Theoretical Question: DG on golf course

[Peterb]

Why should the greens fees be any less than what golfers pay? I'm not the one who thought this up, but this specific issue has come up. I'm at a loss to explain it really. If you're running a golf course, why wouldn't you set a tee time for a golfer willing to pay $30 for a round rather than a disc golfer who would only pay $5 or $10. I would like to hear your thoughts on why disc golfers should be charged less. Have at it...

 

[JC17393]

One reason could be that if the course doesn't get the disc golfer revenue (no matter the price), they're not getting any additional revenue above and beyond their regular golfer clientele. In other words, they added disc golf as an attraction to increase revenue. The lower price point might be what they had to settle for to bring disc golfers out at all. $30 a round probably means zero disc golfers where as $5-10 brings them out enough to justify the expense of having the course installed.

I think it also depends on the facilities. If the disc golf course is essentially the ball golf course with baskets tucked off to the side of the regular greens, I see no reason to charge or treat the disc players any differently than the ball golfers. They're sharing the same fairways. They can't really co-exist in the sense that one group has to follow another regardless of if they're throwing a disc or hitting a ball.

On the other hand, if the disc golf course uses areas that aren't a part of the ball golf course (wooded areas between holes, etc) and there's minimal conflict between the two parties, there's no real reason to charge the same to disc golfers as ball golfers. On a busy day, they could probably put more disc golfers through the course than they can ball golfers...another reason they wouldn't need to charge the same to generate similar revenue. 100 disc players @ $10 a head = 50 ball golfers at $20 a head, or something like that.

 

[Peterb]

One reason could be that if the course doesn't get the disc golfer revenue (no matter the price), they're not getting any additional revenue above and beyond their regular golfer clientele. In other words, they added disc golf as an attraction to increase revenue. The lower price point might be what they had to settle for to bring disc golfers out at all. $30 a round probably means zero disc golfers where as $5-10 brings them out enough to justify the expense of having the course installed.

I think it also depends on the facilities. If the disc golf course is essentially the ball golf course with baskets tucked off to the side of the regular greens, I see no reason to charge or treat the disc players any differently than the ball golfers. They're sharing the same fairways. They can't really co-exist in the sense that one group has to follow another regardless of if they're throwing a disc or hitting a ball.

On the other hand, if the disc golf course uses areas that aren't a part of the ball golf course (wooded areas between holes, etc) and there's minimal conflict between the two parties, there's no real reason to charge the same to disc golfers as ball golfers. On a busy day, they could probably put more disc golfers through the course than they can ball golfers...another reason they wouldn't need to charge the same to generate similar revenue. 100 disc players @ $10 a head = 50 ball golfers at $20 a head, or something like that.

Thanks for the response. The facility I'm thinking about would be the type where you'd throw down fairways in a one to one set up. It's a 9 hole executive type of course, so perhaps the way to do it would be to have two sets of tees and two baskets even for disc golf. Just thinking about pricing and trying to justify a lower price point per 9 holes to the golf course owners. We are thinking of restricting the hours to their down periods so perhaps that comes into play as well...I'd like to see their 9 hole price point drop to 7-8 bucks with 18 at 12-15 or something.

 

[madmax88]

One of the major reasons golf course fees are so high is the amount of maintenance required. Disc golf wont need greens so it should definitely be less maintenance.

 

[Rocaholic74]

People should really do some research before asking these types of questions. In order to build an sand based green (which most golf courses have gone to these days due to the benefit of draining issues) it costs roughly 19k. Now, in order to have 18 holes you're looking at roughly $342,000 for just the greens alone. Then you have to take into account the maintenance costs that it takes for those 18 holes. Then there's the cost of the sod that is laid down to replace the divots on the range, the maintenance of the fairways and bunkers. The overhead is tremendously high. That's why the better courses you go to greens fees are higher.

Now, add a disc golf course to those municipal golf courses. The most they have to put out for are the baskets, let's say 9k. Then add some tees, whether it be concrete or rubber. The cost of that could range from a few thousand to maybe another 10k. So, let me ask you a question, for installing a disc golf course that costs at most 20k....why would anyone pay $30 or more to play disc golf.

I don't mean this post to be ignorant or offensive in any way to the OP. It just boils down to the basic concept of maintenance and installation costs.

 

[storyboy]

One of the major reasons golf course fees are so high is the amount of maintenance required. Disc golf wont need greens so it should definitely be less maintenance.

This^

 

[Peterb]

Rocaholic no offense taken. I understand your argument but you're missing the point. Why should a golf course allow a disc golfer to use their expensive fairways, bunkers, greens (even if they're OB) at a discount when they could sell that tee time to a golfer willing to pay more?

 

[biscoe]

Why should a golf course allow a disc golfer to use their expensive fairways, bunkers, greens (even if they're OB) at a discount when they could sell that tee time to a golfer willing to pay more?

If they had sufficient golf demand for all tee times dg would not be there in the first place.

