Guy stands in field to try and throw plastic to 400.

[RFrance]

^^^^

Disc golf Elephant Walk

 

[Parbequeue]

Parbeque this is great. The Elephant Walk makes a lot more sense to me now. For golf his snout hangs low and I would go through the motions and understand the importance of the drill but couldn't really get the benefit. But seeing this I realize for disc golf, the snout/arm needs to be raised up and level. Now I get it. :wall:

So glad to hear that Rfrance! I too, understood the importance of elephant walk but because I was manipulating my hips instead of "letting go" I never felt the power.

I just played a round using mostly a micro step version of this (almost golf swing-esque) and only went and shot a PB of -8!!! Unbelievable!
I hit every intended line, truly effortlessly. HUBS' one step vid makes more sense now, how the lower body generated power makes more sense now!

Literally all I was thinking about was; step -> post up on rear leg completely turned back, step -> repeat the same! I was throwing further than my entire time on the journey... relevant = :wall:

 

[Parbequeue]

Well, had another super fun round with this simplified version of driving yesterday. Much to my surprise (also pain, also amusement, a true rollercoaster of plastic throwing emotions) I out drove my previous best drives on several holes, including a couple of 400+ bombs which I was very pleased with, all from
This one step (still a bit wtf about it!!!)

I'm more excited than ever to build off of this. There were a few shots where I either threw into the ground about 30ft in front of the tee and then got 300ft of skip carry (haha entertaining to watch), or I released right about 20/30 degrees off line. I self diagnosed both of these, but I would love some guidance too.

1. Throwing into the ground - the best way I feel the power / weight of the disc is with a low swing arc, just above the waist - this has been a common theme for me. This, (and not getting on the front leg sooner) is why I figured I got the ground hits.
Reason being is that when I bring the disc higher up to get into any powerpocket at chest height, I lose that heavy momentum feeling instantly. Like I can only feel the windmill acceleration with a almost feldy swing plane.

Here's a vid showing what I mean- at the start of the round;




2. The releases to the right were due to me being too open. I attempted to correct this with a very closed stance, but it gets confusing which way I should be stepping and shifting my weight.



After a few ground releases I made a good effort to get onto the front side quicker - this was the result, I paused a second at the top of the backswing to make sure I was getting onto the front leg before swinging.




After the round I saw a great gif of Wiggins doing what appeared to be an extreme hyzer one step.
I kinda figured I needed to get the ground quicker and faster now. I don't really feel the whip like I do before but next field sesh will play around.



Disclaimer; I didn't get out to the field yet to play around with this new simplified one step.

 

[sidewinder22]

Looks smooth, but it's all over-rotated and over the top which is why you throw some into the dirt as your body is telegraphing downward.

Your left arm going behind your back drives me crazy. It helps you over-rotate and kills shifting.

Your front hip needs to resist collapsing. The Move part 2. You over close your front foot because you collapse and over-rotate everything else.

Your grip is still too much on the front edge instead of the outside edge of the disc.

 

[Parbequeue]

Hmm damn still over rotating in the backswing. Maybe I'll play with not doing any rotating (or what feels like rotating. Is the Wiggins clip on the right track? I will get the off arm sorted haha it's always an afterthought - perhaps that's something that shouldn't be!

 

[sidewinder22]

IDK, your left arm is way out there in the Wiggins clip. Left arm needs to help bring the hips forward and pin them to the front leg underneath the upper body/shoulders.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxnhM5amro0#t=23s

 

[Parbequeue]

Welp. Turns out I still didn't have the hips right.

This video got me back on track.



Another thing was holding me back was my arm - way too tense. Somewhere along the way I had started to try and juice it to the heavy power spot you can feel doing windmill drill. No Bueno, over the top and lower body fighting upper body. More fake pocket.

I have a few clips but the only improvement is the lower body. I think I'm losing hip depth and my posture needs work. My left arm was flying because I was telling myself to stay loose (both arms). After doing this for so long it's actually really hard to not let it be loose. Even when I focusing purely on the left arm - it would still end up flying!

Now I have to combine dingle arm with this lower body and I think I might be onto something. Buzzz went 350 on this gross flat ish swing plane!






My biggest takeaways are that I was moving the hips away from the target during/before the backswing. It made it impossible to shift from behind. Now my butt is moving (wiping) towards the target the whole time. It feels like after a certain point it locks into/engages with the lead leg and from there it's like you're in one leg drill. Hope that makes sense. Previous to this I had pretty much moved the hips every other way conceivable haha. Oh well. Now it feels very stable. That's the best way I can think of describing it.

Lots to work on but hopefully another piece of the puzzle.

 

[Parbequeue]

This took WAY too long to understand. But I *think* I'm finally getting it. I'm falling backwards a bit, so I think I'm not finishing fully on the plant leg. And could shift lower body a bit sooner although hard to say with angle.

I think I finally understand the whole striding straight / hips rotate in place thing. Striding straight (or even right side tee) makes the hips move far easier than striding slightly to the left like soooo many ams (including myself forever).

