PDGA Tournament Option

[Harrishabitat]

Presenting ideas...

Apparently they were bad ones.

BTW regarding work - The longest unemployment streak I've had in the 27 years (since I was 16) was three months. I was fired for breaking up a fight at work between two individuals. One of whom was a minority. They filed a complaint. As a supervisor, I was let go to avoid litigation.

The other employment streak was 5 weeks - by my choice - because I moved and was setting up a non-profit entity.

Married, children, mortgage, 2 car payments, other hobbies like homebrewing = life choices = don't want to / afford to play a $40 tournament every weekend.

Enough time wasted - I'm going back to work.

And the point of all of that was?

 

[Thumber]

And the point of all of that was?

I wish I had more money to play more golf, but I don't, so it would be nice if the TDs would offer me a reduced entry fee so I can play more without really supporting the efforts of the TD. And you are all entitled cheapskates for using this website.

 

[ScottyLove]

I see this as a serious problem that is unsustainable. Events should be successful based on the quality of the event itself, and it's own merits. A TD shouldn't have to pay people to show up to his/her event. If the only way you can get people to your event is by paying them, you have a crap product.

So what are these magical "own merits" you speak of? I think the whole point folks are trying to make to the OP is that you can't get folks to come for just the spirit of competition... that's just baloney talk. As the TD, i make ZERO $$... and worked my ass off raising over $6000 for a C-Tier. Folks loved it and will be coming back. My joy was in the heartfelt "thank you"s I received. Many called it the best tournament of the year. Everyone including pros got a great player pack, 40-page caddy book, 6 CTP contest, ACE pots, roped OB, elevated baskets, raffle for super nice swag... oh yeah... and the best payout around because we added $1000 cash across all tiers.

And almost every tour stop was similar... and it's getting bigger next year. Still trying to figure out what I did wrong because the overwhelming sentiments is, "We can't wait for 2014!!"

 

[Horsman]

I like the thought, but as other's say it isn't practical.

I also feel the motivation behind the post. I am newer to DG and every time I ask folks if they want to play, they say 'join the league'. My local league is nuffin' but a gambling group and I do not want to gamble/ waste money (as I said, I am new so there will always be someone better than me).


It is frustrating to have to pay to play with folks...

However, there is a huge difference between putting together a PDGA sanctioned event (and all it entails) and putting on a weekly local league at the park.

Yea, you run into people like that everywhere. The "better" players feel as though they shouldnt be seen with a newbie becuase they are gods gift to dg. I know I do a lot of solo rounds but thats because I want to work on stuff and having someone with me will just slow me down, so they might be doing the same thing but if I were you I would just keep playing and you will find other players like you or others that arent dicks that you will be able to play with.

 

[Thumber]

Scotty,

I think what you are doing is pretty good sounding, but is it sustainable? All these tournaments are run by volunteers and as a very active member of my local club, I can attest that volunteer burnout is a serious issue. What happens when you invest tons of your time building this awesome series, but in a few years, get tired of all the work involved and want to step back? Having volunteers out hustling to find added cash is a big job. All that work for no pay eventually starts to grate on volunteers. It gets exacerbated if players are complaining.

 

[The Hammer]

So what are these magical "own merits" you speak of? I think the whole point folks are trying to make to the OP is that you can't get folks to come for just the spirit of competition... that's just baloney talk. As the TD, i make ZERO $$... and worked my ass off raising over $6000 for a C-Tier. Folks loved it and will be coming back. My joy was in the heartfelt "thank you"s I received. Many called it the best tournament of the year. Everyone including pros got a great player pack, 40-page caddy book, 6 CTP contest, ACE pots, roped OB, elevated baskets, raffle for super nice swag... oh yeah... and the best payout around because we added $1000 cash across all tiers.

And almost every tour stop was similar... and it's getting bigger next year. Still trying to figure out what I did wrong because the overwhelming sentiments is, "We can't wait for 2014!!"

Quality of the course, unique format, well organized, side games, etc.....

