ALL Mach baskets should be outlawed in pro tournaments!

[onemilemore]

We can all be mad at mach 5s, however, the DGPT mandated that only 4 baskets were to be used.. yet they fell on their freaking face when they allowed a non-sanctioned basket to be used at fiesta.. blame the DGPT.

Yeah I think this was a little bit of a misstep. I remember Dodge saying that they had these standards coming out, but that they wouldn't be able to achieve it 100% in the first year. Made me scratch my head a little, and it came to be a bit of an issue this week. I don't see why they couldn't have quietly rolled out improved baskets where possible without making a point of the standardization. Instead, they touted the 4 baskets, and then when they weren't all there people were, understandably, upset. Something for the tour to consider as the season rolls on.

 

[FlipFlat]

Spend enough time practicing, you can putt on anything.

Blaming the basket is the hallmark of a lousy putter. Or, someone looking for excuses instead of taking responsibility for poor putting.

This

 

[thrembo]

Or you could go old school and throw at trees. No spit outs on object courses!

 

[mmblink86]

^^^yes. and, maybe not as old school, but one can also putt to the bottom of the basket instead of rocketing at the chains like most modern 'pros' do.

 

[thrembo]

How about using the modern baskets, but play them object style. Any metal hit counts as in. I would have a heck of a lot more aces!

 

[Flick Maniac]

I think all of the Ricky "spit outs" that I personally saw were not center. I dont consider putts that hit to the side at all and dont stick to be true spit outs.

 

[Smigles]

Spitouts happen mostly if you hit the pole and the putt still has too much momentum and no chains in the way to hold the putter back on the way out.

As many have said, they will always happen if you putt too strong. You most spectacularly see it with Rickys inside the circle putts. He does not even remotely make a 10 meters putt, he just throws his putter as hard as he can at the basket no matter what distance.

 

[armiller]

I like what someone said earlier: if Rick were to come on here, he might be the last one to complain about the baskets. They're a fact of life that varies somewhat from tournament to tournament, and the pros have always had to take that variation into consideration. I still don't see how this tournaments bad spit outs were different from any other's.

 

[Consult20]

If you were starting from scratch to develop a new game you were going to call disc golf, how would you design the holing out device?

(I'm thinking chains might not be involved.)

Actually, to me, the chain catching aspect is a big part of what makes disc golf holing out "fun, but challenging". If a bushel basket or hole in the ground type catching device were the standard, holing out would not be anywhere near as fun to me. And that includes playing and watching. Compared to throwing at a bushel basket, even Chainstars would seem like utopia!

 

[Wood Chuk]

Tone poles for the win!

Cones could solve your problem. Never chain out again.

I have never had a spit out on a tone pole...

 

[Consult20]

McBeth said he would rather play on the baskets at Fiesta than the Xs. I'm sure if you asked 10 other pros, you'd get 10 other responses.

Did he say specifically why?

 

[lyleoross]

Did he say specifically why?

Watch the Jomez vids from round four. He comments on the directly. He gives some insight as to why he doesn't like them.

 

[mj20300]

It was a LOT more than two shots. Just watch the various Memorial Tournament videos...

I would, but sheer boredom kept me from seeing all the hyzers

 

[Reniger]

One of my favorite quotes is "These are Mach 3s, which everyone knows, can't even catch a cold."

 

[_MTL_]

A few things I think are important to add in this conversation and to comment on multiple posts I've read.

1. First off, the argument that "everyone has to use them so it's fair" is, IMHO, misguided. Fairness is not and should not be defined as unfair for everyone. I don't want to live in a world where I'm sent to prison for a year for speeding and told "well, that's what the last guy got."

2. I don't see a time where the PDGA mandates baskets for events anytime soon for a few reasons. Mainly, the PDGA doesn't produce a basket. This means that they are using outside resources and essentially endorsing them. I see a lot of pararells where this occurs - "Spaulding is the official ball of the NBA" - but I don't think the PDGA is ready to take such a stance for or against a company. Imagine if they said "it must be discatcher 28s. That's a slap in the face to Discraft, Prodigy, DGA, DD and all the other companies that make quality baskets.

Let's say, for the sake of discussion, that happens. So now Emporia is told "if you want to continue to host the Glass Blown Open, Jeremy, you have to get rid of your own product and use your competitors." That is NOT a good look for the PDGA.

3. Mandating that you can or can't use certain baskets in events greatly limits a lot of courses / clubs from running events. The PDGA still is in a quantity state as a organization and isn't quite ready for the shift to quality.

4. Different baskets react differently to different putts. For example, I putt nose down and typically pretty flat. Mach 3s and 5s, that most people have issues with, I don't. I have more putts bounce back on something like a Mach X or a Prodigy basket than I do cut throughs on Mach 3s. I truly believe that someone who commits their livelihood to playing the sport should do offseason practice on multiple types of baskets and see how certain baskets react to certain putts. Is it worth going to a pitch putt instead of a spin on a Mach 3 based event even if you aren't as comfortable? This is somewhat similiar a lot conversations of anchoring putters in golf.

5. This isn't the PDGA's fault, rather the companies that produced the baskets.

 

[Consult20]

Watch the Jomez vids from round four. He comments on the directly. He gives some insight as to why he doesn't like them.

A Readers Digest version of his comments would be appreciated.

 

[_MTL_]

i personally think the best catching baskets (for all types of putters / spin/ push/ fast /slow/ hyzer/anyhyzer/high/low/strong or weak side) are Innova Discatcher Pro baskets.....

but even those (which are the ones they use for all the DGWT events) can have HORRRIFIC SPIT OUTS.

2014 World Championships... Steve Brinster...

Compiled spit outs from Steve Brinster's 2014 worlds IN ONE ROUND!!! (man if you computed the strokes from his spit outs you realize how close he was to that top card in the end).


https://youtu.be/XuDbL6ciARA?t=169
https://youtu.be/XuDbL6ciARA?t=394 (not a spit out but spit back!)
https://youtu.be/XuDbL6ciARA?t=634 (aaaaaallllmoooossst)
https://youtu.be/XuDbL6ciARA?t=945
https://youtu.be/XuDbL6ciARA?t=1580


mach x and prodigy baskets catch pretty much all fast center putts... but have horrific push outs for soft putters. all baskets have strengths and weaknesses.

Link 2 didn't bounce back. Listen to the putt. He hits basket. Not cage.

 

[erock216]

Mach X's are great baskets. Nothing to see here.

 

[lyleoross]

A Readers Digest version of his comments would be appreciated.

He talked about bounce outs and left hand weakness. Especially on elevated baskets. It's actually worth listening to because they talk some about course design.

Beyond that I'd have to go back and watch it again.

 

[Ender175]

We can all be mad at mach 5s, however, the DGPT mandated that only 4 baskets were to be used.. yet they fell on their freaking face when they allowed a non-sanctioned basket to be used at fiesta.. blame the DGPT.

can't believe it took 6 pages for someone to point out that the mach 5 that rejected Philo's ace already isn't dgpt approved. The baskets also weren't the only aspect of that course that wasn't pro tour worthy.