[Innova] Innova Atlas (Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't after you)

[theabacus]

Anyone who thinks this is a desperation move by Innova needs to get outside DGCR hype bubble and actually play disc golf.

Although Innova may not have the market share (in percentage) they used to, I would be flabbergasted if they are not producing and selling more discs than ever. Although Latitude 64, Dynamic Discs, Prodigy, and MVP may be popular on the forum, most discs sold in the marketplace are Innova. Innova is still, by far, the easiest discs to find in stores; go to your local course and see how many people are throwing other brands besides Innova and Discraft. Most disc golf stores that carry multiple brands typically carry twice as many Innova discs as any other brand. I've can't say I've ever seen anyone on my local courses (besides me) throw a Volt or Shock...even amongst the tournament players....

 

[Eemeli137]

THIS is why there are no Innova discs in my bag. No manufacturer is perfect, even MVP has some minor consistency issues (I have 2 Tensors with different flight plates to prove it), but you can walk into most shops and pick up 5 of the same Innova mold that all look different from each other. I guess some folks like having to hunt for "good ones", I prefer to not waste money. I suppose by the same token that you could argue that it makes better business sense because they sell more discs that way.

Its weird that discmania and millenium doesnt have as radical concistency problems.Sure innova made + rim pd but even Jussi was angry about that so it wasnt discmanias fault.

 

[Aim For The Chains]

yeah with many other manufatures there are differences among molds in stability but innova litteraly will flip the script on us all and just throw a different top or bottom from two different molds or add a slant or change the PLH and we get some junk disc that flies like TRUE CRAP searching for the one we lost a year ago... Atleast other companies don't generally change their molds unless there are PROBLEMS with them or tweaks required. I hate dealing with people on here who trade innova too you have to have some special color, weight and run to even get a deal and they tend to be the only company who people advertise that way.

 

[MrGlass01]

I think the popularity of other manufacturers is directly coorilated to the local disc shop scene. Areas with shops will see more of the other brands. Areas that dont have dedicated shops will be innova heavy. I don't throw innova anymore, love their molds hate their plastic. That is just my opinion. But it's more likely ill see lat/dd/west side/MVP on my local courses than innova lately. We have a great shop in town. When you have a choice of all the manufacturers, you get to decide what's best, not the interwebs.

 

[tbird888]

Although Innova may not have the market share (in percentage) they used to, I would be flabbergasted if they are not producing and selling more discs than ever.

You're absolutely right. Innova doesn't have the market share in the "serious" market they used to, but that is a small percentage of overall disc golfers. As a company, would you rather lose 5,000 competitive customers and gain 40,000 casual customers or the other way around? Thinking as a business, which sounds more profitable?

As a casual customer looking to get some exercise and enjoy the outdoors, would you spend $20 on a pretty MVP disc with Gyro tech you won't be able to take advantage of or $8-10 for an Innova DX disc that you will either lose or throw for the next ten years because it still flies regardless of how it looks?

 

[MrGlass01]

Innova and consistency. Sure they need some work, but they are pumping out a crap ton more discs than any other manufacturer. If you were to compare failure rates, I'd bet innova is in line with everyone else, it's a sheer volume thing.

 

[remember2morrow]

I think the popularity of other manufacturers is directly coorilated to the local disc shop scene.

Truth. Where I live, you can only find Innova and a few Discraft, for the most part. There is one shop that sells Vibram and they fly off the shelf. Not sure why they won't give other brands a try.

 

[discspeed]

I hope that this method makes it easier to produce discs that are more consistent.

When you mold two pieces it makes it TWICE as hard to be consistent as you are molding two pieces (each subject to the variances of Innova's molding) and putting them together. MVP is consistent in spite of this, certainly not because they overmold.

 

[Aim For The Chains]

also its not that Innova is a bad company by any means-- they make tons of product at a price point which is able to get many consumers/retailers involved in the sport world wide and are an integral part of growing disc golf but damn they have a lot of molds no wonder theres so much mix-up and have to mash out 10x the numbers of other manufacturers.

