Mini Rule Change Vote

[veek]

Some people think the mini should be placed behind your disc so your not rewarded for changing your lie and slowing the game. After all it is a game of inches.

1. Yes change it, makes sence to me.

2. No leave it, why fix if it aint broke.

3. Who cares, dont use rules anyway.

 

[Dingus]

I say it is a good idea, but honestly it doesn't matter. I would personally benefit from the change because usually I don't care as much about getting a couple inches closer, but sometimes I desperately want to get a couple inches back.

 

[coupe]

Some people think the mini should be placed behind your disc so your not rewarded for changing your lie and slowing the game.

How is placing a mini behind the thrown disc any faster than placing it in front of the disc?

 

[Dingus]

How is placing a mini behind the thrown disc any faster than placing it in front of the disc?

He is saying people simply wouldn't place the marker instead using the disc as it is, saving the time of placing the marker.

 

[roblee]

Fewer players would take the 2s to mark? 400 fewer marks on a card could easily save 13 minutes per round. Hmmm....

 

[BillFleming]

I didn't start playing a long time ago. I don't know what all the rules used to be or why changes happened....but I can conjecture about the mini rule.

Why do we place the mini in FRONT of the disc?

Used to be (as I have heard from many sources) that you could flip your disc over to mark your lie and get a few inches more (mainly to improve your footing). And if you wanted to re-throw the same disc, you just put another disc on the ground in front of the disc you want to rethrow. All of that was basically putting a marker in front of the existing disc.

So, instead of flipping the disc and possibly flipping it a few inches further than you should....the rules require you to use a mini.

 

[Meillo]

It is kinda necessary to be able to place the mini in front of the disc. Consider the disc coming to rest right at a rock or tree. By placing the mini you can put your foot where the disc had been. If you'd be only allowed to place the mini behind the disc or if you don't place a mini at all, you couldn't put your foot down to take a stance. Thus the current rule makes a lot of sense.

 

[coupe]

He is saying people simply wouldn't place the marker instead using the disc as it is, saving the time of placing the marker.

Except he explicitly says:

Some people think the mini should be placed behind your disc so your not rewarded for changing your lie and slowing the game.

The current rule doesn't require players to place a mini unless the thrown disc is not on the in-bounds playing surface or the lie must be moved by rule. Given that the overwhelming majority of players mark their lie with a mini the overwhelming majority of the time in tournament play, there is no logical reason to assume that they will stop doing so if the rule is changed to tail marking.

 

[ToddL]

Why do we place the mini in FRONT of the disc?

The original 1982 rules declared: "the plant foot must be placed on the lie (the area that would be covered by a disc in play) immediately behind the marker disc." You were required put down a marker in front of the thrown disc so that your foot could be placed where the previous throw came to rest.

1986: 6" on either side of the LOP, marker required.
1990: on the LOP within 30cm of the rear of the marker, marker required.
1997: on the LOP within 30cm of the rear of the marker, marker required.
2002: on the LOP within 30cm of the rear of the marker, optional marker disc or leave the thrown disc at rest.

Nose marking is still a remnant of the original definition of the lie, where you were supposed to place your foot on the area where the thrown disc came to rest. Eventually they decided it was either a speed of play concern or just a pointless nuisance to require marking for every lie, and here we are.

 

[Smigles]

I dont mind the two seconds.

What i dont like about this rule is that you have two potential lies. I you mark or not changes your lie around 20 cm. This should not be, IMO you should have one lie and that's it. We should find a way to mark the disc that keeps it at just one lie, justz for consistency of the rules.

 

[txmxer]

I dont mind the two seconds.

What i dont like about this rule is that you have two potential lies. I you mark or not changes your lie around 20 cm. This should not be, IMO you should have one lie and that's it. We should find a way to mark the disc that keeps it at just one lie, justz for consistency of the rules.

Really? You actually care about this ?

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

I dont mind the two seconds.

What i dont like about this rule is that you have two potential lies. I you mark or not changes your lie around 20 cm. This should not be, IMO you should have one lie and that's it. We should find a way to mark the disc that keeps it at just one lie, justz for consistency of the rules.

So I totally disagree, the current rule unless it got changed haha is awesome. It accommodates both types of players. The type that want to leave the disc as the mark and the ones who want to mark the play. You're right it gives you about 50 cm of options.

That's the part I really like! Sometimes I'm trying to decide if I should pick up my favourite putter to get better footing/angle or not. Tough decision, lots of would of/ could have. I also like the idea of the 30cm thats about the size of a disc, fast and easy to ascertain

 

[Smigles]

Really? You actually care about this ?

Well not that i can't sleep at night, but yeah to me this is an inconsistancy in the rules.

We try to be precise with many of our rules, but then you just add a disc lenght of wiggle room? I dont like it.

Devils advocate: If you are OB by a hair, can you mark it and be safe?

 

[bnrstnkr]

I think the rules should be thoroughly updated, use eloquent language while being meticulous in explanation. And the philosophy of the rules should be explained so people know why things are the way they are. Maybe an article describing the history and progression of the ruleset alongside the updated rulebook.

But my main gripe about the lie rules is that it punishes jump/step putting improperly while letting it be impossible to tell if the rule was really broken. People make amazing shots using those step or jump putt methods. That's how people can sink putts from really far away. So... let that happen! Increase the size of the putting circle, and change the stance rule to allow jump shots.

Sorry, I know that's off topic, but it seems a lot more pertinent.

 

[txmxer]

Well not that i can't sleep at night, but yeah to me this is an inconsistancy in the rules.

We try to be precise with many of our rules, but then you just add a disc lenght of wiggle room? I dont like it.

Devils advocate: If you are OB by a hair, can you mark it and be safe?

Fair.

OB no. The definition of OB precludes that possibility.

 

[roblee]

Inside the circle I use a mini only because it's closer to the pin. Shame me all you want, I'm still gonna mark if it's legal.

 

[ThrowaEnvy]

FWIW I do both, if I'm close enough to putt and I don't want my disc a lot of times I will just putt it from behind, bag on the shoulder, bevvy in hand... why bend over twice?

What about the people that stand on their thrown disc? That annoys me because I wouldn't want to warp it and bad footing ewwww, but there's lots of people that do that.

 

[Dingus]

1986: 6" on either side of the LOP, marker required.
1990: on the LOP within 30cm of the rear of the marker, marker required.
1997: on the LOP within 30cm of the rear of the marker, marker required.
2002: on the LOP within 30cm of the rear of the marker, optional marker disc or leave the thrown disc at rest.

Wow I never realized markers where required at one point.

 

[txmxer]

FWIW I do both, if I'm close enough to putt and I don't want my disc a lot of times I will just putt it from behind, bag on the shoulder, bevvy in hand... why bend over twice?

What about the people that stand on their thrown disc? That annoys me because I wouldn't want to warp it and bad footing ewwww, but there's lots of people that do that.

One of my regular playing partners does this occasionally. It bugs me, but it's his disc and it is a casual round. Bugs me for the same reason you mention. Warping the disc

 

[Smigles]

But my main gripe about the lie rules is that it punishes jump/step putting improperly while letting it be impossible to tell if the rule was really broken..

IMO for this question, the rule should be in doubt AGAINST the player.

If you decide to push it that close that you need slow motion video to determine if the disc was released in time, well, your loss. You dont just do it and then put the call on your card mates. YOu need to have some responsability that your play is within the rules and also looks like it is within the rules...

Walk-putts like Dave Feldberg does dont have that problem.