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Hardest Course Ever
- Thread starter bikinjack
- Start date
I got my start in 1989 playing the original Oxbow Park near Elkhart/Goshen, IN. They redesigned it to be easier when worlds came in 1996. Not all of the holes were that hard, but maybe 8 or 9 of them were ridiculous.
In modern times, I'd say the Bertha Brock course in Ionia, MI is the one of the toughest I've played. Leila Arboretum (Battle Creek) too, but I couldn't find some of the holes, wouldn't play a few of them (a nick of a tree on a tightly wooded hole and you're in a swamp right next to it, for example), and I understand there are missing baskets now.
The long Houck-designed course at IDGC was very difficult and lengthy, but it was enjoyable punishment and I enjoyed every inch of it. (Maybe I should rephrase that...)
In modern times, I'd say the Bertha Brock course in Ionia, MI is the one of the toughest I've played. Leila Arboretum (Battle Creek) too, but I couldn't find some of the holes, wouldn't play a few of them (a nick of a tree on a tightly wooded hole and you're in a swamp right next to it, for example), and I understand there are missing baskets now.
The long Houck-designed course at IDGC was very difficult and lengthy, but it was enjoyable punishment and I enjoyed every inch of it. (Maybe I should rephrase that...)
Okay, after scrolling back and reading some of the thread, I've got to play Ozark Mountain someday.
- Joined
- Jun 8, 2009
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- 2,692
I remember reading this thread before but the first several pages are hilarious now that I have played the Ozark complex. Scooter's attitude might not earn many fans but he was 1000% correct about Ozark Mtn.
Ozark Mtn is in a league entirely of its own.
Ozark Mtn is in a league entirely of its own.
runningDoc
Double Eagle Member
- Joined
- May 21, 2014
- Messages
- 1,595
Even in the big boy par 60-65 layouts Cedar Hill can be shot under par as long as you're smart and can putt 20 footers.
The best part about those Nashville courses is that they're so reconfigurable - cedar hill has 4-6 different possible pin positions (same as seven oaks... so many different pin sleeves). You can have layouts that are easy to score under 54... then other layouts where scoring a par 60 is a grind.
The hardest course I've ever played was Warwick NY from long tees to long baskets. It's like the big boy cedar hill layout with the same elevation changes, same wind, but with more woods and even water hazards and island greens.
Original Ox Box wasn't the hardest just a totally bad design. I loved Cedar Hills but it kicked my ass. Some of Paw Paw I hate, some are great holes. Renny was extremely difficult.
- Joined
- Nov 29, 2016
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- 1,812
Worst place in Dayton for a newbie
Note: the following comes from very limited personal experience, but is backed up by friends who are more experienced players.
Buck Creek in Springfield, OH. Especially the first 10 holes or so. On the fairways, it looks like all they did was take out the underbrush and leave ALL the trees, to the point that there are no clear lines from tee to pin on some holes. It was just chuck-and-hope. Some of the fairways look like hiking trails, and are no more than 8 feet wide in places. There were deep rough areas, and steep slopes to grab your discs and throw them in there.
Afterward I complained about how there weren't any lines through the trees to my buddy who took me there. He said, "Sure there are lines through the trees, they just go directly into the trees right behind them."
Not in a hurry to play it again.
Note: the following comes from very limited personal experience, but is backed up by friends who are more experienced players.
Buck Creek in Springfield, OH. Especially the first 10 holes or so. On the fairways, it looks like all they did was take out the underbrush and leave ALL the trees, to the point that there are no clear lines from tee to pin on some holes. It was just chuck-and-hope. Some of the fairways look like hiking trails, and are no more than 8 feet wide in places. There were deep rough areas, and steep slopes to grab your discs and throw them in there.
Afterward I complained about how there weren't any lines through the trees to my buddy who took me there. He said, "Sure there are lines through the trees, they just go directly into the trees right behind them."
Not in a hurry to play it again.
BobFromAccounting
Bogey Member
If it's just you and the course, 1v1, Wilder DGC in Newport, Oregon is pretty tough. Lots of disc eating underbrush, tons o' trees, and typically wet and rainy conditions offer a potentially miserable experience. 3.70 rating.
http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=5797
http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=5797
No argument here. Lots of narrow, winding holes darting this way and that at short intervals with thorns and poison ivy at every turn. A river running parallel and a few feet from lengthy, narrow wooded tunnel holes too. It was crazy, and the only thing I knew for a few years.
I remember watching some more experienced players; they had to be the first people I ever saw playing other than myself. Rather than play the prescribed "fairway" out in the open to the side of the woods on one brutal hole, they decided instead to throw through the uncleared woods all the way to the pin. There was no real good place to be out in the "fairway" and the pin was tucked so far in and in a bizarre place that indeed you were better off playing safari through the woods to get to it. It seemed like an impossibly big hole at the time (when I owned a Stingray, an Aviar and a play-catch Frisbee from the store, and I couldn't really throw any of them well), but it was probably only 400' or so...just with no sane way to play it. There was a head-high, long cluster of bushes with sharp thorns right in the middle of that "fairway" with narrow open lanes on each side of it (that I surely couldn't aim to safely pass in those days). I definitely remember that. Somebody's Aerobie was stuck up in a tall tree right near that for a long time too, like the whole summer of 1989. This was in the middle of the course, one of the holes they took away for the sake of sanity for worlds in '96.
