwood has been long and tedious, it has been in talks for well over 6 months. I am not going to go into specifics or finger pointing, but I will say that the Burlington Area Disc Golf Club has been very active in planning, testing, and presenting improvements. We have held tournaments with alternate layouts and asked for feedback regarding changes. All changes that we proposed were tested, critiqued (by people that actually chose to play them), tested again and then settled. This process has kicked around 21 holes, has kicked around complete re-design, and has come up with solutions that the majority of folks involved feel are a value-add to the course and park.
I'd also like to say that the assessments from the top pros in the area probably carried a lot of weight. One pro said that he has driven by the course many times to go play others that were further from his home because it was a poor design.
As for the meeting that we had, it was quite constructive. We went hole by hole to discuss safety issues/proposed changes and went around the room for votes. And yes, I called Buzz out for his attempt at panhandling a club membership. In my defense, it was far short of the screaming tirade Dave describes but I did make sure my point was across.
We will never make everyone happy, but that's not the goal. The goal is a safer course that is fun to play, it will be both once changes are completed. Dave, I will let you know when we have some work days out there so you can pitch in, cool?
EJ, as always, thank you for being on top of things at the SPC. I will also let you know when we will be digging and moving pads if you'd like to pitch in. We will be re-starting the Glow League on January 2nd, we just got an order of club discs in (thanks to Ronnie Huffman), and we feel that we are headed in a direction that will lead to a larger organized presence in the Burlington area. 26 member and growing....
The process at Springwood has been long and tedious, it has been in talks for well over 6 months. I am not going to go into specifics or finger pointing, but I will say that the Burlington Area Disc Golf Club has been very active in planning, testing, and presenting improvements. We have held tournaments with alternate layouts and asked for feedback regarding changes. All changes that we proposed were tested, critiqued (by people that actually chose to play them), tested again and then settled. This process has kicked around 21 holes, has kicked around complete re-design, and has come up with solutions that the majority of folks involved feel are a value-add to the course and park.
I'd also like to say that the assessments from the top pros in the area probably carried a lot of weight. One pro said that he has driven by the course many times to go play others that were further from his home because it was a poor design.
As for the meeting that we had, it was quite constructive. We went hole by hole to discuss safety issues/proposed changes and went around the room for votes. And yes, I called Buzz out for his attempt at panhandling a club membership. In my defense, it was far short of the screaming tirade Dave describes but I did make sure my point was across.
We will never make everyone happy, but that's not the goal. The goal is a safer course that is fun to play, it will be both once changes are completed. Dave, I will let you know when we have some work days out there so you can pitch in, cool?
EJ, as always, thank you for being on top of things at the SPC. I will also let you know when we will be digging and moving pads if you'd like to pitch in. We will be re-starting the Glow League on January 2nd, we just got an order of club discs in (thanks to Ronnie Huffman), and we feel that we are headed in a direction that will lead to a larger organized presence in the Burlington area. 26 member and growing....
So I got to play the course today. I was even the one that first alerted the local club that the course was marked as extinct.
The tee signs and many tee pads from the oregional layout is still there so while I played the new layout, I could see what the original holes were supposed to be.
I was pretty much bored with the course by the time I got to hole 8.
The original layout was very poorly designed. Out of the 75+ courses I have played in the 13-14 years I have been playing, I can honestly say there are only a few courses that had a poorer or more unsafe layout.
This park shouldn't have had a course installed IMO. It is a very boring gold level course and the shorter pads don't bring much more enjoyment. There is very little variety in the shots. I can only recall that I hole that isn't righty friendly or neutral.
My favorite hole was hole 2. Hole 2 and hole 15 are the only 2 wooded holes and 15 isn't that wooded.
Mike was talking about making it a 21 hole layout. I'm assuming you would be breaking up the longer holes into shorter ones. Unfortunately I don't think that will make the course any better as it will be holes with an average length of 350 ft.
At least I can mark this course off of the "need to play list."
I shot a 59 playing from the blue pads. Could have been a 54 but I missed the Mando on 3 and missed several 30 ft putts for a 2 or 3.
The tee signs and many tee pads from the oregional layout is still there so while I played the new layout, I could see what the original holes were supposed to be.
I was pretty much bored with the course by the time I got to hole 8.
The original layout was very poorly designed. Out of the 75+ courses I have played in the 13-14 years I have been playing, I can honestly say there are only a few courses that had a poorer or more unsafe layout.
This park shouldn't have had a course installed IMO. It is a very boring gold level course and the shorter pads don't bring much more enjoyment. There is very little variety in the shots. I can only recall that I hole that isn't righty friendly or neutral.