Was crazy windy with just a putter but feeling good about it, like I'm going in the right direction again. Really appreciate everyone's patience... :wall:

 

[Parbequeue]

Haha. Soooo yeah, can almost disregard everything that came before this post, I've been on SUCH the wrong road when it comes to the disc golf swing. I'm pretty sure I've been throwing the disc every wrong way conceivable. Both hilarious and frustrating but hey ho every days a school day. Maybe I'll be posting this exact thing again in a few months haha.

The first light bulb was when I made that flossing video;



Once I understood that, the whole rocking the hips thread started to make sense, along with some other things. (Especially that kettle bell swing video).
I was pretty much dancing around the house doing the Drk shuffle (best way I can describe it) a rhythmic shuffle step, my x step felt so much more in balance now, all I was thinking about was that hip motion, and feldy hip to sky. Here's a brief video of where I was, and now where I'm at. My balance / throw has lots to work on but this is more of an explanation video than form check - dx teebird went 350 about 8ft off the ground, felt like a didn't even throw it.




Hopefully that explains it. YES I know literally everyone ever has said it's not rotational but up until the floss I wasn't sure what rotation even comprised off. I was interpreting everything wrong. We can get an idea that we perceive to be "correct" but be so far off. What makes this worse is that it's actually hard to see if it's wrong, you can be close and it looks correct but still not have it right. Any way I digress...

The 2nd huge thing was understanding or just even finally realizing what reciprocating dingle arm is.
For some reason, despite watching the vids and reading the threads a THOUSAND times, I had missed the super obvious bit (you know, basically the entire video) where SW Demonstrates that to throw properly and efficiently there has to be a rotation in the shoulder socket. Man, SW, I'm so sorry this took so long, you've told me sooo many times :wall:

I was just messing around at home trying to figure out why tf I'm still rounding and a bunch of other stuff. I put my disc at the hit, and did the pendulum slowly to the top of the backswing. I repeated this a few times and sure enough started to feel that little tug on the disc as my arm rotated into the hit position. Holy moly did I ever want to throw my face into a wall (and celebrate at the same time!). All the hammer drills, heavy stuff, I wasn't focused on the right feeling, holding it wrong, manipulating it etc etc.

SO.

Once upon a time I thought the throw was based on a lot of rotation, slow into fast twitchy , snappy motions , twisting and making my body do all kinds of weird things.

Now, I think I'm seeing that the throw is far more linear, up and down side to side. You do a floss dance with your arm being this long whip that you toss back and forth, when you do the final floss move (hip to sky)and brace, this allows your arm to whip forward, rotate to your point of release (not forcefully, just naturally) and you hold onto the disc and it just pops out. Everything feels long and slow but rhythmic.

What I'm describing is essentially feldy swing, I'm not sure just yet how to make this USA style without manipulating the disc. But I have a feeling when I get more practice in, my swings going to be better than ever.

I also am potentially realizing that you either throw far, or you don't. There are things that help get small gainz, but the fundamental movement allows you to throw far with little effort. I'm not quite there yet but closer than ever. Despite the ups and downs, I am still enjoying the process, be it a long one! I hope this helps someone.


Here's a more balanced throw, it was basically a year ago to this day that I got a feeling for things working together. Funny how things work out like that! I think I'm too uptight to get full dingle and need to swing further forward out to target.

Year ago;




Yesterday;

 

[BruisedOoze]

Thank you for posting your journey Parbequeue. Loved reading your journal as it were. It's weird the circles we run in chasing certain things only to realize how "simple" it was the whole time.

I may have missed some detail in your thread (1000+ posts!), but I'm getting the feeling you're local as that looks like Hole 9 Baker park in your latest video there.

 

[Parbequeue]

Thank you for posting your journey Parbequeue. Loved reading your journal as it were. It's weird the circles we run in chasing certain things only to realize how "simple" it was the whole time.

I may have missed some detail in your thread (1000+ posts!), but I'm getting the feeling you're local as that looks like Hole 9 Baker park in your latest video there.

Hello there, neighbour! I am in Calgary. Nice to see some other Canadians here.

Yeah the 1000+ posts is pretty much SW and others trying to explain the same things to me and me going around in circles / down the wrong interpretation path. There's a few good moments of understanding in there. ....somewhere

Say hi if you see me on the course!

 

[BruisedOoze]

Hello there, neighbour! I am in Calgary. Nice to see some other Canadians here.

Yeah the 1000+ posts is pretty much SW and others trying to explain the same things to me and me going around in circles / down the wrong interpretation path. There's a few good moments of understanding in there. ....somewhere

Say hi if you see me on the course!

I may ask for a couple tips as well even though you're still on the long road.

It's just great reading the tought process, the steps forwards and backwards, and the general puzzling.

Courses are getting a little packed wiht the warmer weather coming in, and with David Richardson out, this new course at Richmond Green can't come soon enough!

 

[Parbequeue]

Lots of good ideas and learnin's for me over the past few weeks. Switching off my brain and just swinging is the hard bit. I keep finding things I was so wrong about, which does absolutely nothing great for my anxiety levels I'm so far down the line now tho I just laugh.

