I think it is personal. I love my Crave and Hex. They feel good in my hand, go mostly where I want them to, and get better distance now than I ever used to think I could get with a 6.5 speed and a 5 speed. I have a 7 speed River in my bag, and it goes very straight, but for some reason I find myself always reaching for the Crave instead. I think the River is great, but the Crave just feels and flies a little better, a little more reliably for me. Plus, I am the guy people hate on, in that I use high speed, light weight stuff to get a little more distance. 150g Katanas and Terns are some of my favorite discs, and I have reasonably good control with them. While my Crave may be straighter, the high speed, light weight stuff gives me a chance to reach greens that I can't reach otherwise, and even on a bad shot, they rarely leave me second shot where I can't save par.
-
Discover new ways to elevate your game with the updated DGCourseReview app!
It's entirely free and enhanced with features shaped by user feedback to ensure your best experience on the course. (App Store or Google Play)
[Drivers] Are Speed 7 Discs Necessary?
- Thread starter NSDallin
- Start date
VictorB
* Ace Member *
I'm pretty ingrained in the "throw the slowest disc you can comfortably reach your landing zone with" mentality.
As I've lost a bit of distance, a speed 7 has become more of a need to maintain that mindset. Where I was consistently throwing mids out to 325' a few years ago, now I'm almost never clearing 300' with them. This is where the Cicada fills a spot in my lineup, to bridge the larger gap between my speed 9 control drivers and speed 5 midranges. I still throw my 9 and 5 speeds a lot more, but it sure has been nice to have something there when I feel I need it.
Twmccoy
* Ace Member *
Speed 7 is a nice spot for fairway drivers. Stuff like the Teebird, Evader, or Explorer are all very good options. Usable for weak and strong arms alike.
Anax is the next step up for me in terms of drivers after speed 7.
Anax is the next step up for me in terms of drivers after speed 7.
mostlynorwegian
Tosser with plastic
- Joined
- May 25, 2017
- Messages
- 582
Yes, 7 speeds are necessary. At least for me they are. Presently it's a mix of two It's, a TL, Teebird and/or an Eagle.
I'm in the "throw smarter, not harder" camp where I generally only try to throw close to all out on wide open field holes which are few and far between around here. I was bagging warp speeders for distance and 9/10 speeds for fairways instead of 7's but I finally just said eff it and dropped anything faster than an 11 speed. The marginal distance increase wasn't worth the lack of comfort.
So I picked up 7's again and just use Wraiths and Graces for distance now. The 7 speeds have been great for holes where I want the miss to be too long instead of powering up mids and still landing short or powering down 9/10 speeds and getting wrecked on ground play. I'm using Cookies, Kaxe Z, Soda, and a Maverick for FWs and they're basically just longer mids to me.
So I picked up 7's again and just use Wraiths and Graces for distance now. The 7 speeds have been great for holes where I want the miss to be too long instead of powering up mids and still landing short or powering down 9/10 speeds and getting wrecked on ground play. I'm using Cookies, Kaxe Z, Soda, and a Maverick for FWs and they're basically just longer mids to me.
It kinda depends on how you look at your fairway drivers. I like to think them as an extension to my mids, where I can throw those tight lines (quite) a bit further without too much lateral movement. For example the River will go 50' further than any mid I have and still can make it fly dead straight.
Actaully for me the 9 speed is the odd man out. While it does give you a bit more distance, they generally start to show more lateral movement and at that point I disc up to actual drivers.
Actaully for me the 9 speed is the odd man out. While it does give you a bit more distance, they generally start to show more lateral movement and at that point I disc up to actual drivers.
The hardest part is coming to grips with what you should be throwing. Definitely feeling my age (a busted 47) and 7 speed is my new best friend. I can still use 9s and I "think" I can use a flippy 11... haha but mostly I get better results taking the 30' less and being middle of the fairway. Getting past the mental block is hard, like Sheep said.
7 is very necessary for me, I love me some rhythms. I usually have 3 of em.
7 is very necessary for me, I love me some rhythms. I usually have 3 of em.
Sheep
Sir, This is a Wendy's
- Joined
- Jul 27, 2017
- Messages
- 1,496
People get way to prideful over their 12 speeds.
And.. Granted, some people make it work, I wont say they dont. But there are better easier ways.
The best ones are these guys who talk about how they turn over 6 and 7 speeds, so they have to throw 12/14 speeds.
Yeah bro. Uhh, that's a force over, not a turn over. your form is shit.
wims
Double Eagle Member
I love speed 7's, you could say it's my bread and butter along with Envy's. My bag is actually super simple, Envy - Leopard 3 - Teebird with a couple of utility discs, the Toro and the Glory. 3 out of these 5 molds are speed 7s.
zontar
Double Eagle Member
what? there are 12 speeds? I don't even pick them up to fondle them in the disc store.....
