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Prodigy Disc Thread v2.0
- Thread starter bcr123psu
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General Scales
Double Eagle Member
I'm so glad that there are other people on here that know about ISO and lot control. I managed a shipping department and did ISO documentation for a company for six years. I can't believe that these disc manufacturers do not have a system in place to address these issues.
My father and I have actually been taking different plastics to have them tested to see what plastics are currently being used in disc golf. So far we've tested DX, Pro-D, Elite-X, Pro, Champ, Opto, Z and Gold Line. The results from these tests have been very interesting and really it's amazing how little it costs to produce discs. The most expensive parts are molds and machine work.
If Prodigy really has reproduced a plastic that fits the CE title, I'll be having that tested as well. I haven't found any CE plastic that I want to have destroyed to find out what it truly is composed of.
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2008
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no way?! I want proof.
sugarnot
Eagle Member
granted its kind of a moot point, but why dont you put up a wanted ad in the Market Place for some shattered cuz it was cold or totally beat to crap or punctured ce plastic? Surely someone has something that was a favored disc that met some untimely demise that they dont have anything else to do with.
Meulen
Eagle Member
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- Jul 20, 2009
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- 507
PM'd you offering a donor disc... :thmbup:
plastic cannon
* Ace Member *
This made me laugh after a long day at work. Thank you kind sir.
General Scales
Double Eagle Member
PM'd you back on the offer :clap:. I'm super excited to see what the results are and why Innova cannot just reproduce the legendary plastic. I have a suspicion that it has something to do with one of the polymers in the plastic being discontinued.
Back on subject, does anybody have pictures of the bottom sides of these Prodigy discs? I'm super interested in seeing what this 'easy release technology' is all about.
I think Innova quit making CE plastic because it was so durable that players didn't need to buy as many discs as before CE came along. In essence they would be limiting their market by continuing to produce CE.
Innova was so dominant for so long they could get away with that. Only recently has anyone cut into Innova's market share, and the competition has been good for tournament directors like myself. Innova is sponsoring TD's more than they used to and the customer service has improved since Innova knows there are true alternatives to their discs now.
So if Prodigy is producing CE-quality plastic we'll see if they only sell a few to each player... Just think if I had the same 10 discs I had when I began playing 17 years ago...the disc manufacturers wouldn't be blowing their noses with $100 bills today would they?
Titanic_Sinks
just practicing
- Joined
- Jun 18, 2012
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- 531
I'm actually pretty sure original CE was discontinued because it contains some sort of toxic substance...
juju
Double Eagle Member
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- May 30, 2010
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- Mar 10, 2008
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-Dave D has said numerous times that they discontinued the plastic which is why they stopped using it.
-Also there was alot of molding inconsistency in the original 2 runs (there are a TON of X-out CE out there).
-Innova buys their plastic in lots which is why there is variance.
-CE (any run) is not nearly the most durable out there. At the time it most definitely was. But in todays DG world its not even close. Personally I thought the original run of Candy Plastic was the best. And I wish I had collected those when I had the chance.
-Which CE run is the one they are trying to achieve? Cause all the runs were really different.
-Although I believe the decision was ultimately money related. Not that it was too durable but that it was too costly to produce. but this is my speculation based on the info I have read from sources directly involved. you can probably even find most of it on the PDGA boards.
UnitedPuppySlayer
* Ace Member *
Not saying this isn't true, but people lie, a lot.
General Scales
Double Eagle Member
I've heard three theories on why CE was discontinued (that sound plausible)
1.) The polymer was discontinued because it was prohibitively expensive to work with and was costing manufacturers money.
2.) The polymer used in CE was also able to be used to make explosives and since 9/11 happened, all sales of the blend to non military companies was halted
3.) The company that actually manufactured the CE blend itself either A.) raised the prices to such a high rate that it was impossible to use without raising disc prices or B.) went out of business.
The whole talk of Innova discontinuing the plastic because they lasted forever and they wanted to squeeze more money out of the consumer has always seemed ridiculous to me.
