Roottori's Bag

[Roottori]

Aargh, I'm beginning to become little frustrated with my distance drivers. Aviars, Rocs, Eagles and Preds have earned permanent spots in my bag, they are all really versatile and reliable discs, but I still haven't found a distance driver I really like. Beasts are fine in calm conditions and I can hyzer flip the crap out of them, but in wind they get little bit unpredictable because they do turn but their fade is relatively small. So, is there a driver in the same speed class that is a bit more overstable than Beast and then beats to straight-ish and eventually understable? And preferably it would be available in Pro/X plastic because I like the grip and the way they glide. If I stepped up in speed I could throw Wraith, but I think it is a little bit too fast for me at the moment, so I would rather stick to speed 10 driver.

 

[Fightingthetide1]

If Pro SL's are still run as SL's and not Starfires, I bet you could get a lineup of two or three SL's (Pro and Star) to fit the bill.

I've been thinking of this lineup for my bag too. I'm curious to hear what you end up with.

 

[Roottori]

If I just knew which mold it is nowadays... At Innova's web-page they have SL available in Pro plastic, but Starfire is also available in Pro. And every online retailer I've checked is selling Pro Starfires but not Pro SL's. So try to figure this out... I think I'll ask my go-to retailer if they know anything about it.

Do you know anything about the Orc? According to Innova it could be a step-up from Beast but I don't really trust those flight-ratings...

 

[Fightingthetide1]

Yeah Orcs could work, but it would take some time to break one in to understable, unless you get a Pro Orc.

At that speed, I would think Orc, OLF, SL, etc would all eventually work for you once you get a rotation.

You already know what range of at stabilities you want, so find a mold that works for the most stable slot at that range and start beating it in. Keep your beasts around until the first one needs to be replaced. Or you could buy a pro version of the same disc to jump start the rotation process.

 

[JR]

Orcs vary a lot and i don't think they make the straight ones any more. Pro type plastic makes things harder because TDs don't come in that and neither do Flows. So i'd go with the shorter Sirius Orion from Millennium because it is driver Pro. So the slickest, hardest and most durable pro blend that is really more like Star. See if you like one in 175 grip wise. If not i'm afraid you have a decision to make. Either you use a harder slicker plastic or base line plastics that will either break into not wind beating fast or start out very overstable. The SOLF is not the hardest fading disc but it is a very durable disc so it takes a long time to break in. Haven't all Pro SLs been Starfires for a few years? Pro Orc flips when new and it breaks in faster than anything in Pro. You'd have to go to DX especially Valk to get a disc that breaks in faster. When Vibram Lace hits the stores it is at least rubber so the grip might be there. I haven't followed it enough to know how it flies but some protos flipped so i'm afraid it can't handle headwinds.

 

[Roottori]

Thanks guys!

I asked guys at Powergrip what they know about SL's, and their opinion is that Pro Starfires are in fact SL's at the moment. They went through all their Pro Starfires; most of them were SL's, one was Starfire and few were marked SF and they were in between of those two. So it looks like there are Pro SL's available. I'll put them into consideration and see if I could maybe trade one somewhere and check it out.

I had SOLF's in my bag in the past, but they were all really hard fading discs, they almost felt like Predators. It may be that I just got lemons, but I don't know. But I think I would rather go with a disc that is more like distance driver, not a tweener like OLF, because if I'm going for control I reach for my Eagles.

I think I've never thrown a Flow. It could be worth trying, at least I've read many good things about them here. What charasterictics should I look for if I decided to test it? Flat or domey, PLH, which plastic?

 

[JR]

Opto Flow with the highest dome and highest PLH you can find are good in headwinds provided there are equally high domes ones available now compared to the ones i have.

 

[Roottori]

I have two domey Opto Flows on the way, let's see how those bad boys fly.

 

[JR]

If they flip in calm weather check the PLH. The outside edge should be horizontal. If it droops down below that tune it up by bending the disc sides up by holding it in both hands on the opposite sides of the disc. Technically it makes the disc competition illegal but that's them rules going against putting the disc back into what they should be ho hum. In this case i don't know the intent of the designer though so i don't claim a level outside edge is the intent in this disc.

 

[Roottori]

I finally got those two Opto Flows, they are pretty much identical. First one is bright pink and another one is light pink. Both are max weight (really max weight, the scale shows they both weigh 180 grams... Either my scale is off or Latitude is screving things up pretty badly...), no drooping edges and PLH's are identical. The bright pink one is a little bit domier, though. Now I just have to wait for an opportunity to test these, we have quite a snow storm going on here so it really isn't ideal weather for disc golfing.

