I love how you keep bringing oil into the situation. The new season of River Monsters starts tonight, that man can teach you how to fish.
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Your PDGA 'tax' dollars at work (now hijack free)
- Thread starter Vegan Ray
- Start date
So does ours so it seems we are at an impasse.
Fact of the matter is there are at least three camps on this:
1) Apalled by drinking with member fees
2) Could care less
3) Has no problems with it if it is within reason
I am with #3 because I know how stressful full day meetings are and would have no problem with them unwinding with dinner on my dime IF they were there representing what I want to see in the sport...if they arent I still wouldn't have a problem with them drinking but would probably vote them out.
Fact of the matter is there are at least three camps on this:
1) Apalled by drinking with member fees
2) Could care less
3) Has no problems with it if it is within reason
I am with #3 because I know how stressful full day meetings are and would have no problem with them unwinding with dinner on my dime IF they were there representing what I want to see in the sport...if they arent I still wouldn't have a problem with them drinking but would probably vote them out.
Please keep your logic off this thread.
- Joined
- Apr 1, 2009
- Messages
- 3,273
Feldberg is just pissed off that the PDGA won't pick up the tab for his libations.
VictorB
* Ace Member *
Feldberg is just pissed off that the PDGA won't pick up the tab for his libations.
I'm fairly certain that you either didn't read the OP or didn't comprehend it.
Billnchristy, would you like it if your local club was paying for dinner and drinks for the local BoD with member fees? Just because the PDGA isn't local doesn't make them exempt from the standards that you should be holding your local volunteers to.
Lithicon
* Ace Member *
- Joined
- Nov 11, 2009
- Messages
- 2,140
So really, within "reason"? How much is within reason? And, why should there be a judgment called made of how much is within "reason". I think this falls under the "There is no defense needed if there is no action to defend" situation. Because everyone will have a different opinion of within "reason". Sure good judgement is the deciding factor in reasoning, but as I've pointed out is severely lacking in this world. Just as I've clearly pointed out this "within reason" method doesn't justify the action nearly as often as people want to justify it. Like I pointed out with the oil companies, people should only be exploited if it's "within reason". Then it's perfectly fine, and people shouldn't worry. That's the same dumb logic you're applying.
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What are they doing?
Did they just spend 8 hours discussing how to bring worlds to the area and are mentally and physically drained or did they just meet up at the bar to talk about putting in a new pin position?
Yes...my brain does work this way. If you are on the BoD and you are doing GOOD work and legitimate work then no, I don't mind you buying a drink with my money as I feel I have gotten my moneys worth. These people are "paid" for their ideas and for their passion. If they feel the need to have a drink or two with dinner and continue to produce good ideas then I have absolutely no issues.
However, my $15 local club membership won't get you too many drinks.
As for what is within reason? What does a normal person drink when they go to dinner if they have a drink? 1-2, maybe 3 if there is a long talk afterwards which...coincidentally is probably business talk.
I said it before, if they are getting lit on my dime I do have issue because that is mis-use. Same if they are eating filets every night. If they are going to Chilis and having a burger and a beer who freakin' cares?? Well...some of you obviously, but not me.
Not to get off topic but did River Monsters start up again? I'll have to check that out I love that show
"within reason" strikes me as a very legitimate standard.
It's hard for me to imagine how a board can make any decisions at all without a someone subjective view of whether they're "within reason". Not a lot of hard-and-fast, black-and-while out there.
How much are dues?
How much money to put into Worlds?
How many hours to have a meeting?
Some.
But within reason.
If the judgement of "within reason" is poor, membership can replace them. See election, July 2010.
It's hard for me to imagine how a board can make any decisions at all without a someone subjective view of whether they're "within reason". Not a lot of hard-and-fast, black-and-while out there.
How much are dues?
How much money to put into Worlds?
How many hours to have a meeting?
Some.
But within reason.
If the judgement of "within reason" is poor, membership can replace them. See election, July 2010.
That is my answer, I am not proposing that as a standard and I actually did qualify what I feel is within reason 1-3 drinks is my tolerance for paying, after that I would expect the tab to be paid and started over with personal cash. That is what I do on business and that is what I would expect someone travelling on my dime to do.
OH and yes, tonight at 9pm, new river monsters.
OH and yes, tonight at 9pm, new river monsters.
John Rock
Double Eagle Member
Now that would get a lot of folks showing up just to watch the fireworks. With my personal feelings about Brian Graham, there would not be much work going on (see the pDGA message board from around Dec. '08 to Feb. '09). I'm not impressed with his people skills.
And I would insist on paying for my own adult drinks.
grodney
* Ace Member *
Vegan Ray said on pdga.com:
"To me, it is as much or more the principle (and the entitled, members-be-damned attitude) of the thing as the nuts & bolts of the $$."
Exactly. My comment on the Iowa forum:
"
On one hand, volunteers don't DESERVE nor should EXPECT anything.
On the other hand, expensing a meal through the PDGA isn't that big of a deal. Allowing a drink or two with that meal also isn't a big deal.
On the third hand, it's also not a big deal for them to buy their own drinks (for those who choose to drink).
Therefore, I really can't believe they voted to keep their free drinks after this was brought up for a vote.
"
"To me, it is as much or more the principle (and the entitled, members-be-damned attitude) of the thing as the nuts & bolts of the $$."
Exactly. My comment on the Iowa forum:
"
On one hand, volunteers don't DESERVE nor should EXPECT anything.
On the other hand, expensing a meal through the PDGA isn't that big of a deal. Allowing a drink or two with that meal also isn't a big deal.
On the third hand, it's also not a big deal for them to buy their own drinks (for those who choose to drink).
Therefore, I really can't believe they voted to keep their free drinks after this was brought up for a vote.
"
Yes. If people want to be indignant about the PDGA, there's a lot more fodder than whether a drink is included with the meal.
I'm still stumped about the paid consultant for disciplinary actions. I don't know the details, but knowing them is not a prerequisite to indignation.
"Everyone should push their own agenda religiously and without regards to logic." :Lithicon
Lithicon goes to the gulf coast as a volunteer to pick up tar balls off the beach, the "American Environmental Cleanup Committee" pays for his travel and expenses while down there because he is doing something to help their cause. At dinner he orders a beer and submits his expense report, which they pay without question.
What an ANIMAL...how dare you exploit the people of the gulf coast that way!!??
What an ANIMAL...how dare you exploit the people of the gulf coast that way!!??