 

[tbird888]

Not like they did a free exchange for those 1st runs or anything

Did they make the return option known? This is the first time I've heard that, but I don't read the MVP threads so if they did it there, great. That still doesn't mean they have the perfect consistency the fanboys claim though.

 

[discspeed]

I wouldn't be such a hater on MVP. If they didnt redesign the shock after I bought 5 and they were crap.

Well I bought a couple of Blizzard Bosses with the flightplate bubbles when they first came out. They were and are awesome max D discs, possessing much more potential for me than anything else I've thrown. They were selling like mad and the optimism was huge. Since I was running an upcoming tourney I made sure to order as many Blizzard discs as I could thinking I would really be giving the players something special.

So I get my shipment of Blizzard discs and they are crap...No bubbles in the flightplate, awful looking scuffs/grooved lines all over. Worse thing is they flew like crap.

At least MVP corrects their mistakes instead of taking something good and making it crap to meet the crazy demand created by the initial good discs.

 

[tbird888]

At least MVP corrects their mistakes instead of taking something good and making it crap to meet the crazy demand created by the initial good discs.

Wasn't Innova pretty consistent when their production totals were as low as MVP's are now? If they weren't, why are people paying outrageous prices for all that old, "consistent" plastic?

I certainly hope MVP's business plan scales well enough to avoid the same issues Innova has now.

 

[Kenny53691]

This disc looks nice, but I'd definitely have to throw it a time or two to see if it's worth the hype.

 

[dmbrun2]

Tbird that's damn smart.

 

[Aim For The Chains]

Did they make the return option known? This is the first time I've heard that, but I don't read the MVP threads so if they did it there, great. That still doesn't mean they have the perfect consistency the fanboys claim though.

I have never heard MVP is perfect-- nor do they strive to be something that is not even feasible in a business with many variables which can impact how your final product is reviewed by the masses.

However, they do one hell of a QC job and address flaws, mishaps, run consistencies etc better than any other company I have seen to date and they are one of the youngest... Weird!

Its not about being perfect but about making a quality reliable product with a brand you can trust putting money into.

 

[SirRaph]

The lack of patent protection in DG is flabbergasting to me. I had thought I'd heard that Innova had patented the process they use for Blizzard discs. Now a couple of the other companies have released bubble filled discs.

I thought for sure MVP would have patented this technology, and now Innova is copying it. Looking at MVP's website, the GYRO tech is trademarked, but not patented. Why oh why would you not protect yourself from this type of thing?

 

[Streets]

This disc looks nice, but I'd definitely have to throw it a time or two to see if it's worth the hype.

What hype? Only one person on this thread actually said he's seen/held one and said it was cool. So far all this thread has been is an argument over consistency and angry MVP fanboys being angry MVP fanboys because the "Great Satan" that is Innova is trying their hand at an overmold.

 

[oddjob]

The lack of patent protection in DG is flabbergasting to me. I had thought I'd heard that Innova had patented the process they use for Blizzard discs. Now a couple of the other companies have released bubble filled discs.

I thought for sure MVP would have patented this technology, and now Innova is copying it. Looking at MVP's website, the GYRO tech is trademarked, but not patented. Why oh why would you not protect yourself from this type of thing?

Maybe the tech was already patented, mvp isn't the first to come up with it.

I'm sure they explored their options b/c rumor has it that Innova came after them when they were getting off the ground.

 

[g2avity]

Maybe they patented the way they produce their overmold, and thus Innova has gotten aroudn it by producing theirs differently?

 

[tbird888]

I have never heard MVP is perfect-- nor do they strive to be something that is not even feasible in a business with many variables which can impact how your final product is reviewed by the masses.

There are posts in this thread where people make the claim that every MVP disc of each mold flies exactly the same as every other one. That sounds like a perfection claim to me.

I'm not saying that I think MVP makes a terrible product. I'm just tired of hearing that they don't make mistakes. Hell, their first mold had to be completely redesigned because of consistency issues. It went from being stable to having the beef of a Wizard. People bust on other companies for selling discs under similar situations but seem to forget that no company has yet to have been free of those kinds of problems.