I just ran an event with no payout, and no players pack. It was easily filled, got rave reviews, and I had people from out-of-state contacting me to try to get in, and expand to their areas.

I didn't have to bribe a soul, because the event was good enough to sell itself.

 

[ru4por]

Lost is the value of my entertainment dollar. I chose to play unsactioned events because they provide the opportunity to be entertained. I could go see a hockey game, concert, play whirlyball...A debate could ensue as to what I get out of any of that. We all have a finite entertainment budget, to complain how you use your budget, is on you. I personally think 20 or 30 bucks to get a whole day of golf, a disc, maybe a meal or water and the chance to hang with like minded folks is well spent. If I did not think that, I would not go.

 

[DG_Before_Breakfast]

Sounds like you shouldn't play those tournaments, and should just compete against yourself or friends.

It isn't free to organize these events, that is what you are really paying for - the right to play a organized event.

 

[Stardoggy]

You could always just play with yourself. Then you'd never lose.

 

[ScottyLove]

Scotty,

I think what you are doing is pretty good sounding, but is it sustainable? All these tournaments are run by volunteers and as a very active member of my local club, I can attest that volunteer burnout is a serious issue. What happens when you invest tons of your time building this awesome series, but in a few years, get tired of all the work involved and want to step back? Having volunteers out hustling to find added cash is a big job. All that work for no pay eventually starts to grate on volunteers. It gets exacerbated if players are complaining.

I hope it is... I'll admit I'm only in my 2nd year in the sport, but 2014 will be the 7th year for the Disc Golf Monkey Tour... so it seems very sustainable so far. Every year has gotten bigger and better. It started out very small and in it's 6th year had 11 C-Tiers, 3 B-Tiers, and 1 A-Tier. No signs of slowing down at the moment... maybe because the sport itself continues to grow and as the weary step aside, new blood (ie. folks like me) step in to take the reigns.

And I've not heard any of this whining and complaining folks keeps talking about and believe me I keep my ears open. And yes, my crew of volunteers worked very hard to raise the money, but each one is ready to step up again next year.

I guess we'll see.

One positive note nobody should be able to take issue with is that this tour continues to lead EVERYONE out there in donations to E.D.G.E. with more than 10% of everything they get coming from just this one source.

 

[The Hammer]

Lost is the value of my entertainment dollar. I chose to play unsactioned events because they provide the opportunity to be entertained. I could go see a hockey game, concert, play whirlyball...A debate could ensue as to what I get out of any of that. We all have a finite entertainment budget, to complain how you use your budget, is on you. I personally think 20 or 30 bucks to get a whole day of golf, a disc, maybe a meal or water and the chance to hang with like minded folks is well spent. If I did not think that, I would not go.

:clap:

People seem to forget that the product a TD is providing is not a service, or tangible item. The TD's job is to provide an experience. The problem is that tournaments have just become carbon copies of one another. The only differentiating quality are ever increasing payouts, players packs, or courses. Very few TD's are attempting to create unique experiences.

Examples of good ones that come to mind are Texas Teams, Vibram, Am Nats, and The Players Cup. These aren't just tournaments, they are unique experiences.

 

[Harrishabitat]

So what are these magical "own merits" you speak of? I think the whole point folks are trying to make to the OP is that you can't get folks to come for just the spirit of competition... that's just baloney talk. As the TD, i make ZERO $$... and worked my ass off raising over $6000 for a C-Tier. Folks loved it and will be coming back. My joy was in the heartfelt "thank you"s I received. Many called it the best tournament of the year. Everyone including pros got a great player pack, 40-page caddy book, 6 CTP contest, ACE pots, roped OB, elevated baskets, raffle for super nice swag... oh yeah... and the best payout around because we added $1000 cash across all tiers.

And almost every tour stop was similar... and it's getting bigger next year. Still trying to figure out what I did wrong because the overwhelming sentiments is, "We can't wait for 2014!!"

