Enough with the alternate pins!!

[thrembo]

I thought that there was one at River City with even more placements. Missed it on my first pass through.

 

[elmexdela]

at that point you might as well just finish the alphabet

 

[BogeyNoMore]

I thought that there was one at River City with even more placements. Missed it on my first pass through.

.One tee + 18 baskets and you have a course, no?

 

[davetherocketguy]

I thought that there was one at River City with even more placements. Missed it on my first pass through.

Ok now that's just getting absurd lol

 

[DavidSauls]

How many times do you have to visit River City, before you've played all the possible holes?

 

[Jay Dub]

.One tee + 18 baskets and you have a course, no?

Tee off 18 times from the same pad then hope you can remember where all the drives went.

 

[BogeyNoMore]

I'm a little confused by some of the reasoning behind the "course isn't set up the same as last time"/repeat challenge angle and its latest iteration "I saw this awesome layout on Youtube and want to play it." Unless I'm missing something, if you like pin position C because it's the one you played last time, you can still play it even if the basket has been moved to position D. It's not like there are armed thugs preventing you from chasing C's green if that's what you want to do. Courses don't stop maintaining a pin location or otherwise make it unplayable.

If you care enough about your game to want the barometer of improvement that comes from repeat plays on the same layout, you're likely honest enough with yourself to know if you have a makeable putt on the C position after your approach shot. Hell, if you're super anal, step that **** off from the C pin position and go putt on the basket at D. If that approach is untenable, play the placement currently in rotation AND PLAY YOUR FAVORITE! This isn't rocket surgery.

I get his point. I don't think this is how Mike would play himself, per se, but more along the lines of, "If you're that unhappy playing to the current basket position, you can always play to the one you want and figure out a way to card a basically legit score."

OP - just because DG is similar to golf, doesn't mean everything should be the same. Despite the obvious similarities, the two are very different in many ways. Vive la différence!

2-3 well chosen basket positions can enhance variety, reduce soil compaction, and/or appeal to different skill levels. Just don't go full on River City mode...

 

[curmudgeonDwindle]

In Golf, alternate pins do not exist merely for strategic reasons, but also because the green is a LIVING playing surface - it spreads out wear and tear on the single most important area(s) of the course...personally, the 'goat path' appearance (you know, that worn-out patch of dirt encircling the holes, just one example) of a large amount of disc golf courses I've played is a definite detractor.

It is easy to overlook the fact that Golf is much more nuanced that disc golf, if for nothing more than scale differences, so the change of a pin location by 15' on a green may result in an entirely different approach for the golfer - from tee through the green. This is a solid foundational idea in the game of Golf and more's the pity it's not taken advantage of more often in disc golf. Yeah, I get it, pain the ass to move pins, more money, more labor, etc (the 'overlay' course design idea was in part an amelioration of the issue)...

These concerns pale compared to the potential in increased play value, certainly for the more enthusiastic, dedicated addicts. I'm for anything that increases the breadth and depth of the game's 'fun', especially in matters foundational. If I read the OP's sentiment correctly, I assume he's either in a poor mood or a typically shallow and envious troll. Currently, I like to believe more widespread adoption of this particular idea is merely a matter of time, resources and dedication - I can imagine the course designers rubbing their hands together in anticipation...

 

[adamgservo]

My course has 2 basket locations for each hole which get switched out every 5-6 weeks. A few prominent signs indicate if the baskets are in the red or blue position. I tried red and blue bolts to indicate pin locations and found this method was a lot better.
For about ½ the holes red is more difficult and for ½ the holes blue is more difficult. (I'm not a fan of courses that go from all short positions, to all long.)
The total length difference over 27 holes is less than 100 feet.

I think this is a great approach for alternate pins for a few reasons:

Assuming that signs are good enough to show the layout, the only downside I see to alternate pin positions is the "tracking you vs. the course" element. As in "How do I know if I played better/worse by my score vs. par if the pins changed?" But what you really want to know is "did my round rating change get better/worse?". From the description of the layout above, it sounds like you get A) significantly different pins and B) a balance of long/short such that the round rating for a given score is unlikely to change much. This would actually mean that your score vs. par on the 2 layouts is a better indicator of your rating. Why? If you score worse on one particular layout consistently, that may just expose a deficiency in your shot ability that you might not realize by tracking your score (rating) on a single layout.