I love my Crave - a 6.5 speed. But, I also like my 150-155g Tern and Katana, that get me more distance more easily. I can get more distance with my Crave than I used to, but even if I yeet the hell out of it, it still won't reach my Tern or Katana, both of which I throw with reasonable accuracy. When people give me crap about it, I try to smile, and have fun playing my game! Also, on easy to medium courses, I am now shooting par or below with decent regularity, so fewer and fewer people give me crap about it! Just, don't put me on no pro level courses, because they would kick my ass for sure (the course, and the pros, too - lol). The one guy that used to really give me a lot of crap - I now beat him 3/4 of the time…. He still talks shit about it, but not nearly as often, and it's a lot easier to smile through it now. I don't talk shit back - I like to think I am a bigger person than that???
I was guilty of all seven of @Sheep deadly sins as listed above haha. Now I'm forced to be more moderate from limitations. On the plus side after a decade of that speed 12 strategy I still generate a high spin throw and can turn over anything at will. With over a decade of mvp im pretty good at nose down with a touch of anny. The envy is awesome for me as it's somewhat resistant to that kind of behavior.
I still miss my very broken in blue FR ESP 172g force. Man that thing was fastest disc i've ever thrown, i dont mean just speed rating, it just cut the air and the throw was over in half the time of a loftier disc. I pull it out from time to time but it doesn't do what it used to. I love a big rim, I did 6yrs or so steady with a Scorpion.
www.dgcoursereview.com
This thread helped me, I wish I had listened sooner.. haha.
Anyone else throwing the new eclipse orbital? 11 5 -4.5 1 haha, it's kinda nice. Old habits die hard, it's just nice to have a glow driver I can actually throw from mvp...
I still miss my very broken in blue FR ESP 172g force. Man that thing was fastest disc i've ever thrown, i dont mean just speed rating, it just cut the air and the throw was over in half the time of a loftier disc. I pull it out from time to time but it doesn't do what it used to. I love a big rim, I did 6yrs or so steady with a Scorpion.
Discing down adventures.
Amidst all this malarkey about mids, putters, and fairway drivers helping your game I realized that I'm the perfect guinea pig for a case study. Since I'm wildly erratic (throw 400' one day, struggle to break 330' the next) I'm tossing out all the distance drivers out of my bag for awhile...
www.dgcoursereview.com
This thread helped me, I wish I had listened sooner.. haha.
Anyone else throwing the new eclipse orbital? 11 5 -4.5 1 haha, it's kinda nice. Old habits die hard, it's just nice to have a glow driver I can actually throw from mvp...
Last edited:
Sheep
Sir, This is a Wendy's
- Joined
- Jul 27, 2017
- Messages
- 1,496
Crave is actually closer to a 7 or 8 speed.
MVP went full derp when they did their numbers and suddenly changed other things.
I digress.
The biggest thing is throwing discs you can always control. a majority of people throw the 12 speeds expecting distance, when they are getting 1 in 5 for good shots. That's... not good. Dropping down to a slower fairway, or slow control driver will give you so much better results. The higher the disc speed, the more fussy they are to form and your control and less forgiving overall.
One could argue "but then I know where I'm at in my game if I'm messing up."
Yeah.. no. I had that idea a long time ago. and.. its not true. Getting one out and throwing it once or twice for funzies to see how it works is one thing, but constantly beating the dead horse with big discs that you can't keep under control is just a bad idea.
I can soap box on this topic for hours honestly. A majority of form issues and players ability to develop form and get good enjoyment from disc golf is simply based on their "need" to use high speed discs.
And its all pride. I get SO sick of hearing "well i can't throw my X that far like you can."
Well, you certainly aint getting much out of that 13 speed throwing it over your buzz. That extra 30 feet is really good huh?
I just personally hate how disc golf discs speeds are explained, and its just a huge case of pride and understanding overall. You think about it like ball golf, and its not.
Putters are not putters, drivers are not drivers.
We gotta be thinking stuff like "Cesna skycock" vs "f16 fighter jet"
I'm sorry, but you're not qualified for the f16, perhaps you should go get multi engine certified on a buzz first.
@Sheep "Putters are not putters...."
That's some wisdom right there, I treated that like bolf for too many years and then I came on here and saw Mike C throwing wizards 350'... I tried throwing mine 150' and my game improved immensely, went hard-core discing down adventure and did nothing except a comet and Ion for 6 months and got even better (mostly haha 2 holes I carried a driver for to not handicap my partner).
That's some wisdom right there, I treated that like bolf for too many years and then I came on here and saw Mike C throwing wizards 350'... I tried throwing mine 150' and my game improved immensely, went hard-core discing down adventure and did nothing except a comet and Ion for 6 months and got even better (mostly haha 2 holes I carried a driver for to not handicap my partner).
I tried adhering to the old DGR disc selection for far too long. It took me far too long to realize that using pro disc and shot selection without a pro game is a huge mistake. You have to be honest with yourself about whether you truly are willing or able to turn the game into a job and put in the amount of practice that requires. A friend of mine got into the game a couple years back and had better velocity than me pretty quickly, not massively so but noticeable. He plays almost entirely with a Destroyer, Teebird, Zone, and Pilot. He throws the Destroyer most of the time from the tee. It took me some time to try his plan of discing up, but it's better for me. It's far easier on my arm and body to get the distance I need with a faster disc and slight flex than max efforting slower stuff. That's not the path to being the best player in the world, but there are far more paths to being an above average to good player than there are to being a great one. Don't be too proud to disc up and use free extra distance from a distance angle.