That sounds so much like most first time TD's that I have talked to. For your sake I truly hope it's sustainable for you

 

[Harrishabitat]

:clap:

People seem to forget that the product a TD is providing is not a service, or tangible item. The TD's job is to provide an experience. The problem is that tournaments have just become carbon copies of one another. The only differentiating quality are ever increasing payouts, players packs, or courses. Very few TD's are attempting to create unique experiences. Examples of good ones that come to mind are Texas Teams, Vibram, Am Nats, and The Players Cup.

That is why our little tournament up here in Wyoming was such a huge success...we did things differently. Final round was a temp course set up on a ball golf course. CTP's for prizes after the round, played a game of pinks (other events have even asked me to run that at their events now).

Be original and be fun. Try to cater to the majority of the players not the loud minority.

I think it's funny to hear all of the complaining about what we need to do to get more people at events when nearly ever event that I have heard of in the places where I play, Arizona, Colorado, So Cal, they all are filled and have waiting lists.

 

[Harrishabitat]

:clap:

People seem to forget that the product a TD is providing is not a service, or tangible item. The TD's job is to provide an experience. The problem is that tournaments have just become carbon copies of one another. The only differentiating quality are ever increasing payouts, players packs, or courses. Very few TD's are attempting to create unique experiences.

Examples of good ones that come to mind are Texas Teams, Vibram, Am Nats, and The Players Cup. These aren't just tournaments, they are unique experiences.

And just for the record, major congrats for the running of the team challenge...I've heard that it was a great event!

 

[ScottyLove]

:clap:

People seem to forget that the product a TD is providing is not a service, or tangible item. The TD's job is to provide an experience. The problem is that tournaments have just become carbon copies of one another. The only differentiating quality are ever increasing payouts, players packs, or courses. Very few TD's are attempting to create unique experiences.

Examples of good ones that come to mind are Texas Teams, Vibram, Am Nats, and The Players Cup. These aren't just tournaments, they are unique experiences.

Oh... I forgot to add the we had an E.D.G.E Skill Shot challenge type of added event on Sunday sponsored by dgNOMAD in which all of the winners, unbeknownst to them, walked away with a trophy towel, bag tag, and dgNOMAD target.

That's the kind of fun added bonus stuff folks seem to like.

Okay... I heard one complaint sort of. We have a great course already and some said it was not necessary to trick it up with extra OB lines. I just wanted to bring an A-Tier feel for a C-Tier price. The course is already hard enough.

 

[The Hammer]

And just for the record, major congrats for the running of the team challenge...I've heard that it was a great event!

Thank you! The feedback has been overwhelmingly positive. The problem now is trying to manage how big it gets.

 

[Pwingles]

Yep.

Entitlement is more than just the DG tournie. It is getting something for nothing.

You are getting the use of this website for nothing.

Pay up - buy a membership.

Im sorry, but i dont see the connection in these two examples outside of them being DG related. Is there a backstory idk about? If so then ignore me, but the fact (yes its a fact) that most people who play dg and attend events and have never ran one have complained about things that they would never dream of bringing up had they ever ran an event, and also, feel like they should get something for showing up.

How is that comparable to someone merely posting on this site and participating in the discussions this site is meant to inspire? Did he complain about the functionality or something?

 

[Pwingles]

Oh... I forgot to add the we had an E.D.G.E Skill Shot challenge type of added event on Sunday sponsored by dgNOMAD in which all of the winners, unbeknownst to them, walked away with a trophy towel, bag tag, and dgNOMAD target.

That's the kind of fun added bonus stuff folks seem to like.

Okay... I heard one complaint sort of. We have a great course already and some said it was not necessary to trick it up with extra OB lines. I just wanted to bring an A-Tier feel for a C-Tier price. The course is already hard enough.

I wish you didnt have to change that hole, it looked like it took a long time to set up and rope off. It was a separator for sure.

 

[Bacon]

Play against yourself and compare them to tournament scores if that is your stance. TD's are not getting rich off of these events usually if there are any profits they go into courses.
There are almost no free competitive events. Even races have entrance fees. If you dont like it as others have stated run your own events or dont play. If the PDGA inserts a free play feature that will be the death of our sport.

 

[Thumber]

The myth that DG is free has already done loads of damage