 

[roggenb3]

Morley in SD is the same way. Every hole has like A-D at minimum, with more than 1 making it to like H.

 

[glassila]

How many times do you have to visit River City, before you've played all the possible holes?

I just did the math...

 

[Countchunkula]

Surprisingly some pretty good conversation came out of what was more than likely a trolling OP. If any of you remember wayne's posts from the past, you'll know he loved to stir the pot. Unless I missed it, he hasn't posted in this thread since the OP. Too busy making popcorn.

Someone suggested all courses should get played both directions. Mason County in western Michigan has this setup with Beast and Goliath. Shared fairways played in opposite directions. I've never played Goliath, so I can't really comment on how well this works in practice. I don't think Beast suffered for it as far as I could tell.

 

[BogeyNoMore]

Someone suggested all courses should get played both directions. Mason County in western Michigan has this setup with Beast and Goliath. Shared fairways played in opposite directions. I've never played Goliath, so I can't really comment on how well this works in practice. I don't think Beast suffered for it as far as I could tell.

I think it's quite a stretch to say Goliath is "Beast played backward."

Beast and Goliath each have 24 holes. 18 baskets are shared (purplish arrows), and each of them have six holes that are completely independent of the 18 shared baskets (yellow arrows and blue arrows).

Of the 18 shared baskets, some share part of the fairway the other course plays on.. sometimes in the opposite direction, but more typically from such a different angle that the two holes make use of different fairways.

 

[elmexdela]

I think it's quite a stretch to say Goliath is "Beast played backward."

Beast and Goliath each have 24 holes. 18 baskets are shared (purplish arrows), and each of them have six holes that are completely independent of the 18 shared baskets (yellow arrows and blue arrows).

Of the 18 shared baskets, some share part of the fairway the other course plays on.. sometimes in the opposite direction, but more typically from such a different angle that the two holes make use of different fairways.

so how isnt there any injuries or people hitting each other

 

[Countchunkula]

^^Explains why I didn't see baskets in close proximity to teepads (and vice versa) on all the Beast holes. Thanks for clearing that up, Bogey. I thought I read that in one of the early TR reviews of those courses, but that was years ago and I'm likely misremembering.

I really need to play Goliath next time I'm up in that area. Hell, with the way things are going, Leviathan may be open again by the time I make it up there again.

 

[BogeyNoMore]

From My review of River City:

River City features an almost embarrassing number of pin placements on some holes.

 

[BogeyNoMore]

so how isnt there any injuries or people hitting each other

Let me preface by saying I live on the other side of the state, and don't get out there often enough to say how big an issue that really is.

But from the times I've been, neither course ever seems to be very busy, which cuts down on that possibility tremendously. I don't think a couple of foursomes playing Beast with a couple of foursomes playing Goliath at the same time would really cause each other too much trouble. But I could see it being trouble if you had a dozen or so players on each course in groups of 2-3 per card playing at the same time.

They use these courses for the MI State Championships every year, and can't imagine they allow different pools/divisions to play both courses at the same time... that would be a problem waiting to happen.

 

[elmexdela]

Let me preface by saying I live on the other side of the state, and don't get out there often enough to say how big an issue that really is.

But from the times I've been, neither course ever seems to be very busy, which cuts down on that possibility tremendously. I don't think a couple of foursomes playing Beast with a couple of foursomes playing Goliath at the same time would really cause each other too much trouble. But I could see it being trouble if you had a dozen or so players on each course in groups of 2-3 per card playing at the same time.

They use these courses for the MI State Championships every year, and can't imagine they allow different pools/divisions to play both courses at the same time... that would be a problem waiting to happen.

we have courses with parallel holes but opposite directions (probably a better word for this) and of course not shared fairways but enough where n00bz or "bad" throws can be dangerous

it just baffles me but i suppose with lesser foot traffic changes the danger level significantly

 

[wolfhaley]

I really need to play those Mason county courses. It doesn't help that they seem to get brought up pretty often on here. I've had them wishlisted for years now. MI has some pretty sweet disc golf from the little bit I've played.

 

[elmexdela]

I really need to play those Mason county courses. It doesn't help that they seem to get brought up pretty often on here. I've had them wishlisted for years now. MI has some pretty sweet disc golf from the little bit I've played.

same