Theft by deception?????

[sidewinding]

Correction. None of it goes into our pocket or bank account.

Then you are the exception and not the rule which makes me wonder why you are being so defensive when none of this argument really applies to you. You are running tourneys for a club which is obviously a non profit organization.

Oh and just because the profits go to the club or funneled into the pro purse does not mean some shady practices cannot still occur. People want to grow their club.

 

[sidewinding]

So what have we learned?

There are some good TD's out there who do way too much work for absolutely nothing and deserve a pat on the back from all of us.

There are some bad TD's out there who are in it as a business venture, even though there is not really as much money in it as they may have thought before they jumped headfirst into it, which is probably what partially perpetuates some of the practices they use which seem unfair. These are the guys that the op and myself are talking about. They need to be put out of business.

If you are a member of the first group, keep doing what you're doing. Don't get your panties in a bunch when someone complains about the other group. If you're a member of the second group then you will not see me in any of your tournaments because that's how I fight the power...oh and I also complain on the internet.

 

[DavidSauls]

EDIT: REPLY TO YOUR EARLIER POST, BEFORE I READ THE ABOVE

Sorry, I get carried away with this stuff. As best I can tell none of the TDs around my small state are pocketing any significant money running tournaments, and I know of no case where a TD has been ripping off players---and I'm fairly well connnected and in tune with the disc golf scene here.

I believe this is true of most TDs and tournaments everywhere, so perceived attacks on them tend to set me off. But I'm provincial so maybe I'm wrong.

Also, part is not a defensive move but a philosophy. I think we're better off if more players know the general logistics of tournament financials and operations. So, in general, whenever the subject comes up I tend to chime in, whether asked or not.

 

[DavidSauls]

You know, one good thing about the sport's growth is players increasingly have a choice of where to play. Wasn't like that 10 years ago.

You're absolutely right about that last thing. Support the events and TDs you like. Don't attend the ones you don't. TDs will notice. (Which, I think, Goatman mentioned way back a the beginning).

 

[JSpohr-WCDG1]

I can understand where sidewinding and the OP are coming from - barely. I lean more on the side of being thankful for companies and TDs like Dynamic Discs and Non Stop Disc golf for actually being out there organizing and running events all over the country. I WANT them to make a profit!!!!! WOW. I want them to have some incentive to keep pushing and to keep running bigger and better tourneys and the only way thats gonna happen is if there is atleast some way to make money from these events. Yes, they are events for out enjoyment. What other events do we expect to pay to get into and then recieve all of our entries back in prizes and merch. Ams in my opinion should be playing purely for a trophy. If they want merch then they should buy it. I grew up playing competitive sports and we never went into it as amateurs expecting that our entry was to be used as our bet on ourselves and that if we won we should win all the other ams "money". To have the opposite view as some on here, I'd like to thank the TDs out there running great events for a sport I love to compete in. Keep doing it, keep figuring out ways to make profits so you will want to do it bigger and better next year. Don't listen to small complaints that are only trying to limit the growth. Just my side of the debate.

 

[SteezeOG]

EXACTLY! If I want to complain that's my right. If you then complain to me that you don't like me complaining then you are being hypocritical. That means you are doing the very thing that you do not want me doing. So why is it ok for you and not for me and the op? See what I'm saying. Now here opcorn: have some more popcorn and stop being a hypocrite.

lol you're a little bit nuts huh? Complain all you want, OP can complain until his class action lawsuit is dismissed I don't give two flying monkey farts either way. I simply said I don't like people who complain and do nothing. That's my personal feelings on it. No I don't see what you're saying you're babbling in circles and attacking anyone who doesn't have the same cynical pissy viewpoint of TD's. That's all I can gather from it. and I will have some more popcorn. opcorn:


I don't think you understand the definition of complain. If I say I don't like carrots I'm not complaining about them I'm just telling you I don't like them. That's just a personal choice. Now if I say I don't like carrots and give you a list of reasons and tell you I like celery so much better, etc then I'm complaining about carrots. Might wanna look up hypocrite too.

 

[denny ritner]

lol you're a little bit nuts huh? Complain all you want, OP can complain until his class action lawsuit is dismissed I don't give two flying monkey farts either way. I simply said I don't like people who complain and do nothing. That's my personal feelings on it. No I don't see what you're saying you're babbling in circles and attacking anyone who doesn't have the same cynical pissy viewpoint of TD's. That's all I can gather from it. and I will have some more popcorn. opcorn:


I don't think you understand the definition of complain. If I say I don't like carrots I'm not complaining about them I'm just telling you I don't like them. That's just a personal choice. Now if I say I don't like carrots and give you a list of reasons and tell you I like celery so much better, etc then I'm complaining about carrots. Might wanna look up hypocrite too.