/thread drift.
1.) The polymer was discontinued because it was prohibitively expensive to work with and was costing manufacturers money.
2.) The polymer used in CE was also able to be used to make explosives and since 9/11 happened, all sales of the blend to non military companies was halted
3.) The company that actually manufactured the CE blend itself either A.) raised the prices to such a high rate that it was impossible to use without raising disc prices or B.) went out of business.
The whole talk of Innova discontinuing the plastic because they lasted forever and they wanted to squeeze more money out of the consumer has always seemed ridiculous to me.
/thread drift.
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oh i agree...i dont think that is truly the reason. Dave D can be cryptic some times in his posts. i still think it was too costly to produce and thats why. and at that time the DG hoarders hadnt started yet. I dont think that really started until 2003-04ish when several molds began disappearing. no way in the late 90s and early early 2000s was someone going to pay the premium prices we pay today.
I just read through this entire thread and while I learned a lot, bcr123psu might want to make a v3.0 thread 
juju
Double Eagle Member
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- May 30, 2010
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- 1,558
Yup. That is the reason I passed up buying a 2001 CE Roc when I saw them for sale at the 2001 Majestic. They felt awesome, I asked how much and the guy said $25. I laughed and walked away.
:doh::doh::doh:
UnitedPuppySlayer
* Ace Member *
Ha! juju thought he was getting trolled!
So who's plastic would y'all say is as durable as old CE? And will Prodigy's be as durable? Seems to me that Prodigy's plastic being as good as CE is their hook...or the plastic better be twice as good as anything out there, because relying on a bunch of younger disc golfers to be your disc supermodels ain't going to get Prodigy far.
I'm going to stick with my opinion on why Innova quit producing CE...they just about had a monopoly on discs back then...definitely had between 80-90% market share. You can't tell me that if the raw CE plastic really got discontinued that Innova couldn't have found a decent substitute quickly. But maybe Meulen can shed some light on that?
I do like to hear some of these other opinions though.
I'm going to stick with my opinion on why Innova quit producing CE...they just about had a monopoly on discs back then...definitely had between 80-90% market share. You can't tell me that if the raw CE plastic really got discontinued that Innova couldn't have found a decent substitute quickly. But maybe Meulen can shed some light on that?
I do like to hear some of these other opinions though.
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Meulen
Eagle Member
- Joined
- Jul 20, 2009
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- 507
I heard it was discontinued because the CE blend contained cadmium, either in the resin itself or the colorant used for that grade of plastic. I'm sure California has linked it to cancer . The reason new plastic feels so good is because it contains all of the chemicals it was originally designed with. As the plastic ages, the plasticizers migrate to the surface of the disc and dissipate into the atmosphere. This is why the vinyl dashboards on older cars are cracked (partially caused by UV degradation). Why do you see more and more CE cracking and falling apart? Yes, it's cold out. But it's also 12 years old. It has lost some of the plasticizers that allow for flexibility, grip, etc. Give one of your Lat 64 Gold or Opto discs a decade and see how those are holding up. The lifetime of plastic is finite, and the characteristics of the material also change with time. I'm sure Prodigy will be releasing some really nice stuff, but it can easily be duplicated or improved upon. Only time will truly tell how these different blends will hold up.
. The reason new plastic feels so good is because it contains all of the chemicals it was originally designed with. As the plastic ages, the plasticizers migrate to the surface of the disc and dissipate into the atmosphere. This is why the vinyl dashboards on older cars are cracked (partially caused by UV degradation). Why do you see more and more CE cracking and falling apart? Yes, it's cold out. But it's also 12 years old. It has lost some of the plasticizers that allow for flexibility, grip, etc. Give one of your Lat 64 Gold or Opto discs a decade and see how those are holding up. The lifetime of plastic is finite, and the characteristics of the material also change with time. I'm sure Prodigy will be releasing some really nice stuff, but it can easily be duplicated or improved upon. Only time will truly tell how these different blends will hold up.- Status