 

[JR]

From the looks in the yard we got about 30 cm of snow in one day and the wind was baaad.

 

[Roottori]

I figured since it's winter and there's no possibility to play any serious disc golf, it would be good time to give a whirl to some new plastic.

Are there any other mids than Roc that could handle all of my midrange shots in various stages of wear? I'm really getting tired of Innova and what they are doing with their molds. Wherever I go to look for some new Rocs, all I can find is poppy-top domey Rocs that are made of that craptastic soft blend of DX. They also have slanted rims which I don't like. So, are there any? I could use two molds, if there isn't just one mold that could do everything. I have my eye on Buzzzes, Midaris, MVP mids and Ghosts, so basically anything Innova hasn't put its dirty hands on.

Any feedback on these?

 

[JR]

I haven't thrown Ghosts but there are so many different stabilities you can get from Buzzes in different plastics when new let alone broken in that you should be golden with them.

 

[Roottori]

Cool, thanks for your input JR! I guess I could start with Z for stable/overstable, X that would start breaking in to fill the turnover slot and D for understable until I beat X enough. Does that sound like a plan?

 

[JR]

Perhaps not exactly and here having different power makes estimation difficult. So i'd start with just one to see how it flies for you. Naturally there are variations in shape thus stability of discs within the same plastic. At your power the Z is likely pretty hard fading with any height so it should fill your description in any other case but stiff headwinds. At my power the X flips when new but it might be the straightest Buzz for the longest time at your power and if it ain't it will still be a grippy disc albeit not quite as much as the FLX. So the question that is most relevant now is probably do you throw now and how much power you lose and how quickly do you want the disc to become the best for you sand just what stability is that? Those considerations decide whether the best option is the X, FLX or the Z. Z is slick, FLX is floppy and X is in between but on the firmer side with fairly good winter grip.

 

[Roottori]

Well yeah, I guess that makes sense. I think I´ll start with one X and maybe one Z, and build it up from there if needed.

 

[badfinger]

I figured since it's winter and there's no possibility to play any serious disc golf, it would be good time to give a whirl to some new plastic.

Are there any other mids than Roc that could handle all of my midrange shots in various stages of wear? I'm really getting tired of Innova and what they are doing with their molds. Wherever I go to look for some new Rocs, all I can find is poppy-top domey Rocs that are made of that craptastic soft blend of DX. They also have slanted rims which I don't like. So, are there any? I could use two molds, if there isn't just one mold that could do everything. I have my eye on Buzzzes, Midaris, MVP mids and Ghosts, so basically anything Innova hasn't put its dirty hands on.

Any feedback on these?

I have recently begun playing with Lat64 Pain molds quite often. Not sure if it would feel right in your hand, but there is only one way to find out.

 

[Roottori]

Thank you for your suggestion, badfinger. Unfortunately Latitude´s lack of base/midline plastic pushes me away from their discs though, so I think I´ll leave Pain on the store shelves. If Latitude came up with Pro/X/whatever kind of plastic, their discs would be much more appealing to me.

 

[Roottori]

A quick update here. This is what my bag looks like at the moment.

2x G9i Wizard 175g - putting
Soft Wizard 175g - upshots and drives

X Comet 180g - understable
ESP Comet 180g - straight
Z Comet 180g - straight to overstable
KC Roc 180g - Overstable

2x DX Eagle-X 175g - beat, understable
2x DX Eagle-X 175g - slightly seasoned, quite straight
2x Champion Eagle X 175g - overstable
2x Z Predator 175g - meathook
Pro Beast 169g - understable
Pro Beast 175g - slightly understable
Champion Beast 175g - overstablish


Wizards are fine (I just need more Softs for throwing, I'll save my firms for putting) and Comets are great! Eagle is the workhorse of my bag, I really throw one beat, one straight and one overstable but I want to have backup if I happen to lose one. The same goes for Predator. Beasts are okey, but I still don't really like them. I find them little bit squirrely and unpredictable, probably due to the lack of fade. So I usually just grab an Eagle and let it do its thing.

I just don't know what kind of distance driver I should use. OLF's or PD's would be in the speed range I'm comfortable with, but I feel like they would overlap too much with my Eagles. And when I go up the speed scale to Wraiths and Destroyers, well, I don't throw far enough to make them work and I can't get a good grip of their wide rims. Maybe I'll just be old school and throw nothing but Comets and Eagles, I don't know.

 

[JR]

SOLF 1.1 is nice and a heavyish 170-172 S PD might be just fine. But how far do you throw the Beast now that it acts a little squirrely? It is ok for a Beast to flip in the wind at 400' but in calm weather a flip should develop at 410' and more.