 

[SteezeOG]

ok now post a picture of a chihuahua biting at two people's ankles hoping to get attention and become part of their conversation.....we'll call him denny.

 

[denny ritner]

ok now post a picture of a chihuahua biting at two people's ankles hoping to get attention and become part of their conversation.....we'll call him denny.

Shout it out loud!

 

[SteezeOG]

Shout it out loud!

lol he's pretty cool. You win the google award for today. +100interwebz points

 

[denny ritner]

lol he's pretty cool. You win the google award for today. +100interwebz points

sweet. how many interwebz points would cover shipping on 2 rogues and a birdie bag?

 

[Giv'r]

So what have we learned?

Apparently The Milky Way is a ****ty place to live because of all the douchy TDs that operate in that area.

 

[LukeButch]

posts like the OP's are exactly why EVERY tournament for AMATEURS should be trophy-only.

 

[vonDrehle]

the more of these threads i read the more i want to stop giving prizes to ams.

For Ams I would be fine going with nice players packs for everyone and then trophies for the ones that place. In addition to making the tourney wrap up much sooner, some of us travel a good ways for tourneys and the tired Sunday night ride isn't always fun, it would benefit the tournament. You can get things donated for players packs so that could be more money for lunches, an added bonus to the ace pool, or throw the open players an extra bone.

posts like the OP's are exactly why EVERY tournament for AMATEURS should be trophy-only.

...

 

[The Hammer]

Only in disc golf is a person making a profit on anything considered a villain.

 

[Goatman]

It seems that many of you did not see that I admitted fault for my choice of words in my original post.
SAD.
Ams should stop playing in the PDGA. Then maybe all you pros would find out how much you make off of us ams.
If I had done half of the things the TD I complained about did I would be banned from PDGA events. However, since he holds so many tournys that make the PDGA money, he doesn't even get slapped on the hand.

 

[Jay Dub]

Only in disc golf is a person making a profit on anything considered a villain.

I take it you haven't heard about the Occupy movement? But I do agree I hear that a lot from disc golfers on the Internet.

Wham-o was recently criticized on these forums for trying to do just that.

 

[MikePinchico]

Only in disc golf is a person making a profit on anything considered a villain.

Truth

 

[winterer]

The only lesson I've learned from all these pages of misery is 1: do not play in tournaments with sidewinder. 2: shoot, I really do not have a two.

I've TDed one tournament, and it cost me a lot of money and time.You know why I did it? Because it was my turn. If you complainers hate your local TDs, volunteer to run a tournment yourself. You will sound way less ignorant when you argue tournament costs.

Disc Golf does not have a great financial model yet, mostly because dgers are the cheapest humans on the planet, but also because we play the game for the love of it, not for the financial rewards. If you are playing tournments just for the plastic, well, you are in the minority and should not assume that everyone else is fuming as you are. Just remember, if you are paying $40 to play and are expecting to take home plastic, well, just go down to WalMart and buy four discs instead. You'll get your plastic and everyone else will benefit from not having to listen to your whining.

 

[Goatman]

I've TDed one tournament, and it cost me a lot of money and time.You know why I did it? Because it was my turn. If you complainers hate your local TDs, volunteer to run a tournment yourself. You will sound way less ignorant when you argue tournament costs.

I hosted my first of many non-sanctioned events in 1998 on my private home course. No parks department or club to help with installation or upkeep of that course. In 2003 I hosted my first sanctioned event. XC-Tier on the same course followed with a B-Tier on a public course later that year. I have ran sanctioned and non-sanctioned events both on my farm and in public parks including one of the 50 richest B-Tiers one year. I have dealt with other TDs running events, helped at other events, worked with vendors, retailers, and manufacturers. My last sanctioned event had 67 players from 6 states to play a private course with natural tees and a mix of targets from Mach New 2, Instep, Innova Sport, and 9 home-made bakets. My course is currently rated 13th in my state out of 70+ courses.

OH, but I don't know anything about how to be a TD, nor should I be critical of other TDs.

I have been playing for 23 years but I don't know how things are done. RIGHT