Trick for nose down? AM I CRAZY!!!

[Bradley Walker]

OMG...

Tell me I'm not crazy...

Try this.

Hold this disc in your normal position. Flat to the ground.
Now take your forearm and rotate the disc clockwise as far as you can.
Throw the disc like this...

1. If you pull under your chest with this position, the disc will be crazy nose down hyzer.
2. If you pull over your shoulder the disc nose is pointed into the turn of the anhyzer...

I KNOW #2 is true. All of a sudden I can throw a high anhyzer with a fast disc!! For the first time ever I am getting the distance line!!!!

Nose down is not a speed thing all the time.... there are some tricks to getting that disc angle to get the nose to drop into the descending line... I am still trying to figure them out...

 

[Timko]

Hmm. Something for me to try in the field. I know #2 is true as well. I'm very interested about #1.

 

[Ben Hartwig]

wait, do you mean rotating the disc by bending your wrist? so that the top of your hand is 90 degrees to your forearm? sounds like something i wou'ld like to try, but i was just wondering if thats how you were trying to explain it...

 

[bcsst26]

Sounds interesting. I will have to give it a try.

 

[Timko]

Bradley, get out that iPhone and post a video. I think it would help facilitate discussion.

 

[HeartlessCynic]

Or at least a pic or two.

 

[JR]

I posted about this idea way back when. For me there are a couple of problems. The muscles get tenser the farther away you go from neutral arm position and that slows down the arm. If you do the twist in the reach back. The later you do the twist the faster the arm moves and the wrist snaps. I had a lot of inconsistencies with the exact angle of release in nose down and hyzer/anny angles. So i stopped trying soon. Annies on distance lines are the only shots that i've used this trick on in play.

You might want to look at videos of Dave Greenwell, Joonas Hynönen and Emil Dahlgren. All of them tilt the disc fairly upright at some point of the arm pull and twist the disc into the correct angle late in the snap. Try that if this ain't hard enough. Those guys twist counterclockwise. There is no law that denies starting with counterclockwise turn and then finish with a clockwise twist as far as it will go.

Karate anyone? There is a punch in Karate, where the wrist is snapped from knuckles down to knuckles up for added power. The same motion gives a harder snap in DG. And it gives you the possibility of adding power. If you can train it to accurate and consistent enough for open field golf, great. I have done the counterclockwise to flat twists without thinking in field practice sometimes lately. More snap. And it surprised me in getting level flight. So learning is certainly possible. Going to clockwise turn adds difficulty, but there are many more athletically gifted people than me and given time... So thus far i've never tried combined counterclockwise to clockwise twist in one throw, because i wasn't happy with accuracy before.

 

[Bradley Walker]

You rotate the forearm. As far clockwise as possible. So hold the disc straight out in front of you flat to the ground and then rotate the disc clockwise with your forearm. I can get it vertical. Then this is the new "flat".

I am not crazy, but I need a little time to formulate the facts here before I make a video and sound like a rambling idiot...

I was doing some wicked new stuff today, but each setup required a bit of thought... The new position requires entirely different body positions to get the disc back to "neutral"...

I do not want to get ahead of myself by I now start to see how Feldberg throws his hyser flips and all the distance guys throw the flex anny...

 

[Triflusal]

I'm confused as to how you throw after it's rotated. What do you mean by "over the shoulder"

 

[Bradley Walker]

Anny line throws are closer to a roller line...

 

[Bradley Walker]

I am not talking about applying a twist... Just completely different geometry... Watch the distance comp with Avery and GG... Avery holds the disc in this exact position....

 

[Bradley Walker]

This might also explain why Feldberg almost appears to throw reverse underhanded... Like a reverse softball throw will standing nearly sidewise...

I threw some hyser flips today that went out faster and flipped sooner (indicating nose down). The nose is immediately down in flight... I was throwing the disc almost vertical and it flipped up in a matter of of a few yards. It's not a torque either... It's something to do with the disc to body angle... I know my flex shot is finally working after years of trying to get that "push left, roller coaster right to the pan flex" flight I have seen on videos...

 

[XCyclone]

I am not talking about applying a twist... Just completely different geometry... Watch the distance comp with Avery and GG... Avery holds the disc in this exact position....

A link to this would be cool.

 

[Bradley Walker]

If you try the anny you will find your body will need to close to the left to get the disc on plane... Which could explain the whole "closed shoulder position" too...and appearance of a relatively early release is see in the Dion video...

 

[Bradley Walker]

I am not talking about applying a twist... Just completely different geometry... Watch the distance comp with Avery and GG... Avery holds the disc in this exact position....

A link to this would be cool.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJyq5xvBS0w&feature=youtube_gdata_player

 

[Bradley Walker]

These guys arent really throwing with a lot a anny... But I can still see it...

 

[zj10021]

Correct it's not a pure anny. It is a nose down "dump" flip where the extreme nose down forces it over. I have messed around with throwing like that before but it wasn't relaible for me, as JR said things felt too tight. I do see what you mean about it with Avery. I have a picture of Feldy basically with a driver in full pivot as it comes off his right pec. That style is ideal for his driver heavy bag. It flips them up fast. I got similar results from my "trigger pull grip" experiments last year. I'll be revisiting that theory now that I have better concept of my timing and what is needed

 

[JR]

This might also explain why Feldberg almost appears to throw reverse underhanded... Like a reverse softball throw will standing nearly sidewise...

I threw some hyser flips today that went out faster and flipped sooner (indicating nose down). The nose is immediately down in flight... I was throwing the disc almost vertical and it flipped up in a matter of of a few yards. It's not a torque either... It's something to do with the disc to body angle... I know my flex shot is finally working after years of trying to get that "push left, roller coaster right to the pan flex" flight I have seen on videos...

With which discs do you flip to flat from nearly vertical in a few feet? I threw a Z Pred with forearm twist, when i tried this. It was a regular flat throw in every other aspect and the nose down was so extreme that the disc hit the ground something like 25' of flight in a steep dive and at that speed the disc made a sound unlike anything i've heard. It was impressive and comical at the same time And hardly useful in anything but skip shots under branches that are so close to you.