You're using hyperbole, but if it's the difference between a C1 putt and outer edge of C2, then yeah; it's better. Putting is the only thing I have the time and health to get pretty good at. I want to give myself a chance to score where I can. I'm very confident in my scrambling when things go wrong. I have no expectation that I'll develop a pro game. I think most players would enjoy the game more and perform better if they'd be realistic about the player who they are and what their potential is.
jupiterboy
Eagle Member
- Joined
- May 6, 2021
- Messages
- 962
IDK. I took myself off runup and anhyzer for more than a season. Not so many holes around here where I need anything faster than a 9. Mostly I can get in position with a flippy 4 speed and not much effort at all.
I began my own 7 speed experiment this spring, and my results are all positive. For context, I'm 62 and recovering from an injury. I took the entire winter off to rehab and improve my leg and core strength, and any drive over 300' feet is now a long throw for me. I've ABd my 7s against nine and above, and the 7s are proving to be the superior choice. They are equal in distance and offer better control. I still carry a couple of higher speed discs for when the winds are demanding or favorable, but as my confidence grows with the 7s they may leave the bag as well. The list below are the drivers that I now throw almost exclusively.
Maul
Underworld
Maverick
Jackalope
FD
Spark
Maul
Underworld
Maverick
Jackalope
FD
Spark
Sheep
Sir, This is a Wendy's
- Joined
- Jul 27, 2017
- Messages
- 1,496
I'm exaggerating for purposes of proving a point? I'm using a literal example of a real person I play with weekly. The part that I'm not telling you is how wildly uncontrolled he is with his 13 speeds and accuracy vs his buzz accuracy with is 90% while his 13 speed accuracy is maybe 30%.
When it comes to high speed discs vs low speed discs, this is the issue. For a majority of players with your attitude towards this, their accuracy with those high speed discs is atrocious. The player is wildly throwing that disc thinking that its getting them all that extra distance. When the reality is they are far more capable of throwing better, further and more accurate getting into fairways and control drivers vs trying to huck 12+ speed discs randomly across the course.
Accuracy is king in disc golf for us mortals. You will shave more strokes off your game having a clean easy swing you can place wherever you want than getting that extra 30 feet by throwing that big driver you can't control.
What you're actually doing in the scenario of trying to get the extra 30 feet from a huge distance driver is hurting your overall form as you try and throw it as hard as you can for that extra 30 feet.
Clean consistent form = easy distance when paired with the correct disc for your abilities. You will get more distance as the disc is able to perform as designed.
It's actually far easier on your arm/body if you threw a slower disc that was more under stable vs trying to force things over every shot which is actually harder on your body.
Disc speed = Speed at which disc is designed to be thrown.
When you start using that mentality, and you get the correct discs in your hand, just a normal throw without stress gives you net gains on distance over top of your big drivers.
Now, LOTS of players out there play like you describe. And that's fine, Do what works. But there are better ways. Its the pride holding you back though, not anything about being "pro" at that point.
This is the equivalent of driving a race car in city traffic expecting it to get you there faster cause its a race car. All about the right tools for the job and understanding to use those tools.
This whole concept is really really difficult for players to grasp as a whole. The arguments about why you should still throw high speed discs despite not having the skill level for them are really weak. Especially the extra 30 foot one. So you get that extra 30 foot on target, what... 1 in 15 throws? the rest are 60 foot off the fairway in the woods cause high speed drivers are more fussy.
Then there are guys who just take high speed discs, throw annies and have some level of control over it like you, and there isn't anything wrong with that. You keep doing your game. But this isn't a standard way to play. It's a casual rec level way to play. You enjoy playing right? I'm sure you do. All the people I play with that play like this do.
It's a case of "if its stupid and it works." Thats good. it works. That doesn't mean it should be a suggested method.
Sheep, it seems to me that the partner you play with does things you see often, but then maybe you generalize and think almost everyone throwing high speed stuff does the same things? I know for me, I love my Crave. I don't need it a ton, but I have good control with it at various distances, up to about 175-200' max. I play courses with a lot of holes that are 250-300'. No matter how hard I throw my Crave, I won't get decent birdie tries on those holes. Now, I throw a 150g Tern or Katana, and I get 250-275', with reasonably good control. I get some decent birdie tries. If I am off target right or left, I am still as close, maybe closer, than my Crave would have got me. Plus, my short to intermediate game, mostly Crave and putter (trying to get as good with a Hex as I am with my Crave, but not there yet), is very good. I get very few tee shots so bad that I can't save par. My game is very few bogies, a ton of pars, and a few birdies, where how many birdies I get is what primarily determines my score. I don't use my Tern and Katana because of pride - I use them because they make my game better. They give me more, better birdie tries, and add little to no risk of me playing/scoring worse. Rant done.