My favorite hole was hole 2. Hole 2 and hole 15 are the only 2 wooded holes and 15 isn't that wooded.
Mike was talking about making it a 21 hole layout. I'm assuming you would be breaking up the longer holes into shorter ones. Unfortunately I don't think that will make the course any better as it will be holes with an average length of 350 ft.
At least I can mark this course off of the "need to play list."
I shot a 59 playing from the blue pads. Could have been a 54 but I missed the Mando on 3 and missed several 30 ft putts for a 2 or 3.
avillion23
Newbie
21 holes was just one of the ideas we had kicked around but nixed. There will be some distance changes through relocating tee pads, to make it a blue/white course. Looking forward to hearing your review once improvements are complete.
This has been my "at a distance" take on this from the beginning. The park has too many other activities and not enough unused land for a course. No matter how I look at that park, the master plan can't sustain a disc golf course. I know I'm a disc golfer and supposed to want courses everywhere, but not all parks can sustain a course. This park shouldn't even have a 9-hole pitch 'n putt IMO. An 18-holes tournament course is an unbelievable reach that I can't see any way that a design would be safe. All I could hope for is that there is some other land to move the course to, becasue the park it is in now can't sustain it.
Mike, I'd love to know what beers you drink to have these opinions, they must be good. Yall had a good opportunity to make a reasonable first impression with me and yall came across as more petty than Buzz Sharpe which is saying something. Maybe that night was an aberration of character but for now I don't like any of you. Seriously, I'm generally well-regarded by virtually everyone I know (even Buzz and I get along okay and he thinks I'm a Bolshevik buffoon). To rub me the wrong way says a lot and maybe yall would be behooved by some introspection. :|
It isn't worth my time to drive up there much anymore since yall and Sharpe want to argue over how to rearrange deck chairs on the Titanic. Hopefully the course never has a softball or soccer player wrecked by a driver because of the redesign, to pretend that yall have addressed those concerns is asinine.
Hasta luego
It isn't worth my time to drive up there much anymore since yall and Sharpe want to argue over how to rearrange deck chairs on the Titanic. Hopefully the course never has a softball or soccer player wrecked by a driver because of the redesign, to pretend that yall have addressed those concerns is asinine.
Hasta luego
Well, this has gotten interesting. 
opcorn:
I wish I had more to contribute but I still haven't played the course. Been waiting until the problems were all ironed out. Guess I'll still be waiting.
No matter what, or whose feelings may be hurt, I just hope this doesn't hurt the local disc golf scene. You don't want anything to happen that could jeopardize possible future courses in the area or even current courses because of any malcontent or poor planning.
opcorn:I wish I had more to contribute but I still haven't played the course. Been waiting until the problems were all ironed out. Guess I'll still be waiting.
No matter what, or whose feelings may be hurt, I just hope this doesn't hurt the local disc golf scene. You don't want anything to happen that could jeopardize possible future courses in the area or even current courses because of any malcontent or poor planning.
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avillion23
Newbie
Well alrighty!
Who are you?
Who are you?
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- Joined
- Jul 29, 2009
- Messages
- 15,715
Have to echo these sentiments. Having a course isn't necessarily better than no course. Shoehorning a course into area amid other activities is a disservice to disc golfers and other park goers alike. It only invites trouble and does nothing to "grow the sport" responsibly, and might possibly impede the sport.
I don't care who you are... a pro, an experienced course designer, jesus... if you think putting holes in between a soccer field and houses is a good idea for any reason you probably shouldn't have a say in course design.
I've played the original course, I've seen the proposed redesign and neither address what many have poited out to be the safety issue. Make it a 9 holer in safe parts of the park or just close it down and find somewhere else for the baskets. Just remember if somebody does get hurt out there and you were apart of keeping this course in it'll be on you just as much as anybody else.
I've played the original course, I've seen the proposed redesign and neither address what many have poited out to be the safety issue. Make it a 9 holer in safe parts of the park or just close it down and find somewhere else for the baskets. Just remember if somebody does get hurt out there and you were apart of keeping this course in it'll be on you just as much as anybody else.
Well, this has gotten interesting.
It's been interesting for a while. This may be the case where the sequel is even more entertaining than the original.
I haven't played the course, in any incarnation, only seen maps of the original design and proposed changes.
And cringed.
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Agreed the useable land is just so spread out throughout the park I can't see any 18 hole course being safely installed.
You can't design by aerial map. Or, at least, I know I can't.
Nor do I know how busy the park actually is with other activities.
But from the peanut gallery, it sure looks like a 9-hole, kid-and-family-friendly course would have been a better fit, both for the available land, and tying in with the other kid-and-family-friendly park activities.