Quicker to show in videos than to type see below for TLDR












TLDR; (in order)
-rotation of arm in shoulder socket instead of flat swing plane on a tilt. :wall: Old grip sucked. New grip feels awesome. outcome is FULL EXTENSION OUT TO TARGET/HIT

-hips working like feldberg hip to sky, hip to ground, hip to sky. No rotation. At all.

-backswing happening cos I told it to, rotating back instead of swinging back (manipulation vs loading) rotating x step situation + pre swing out to totally wrong place.

-result is wide af pre swing (to hit point) and backswing, striding laterally, swinging the imaginary heavy disc, loading up core/lats and then hips to sky to start swinging that weight forward, extending out with full extension to hit point.

What's the definition of insanity? Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. :wall: :wall: :wall:

 

[Parbequeue]

I've also been thinking about the hips differently since the flossing discovery. I was wondering how to keep lateral leverage from the rear side and not waste that whilst transitioning. I saw that mcbeth legs zoomed in gif where his legs are like pistons and that got me thinking along these lines. This would also tie into what door drill is showing. Although I don't feel a drop, it feels far more active and engaged throughout the whole sequence up > down also lateral targetward > pop/press/squeeze up hips to sky, harder I press faster everything comes around.

 

[sidewinder22]

 

[Parbequeue]

NO WAY I almost started a thread on this the other day!

 

[Parbequeue]

This is essentially how I finally understood both grip and dingle shoulder

Not sure if this will help, but here's what worked for me. I spent months trying to throw the hammer like a disc as Sidewinder mentioned above, trying to throw it really hard and muscle it out there.

I revisited the "hammer pound" thread from Blake T, and started trying to do some of the drills with a hammer instead of a disc. That was the light bulb for me.

https://www.dgcoursereview.com/dgr/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=19220

I found the lever drill particularly effective with a hammer. If you do exactly what he's describing with a hammer instead of a disc, you'll feel how your arm/wrist/ thumb just naturally leverage the disc out to the right side of your body. Just swinging your shoulder and leading with the handle and it just happens like magic.

Part 4 Faliure #3: The Lever

Grip the disc like you are holding a steering wheel with 1 hand, leaned back, and trying to look cool while cruising. Your hand should be at 12 o'clock with the majority of your palm on top of the disc. Your fingers will be curled under and onto the rim wall, intersecting the rim at ~90 degrees. The disc should be pretty much perpendicular to the forearm and seam of the hand. This isn't a drill meant for throwing, just for establishing a feel.

Lean forward slightly and dangle your arm in front of you with your arm straight until you are holding the disc at about mid-thigh height (it will vary based upon your arm length). The disc should be between your hand and your body. Slowly rock your right shoulder back and forth letting your arm and the disc pendulum back and forth in a completely relaxed manner. Gradually increase the distance the pendulum travels to the right side. As you pass beyond the right side of your body and get a ways away, you should notice that your hand naturally rotates from being on the far edge of the disc (opposite from your body) to the right edge of the disc. As you build this feel start to use a quicker shoulder motion to the right and pull around the disc so that your hand turns around the disc to the near edge of the disc. Push with your thumb as you pull through the turn.

You should feel the edge of the disc opposite your grip being "levered" out and around. Do this a few times to build the feel.

 

[RFrance]

It looks like Seppo is a good example of using the Lever.

This is essentially how I finally understood both grip and dingle shoulder

Part 4 Faliure #3: The Lever

Grip the disc like you are holding a steering wheel with 1 hand, leaned back, and trying to look cool while cruising. Your hand should be at 12 o'clock with the majority of your palm on top of the disc. Your fingers will be curled under and onto the rim wall, intersecting the rim at ~90 degrees. The disc should be pretty much perpendicular to the forearm and seam of the hand. This isn't a drill meant for throwing, just for establishing a feel.

Lean forward slightly and dangle your arm in front of you with your arm straight until you are holding the disc at about mid-thigh height (it will vary based upon your arm length). The disc should be between your hand and your body. Slowly rock your right shoulder back and forth letting your arm and the disc pendulum back and forth in a completely relaxed manner. Gradually increase the distance the pendulum travels to the right side. As you pass beyond the right side of your body and get a ways away, you should notice that your hand naturally rotates from being on the far edge of the disc (opposite from your body) to the right edge of the disc. As you build this feel start to use a quicker shoulder motion to the right and pull around the disc so that your hand turns around the disc to the near edge of the disc. Push with your thumb as you pull through the turn.

You should feel the edge of the disc opposite your grip being "levered" out and around. Do this a few times to build the feel.

 

[RFrance]

Sorry for the sidebar but every time I read this: "Grip the disc like you are holding a steering wheel with 1 hand, leaned back, and trying to look cool while cruising." I think of Cedric the Entertainer.

https://youtu.be/fiTC8GfBFSE?t=62

 

[Parbequeue]

Exactly! It's a great analogy, man I really overlooked grip prior to this. It's almost like if the grips not right you aren't able to feel where to leverage the disc correctly!

More snow here today, hoping this is all correct and I can try it out.