 

[Peterb]

If they had sufficient golf demand for all tee times dg would not be there in the first place.

fair point and one I have used with these guys.

 

[Aim For The Chains]

the 2 designed here by Steve West are not really using the actual golf greens or tees even. The 18 baskets are placed in along/within the space of the 9 hole golf course. Its not the same space at all more off to the "side" in a sense and a extra piece to the land which the course exists.

http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=4529&mode=lf
http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=4541

Maybe Steve can chime in with some details for you. He would be the guy to talk to IMO.

 

[TheFisch]

No one will pay 30$ for a round of disc golf unless it is a world class championship course. Especially when you can pay for free at most courses.

 

[biscoe]

What the market will bear likely differs considerably from golf to disc golf as well.

 

[Dan Ensor]

Rocaholic no offense taken. I understand your argument but you're missing the point. Why should a golf course allow a disc golfer to use their expensive fairways, bunkers, greens (even if they're OB) at a discount when they could sell that tee time to a golfer willing to pay more?

Because a certain amount of a golfer's green fee is for damage to the course. Having to send someone to move pins and tees. Watering the fairway so the divots grow back before the fairway becomes a dirt patch.

Are the disc golfers really playing the entire golf course? That seems like it would be a really long course, probably without many obstacles.

 

[Peterb]

true. And this market is starved for disc golf. It is in san mateo county, one of the most populous places without a disc golf course in the country. Also, it is the only county in California without a course. This could be it's first, but it will come with a cost since the overall cost of living here is higher than almost everywhere else in the US.

No course within about 45 minutes or so, and that's without traffic.

 

[DavidSauls]

What the market will bear likely differs considerably from golf to disc golf as well.

This is where it starts. No doubt they're charging the golfers what the market will bear. They'd charge $100 if they thought they could get it.

It has little to do with fairness. Unless they lose golfing customers over it. It would take a lot of disc golfers to replace a dozen golfers.

 

[Peterb]

Because a certain amount of a golfer's green fee is for damage to the course. Having to send someone to move pins and tees. Watering the fairway so the divots grow back before the fairway becomes a dirt patch.

Are the disc golfers really playing the entire golf course? That seems like it would be a really long course, probably without many obstacles.

It's an executive all par 3 course, 9 holes in total. Very short but great elevation changes. Ideal for disc golf but not enough space to do a 2 for 1 or 9 on the course and 9 in the woods. Some decent obstacles with water hazards and of course elevation changes.

 

[Peterb]

This is where it starts. No doubt they're charging the golfers what the market will bear. They'd charge $100 if they thought they could get it.

It has little to do with fairness. Unless they lose golfing customers over it. It would take a lot of disc golfers to replace a dozen golfers.

They charge $15 for golfers. Very inexpensive here and competitive for a 9 holer nationally.

 

[scarpfish]

If golf courses that add disc golf feel they could get disc golfers to pay the same amount of money as ball golfers, they'd charge the same rate, simple as that. Its the same principal behind why hotels will put rooms up on Priceline at a significant discount while still charging a rack rate if they don't expect to fill the place. Getting less than their asking price isn't ideal, but when you're starved for revenue, its better than nothing.

No one will pay 30$ for a round of disc golf even if it is a world class championship course.

FTFY

$30 for all day admission to a complex with two world class championship courses (ala Selah) perhaps.

true. And this market is starved for disc golf. It is in san mateo county, one of the most populous places without a disc golf course in the country. Also, it is the only county in California without a course. This could be it's first, but it will come with a cost since the overall cost of living here is higher than almost everywhere else in the US.

You would have to admit you have economic circumstances there that aren't applicable in a lot of areas of the country. In a lot of locales, there's really no need to build disc golf courses on golf courses as there's plenty of them available in parks in relation to the populace who uses them. And they're 95% free to play no less.

 

[Skwirly]

Here in the Sacramento area, an 18- hole championship level course was installed at a 9-hole ball golf course by Drew Gibson and his father. They charge $15 for 9 holes of BG and $6 for 18 holes of DG. About half of the DG course is through a wooded area not used for BG. Some of the rules they set up are that ball holfers always have the right of way, so they get to play through; and the greens are OB not even to be walked on by DGers since they're not paying for the greens maintenance. Having been to the location before, they have a bar and grill that does live music and art shows sometimes, it seems they weren't overloaded with ball golfers, but I've seen a lot of DGers out there since it opened. They started off with a 60 day trial period to see how it went, making sure disc golfers weren't a nuisance and that they didn't deter ball golfers from playing. The baskets in the ball golf areas are on rollaway stands and they haven't installed tees or permanent signs. Starting out with the trial and low fee as well as establishing those rules seem like the best approach to me. Maybe try contact Drew or his father Marty, who runs the Sunrise Disc Golf Course FB page, to get some tips.

 

[joecoin]

Disc golfers don't wear cleats or drive carts.