The original hole #1 was all overgrown the last time I visited maybe five years ago, and it hasn't been a hole in over 20 years either. It was a narrow wooded tunnel going straight ahead maybe 100' to 120' or so, then abruptly turning to the right at a 90 degree angle and continuing up a hill for another 150' (or so?) also as a tightly-wooded tunnel, then again turning abruptly to the right upon exit of the woods and out in the open on a hillside to the pin, maybe another 100'? It was common to just go ahead and play through the uncleared woods instead of using the weird fairway. Lots of this kind of thing going on at the original Oxbow Park.
When I finally heard there was another course at Wilson Park and went there, I was flabbergasted at the wide-open holes. It felt foreign to be able to just throw your Disc.
Noob you may be, but this would be my choice too.
Though Frog Creek @ Shale City/Ashland is right up there.
While Wilder definitely offers up a excellent cardio workout, I don't believe it ranks in the top five of Oregon courses as far as hardest. I agree the wet and windy Oregon coastal weather will make for a miserable experience but that's not the same as hardest.
I give you these five Oregon courses as much harder than Wilder.
1. Horning's Hideout-Meadow Ridge
2. Trojan Park
3. Blue Lake
4. Whistler's bend
5. Milo McIver
I give you these five Oregon courses as much harder than Wilder.
1. Horning's Hideout-Meadow Ridge
2. Trojan Park
3. Blue Lake
4. Whistler's bend
5. Milo McIver
clard
Double Eagle Member
Quaker's Challenge is always a beast. Par is usually just under 1000 rated.
Nockamixon is a beast, but is also completely fair.
Nockamixon is a beast, but is also completely fair.
I'm not sure what definition to use for "hardest" course, but relying on sentiment it's probably W.R. Jackson for me. Everytime I've played it, I stumbled off exhausted---physically, mentally, emotionally. It might have something to do with how unsuited my game and skill level is for it.
It's also my favorite IDGC course, for the same reasons.
Among the contenders in my mind are the Diamond layout at Stoney Hill, where I routinely meltdown on the 5-hole final stretch, losing a dozen strokes and a couple of discs, and where knowing exactly who's to blame for it just makes me feel worse; Still Waters Farm, a long-extinct South Carolina course that was a par-70 and finished with a quarter-mile, roped-OB-all-the-way hole; and Hunter Park, a dinky 2-star 12-holer near my home, from which I nearly always walk off with an embarrassing score, considering how easy it should be.
It's also my favorite IDGC course, for the same reasons.
Among the contenders in my mind are the Diamond layout at Stoney Hill, where I routinely meltdown on the 5-hole final stretch, losing a dozen strokes and a couple of discs, and where knowing exactly who's to blame for it just makes me feel worse; Still Waters Farm, a long-extinct South Carolina course that was a par-70 and finished with a quarter-mile, roped-OB-all-the-way hole; and Hunter Park, a dinky 2-star 12-holer near my home, from which I nearly always walk off with an embarrassing score, considering how easy it should be.
While I agree these are technically more difficult, and their cardio workout is tops, once its rainy, cold, and windy at Wilder the suffering is off the scale. It was like that the first time I played it [alone], and I returned to the car soaked, muddy and exhausted. I know of only one person who would have hung with me.
I have it marked as one of my favorites.
While I agree these are technically more difficult, and their cardio workout is tops, once its rainy, cold, and windy at Wilder the suffering is off the scale. It was like that the first time I played it [alone], and I returned to the car soaked, muddy and exhausted. I know of only one person who would have hung with me.
I have it marked as one of my favorites.
That's OK, as you mature in a more veteran (pussy) player like me, you'll become more of a fair weather player and not subject yourself to the rain, cold and wind. Only play when the temp is between 60 and 79 degrees.
The Sarge
I saw a lot of mention of Richmond Hill. I played there 30 times this Summer and The Sarge in Hardeeville SC is more difficult for sure. The Golds there are as tough as it gets from what I have seen; Water on 14 holes. Lots of forced carries over water with more then one being over 100 yards. OB on both sides on many holes ... water, water, everywhere. Every shot is technical - highly wooded. Par is about 1000 rated.
I saw a lot of mention of Richmond Hill. I played there 30 times this Summer and The Sarge in Hardeeville SC is more difficult for sure. The Golds there are as tough as it gets from what I have seen; Water on 14 holes. Lots of forced carries over water with more then one being over 100 yards. OB on both sides on many holes ... water, water, everywhere. Every shot is technical - highly wooded. Par is about 1000 rated.
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I'm going to have to change my response on this from 7 years ago and put my hardest course ever as Birds of Paradise.
Birds has always intrigued me, I bet it's beautiful and brutal. I know that it is private, but it's strange that only 62 people have it marked as played. probably will not ever make it there but one can dream.
BobFromAccounting
Bogey Member
No noob here. I'll play Wilder with you any time. I ain't "good", but I ain't bad either. I've lived on the Oregon coast for too many years to list and will glady ready-up any time. Consider that two people on your list.
I respectfully disagree. I've played Whistlers at below freezing temperatures, and it's easier to play than Wilder during normal conditions. At Wilder, you spend most of your time, looking at your feet, taking care to not slide, trip, or fall on your ass. If you re-read my original post, I said, "If it's just you and the course", aka 1v1, then Wilder is definitely more difficult than the more manicured courses you listed.
