Is this too tight?

[nate22]

Having built a forest style course, and encountering many many complaints about tight tunnels and "chuck and pray" holes...just wondering what the thoughts are on this?

 

[Halcón]

It's tight, but playable. I'd rather have that one gap to get through to the clearing instead of randomly throwing into a million trees.

 

[nate22]

I think Id tomahawk myself lol...so the gap after it makes it playable. I could replicate that simply enough. Guessing more for a par 4 though, so the pressure isnt on nailing the drive, but the approach.

 

[Gblambert]

I've never seen a gap that small so close to the front of a tee pad. I'd be tempted to cut the small tree to the left of center, but only if it doesn't make the throw too easy. Another option might be to open another small hole or two on the left or right side. Giving players more than one option off the tee is a good design practice whenever you can make it work.

 

[Nenja]

I play wooded courses but this is a nasty tight gap. Maybe open up holes for wide hyzer/anhyzer lines? Make em real wide (so it's not the obvious choice) so that the longest shots still would be to hit the gap.
This would create a reason to go for the gap, gamble for birdie.

 

[mgamache8]

I don't think that tee shot is too tight. Maybe clear some of the brush, but definitely no trees

 

[DavidSauls]

Looks a little tight to my taste, but hard to be sure from a photo. In general I like "windows"---a tight spot, followed by open area, where there's a big reward for hitting the gap---as opposed to tunnels which are tight all the way.

I think I'd be inclined to limb up the trees, so the gap is defined cleanly by the trunks, not the foliage.

 

[DavidSauls]

It looks like that would be particularly tough for RHFH or LHBH players.

 

[brutalbrutus]

Looks fine to me. Here is one of our local tight gaps. The double double mando. You cant see in the pic but there is a barbed wire fence just out of picture left, that separates the course from a rather unfriendly apartment complex...Sooo much pucker factor playing this hole in a tourney.

 

[JC17393]

Not nearly enough info to go on with just this photo. How long is the hole? Is it open field or more woods? What is required of the player beyond that gap? Turn left, turn right, straight?

Just based on the photo, I'd say this would only be okay if the hole is short and relatively straight (say, under 220ish feet, maybe 250 if it's downhill). Otherwise, it's way too restrictive to ask players to hit that tiny gap AND cover a reasonable distance and/or a notable bend in the flight path.

Without any other info though, I think I'd still take the skinnier tree on the left side of the gap and the trees further up. If not take those trees entirely, I'd at least limb them up so that there was nothing hanging into the airspace in the gap. Make the gap narrow if you will, but at least make it clean if you do clear the initial gate.

 

[nate22]

Its a par 4, so you get a chance to recover...information I have is limited, so just going by pic...they say a thousand words I hear. Not looking to fix or change this, asking if this type of gap is ok, I could make a hole like this but was always fearful of tight gaps like this.

 

[davetherocketguy]

As already said this is tough to determine just on a 2 dimensional photo without seeing it in person. I think clearing out the brush is a good start. As far as what I refer to as a "poke-n-hope" holes this does not look like one of them. Now if this were a hole where you're throwing into a forest of trees where none of them are more than 5' apart with no discernible line then yes it would fall into the "poke-n-hope" category.

-Dave

 

[Consult20]

The gap in the OP's pic will shrink as the foliage grows, so the suggestion by JC to trim the foliage looks reasonable.

Attached are 3 pics from a 350' hole at a local course. From the tee, from the opening at the end of the tunnel, and looking back from the basket to the tunnel. It's not easy to ace run or park a drive, but it is possible. It's also very possible to get a bad tree kick/branch deflection/iron leaf and end up with a 4+. It's one of my favorite holes on the course -- an ace on this hole "will" be very satisfying.

 

[curveball4]

Looks a little tight to my taste, but hard to be sure from a photo. In general I like "windows"---a tight spot, followed by open area, where there's a big reward for hitting the gap---as opposed to tunnels which are tight all the way.

I think I'd be inclined to limb up the trees, so the gap is defined cleanly by the trunks, not the foliage.

:thmbup:

I think it's a super tough gap but not unfair. I agree with David I would clear out all the limbs that are in the gap. Then you only have to make the gap, not make the gap & hope you don't hit a random limb

 

[DavidSauls]

The gap in the OP's pic will shrink as the foliage grows, so the suggestion by JC to trim the foliage looks reasonable.

Something a lot of designers forget. I know I do--my brother and I have a private course and, after 10 years, we're still caught off-guard when trees grow outwards, not just upwards.

 

[kenjiac]

Not nearly enough info to go on with just this photo. How long is the hole? Is it open field or more woods? What is required of the player beyond that gap? Turn left, turn right, straight?

Just based on the photo, I'd say this would only be okay if the hole is short and relatively straight (say, under 220ish feet, maybe 250 if it's downhill). Otherwise, it's way too restrictive to ask players to hit that tiny gap AND cover a reasonable distance and/or a notable bend in the flight path.

Without any other info though, I think I'd still take the skinnier tree on the left side of the gap and the trees further up. If not take those trees entirely, I'd at least limb them up so that there was nothing hanging into the airspace in the gap. Make the gap narrow if you will, but at least make it clean if you do clear the initial gate.

Gap doesn't look too bad. I'd start with trimming the limbs marked here then decide after some play whether the tree on the left of the gap should go or not.

 

[Consult20]

Something a lot of designers forget. I know I do--my brother and I have a private course and, after 10 years, we're still caught off-guard when trees grow outwards, not just upwards.

And the flip side is when you do trimming (especially to some bushes), they come back even thicker which requires even more trimming.

And as trees grow taller and fill out, the branches can droop down making lines more challenging as the years go on.

 

[Shade]

tight gaps

Having built a forest style course, and encountering many many complaints about tight tunnels and "chuck and pray" holes...just wondering what the thoughts are on this?

How far is the green from the opening? How many throws get through the gap from a player of the caliber for
who the course is designed for?Note: I've been involved in playing and design since 1978 and experience tells me that your hole signs are too close to the outside edge of the tee pad. Just saying'.

 

[Shade]

Looks fine to me. Here is one of our local tight gaps. The double double mando. You cant see in the pic but there is a barbed wire fence just out of picture left, that separates the course from a rather unfriendly apartment complex...Sooo much pucker factor playing this hole in a tourney.

I would endeavor to avoid any interaction with the less than friendly neighbors. The tee seems a bit too close to the "ET's"(early trees). Perhaps the tee could be adjusted to restrict the left of the tee shot factor even more. Sometimes just a few feet left, right, up or back can make a big difference.

 

[Consult20]

Looks fine to me. Here is one of our local tight gaps. The double double mando. You cant see in the pic but there is a barbed wire fence just out of picture left, that separates the course from a rather unfriendly apartment complex...Sooo much pucker factor playing this hole in a tourney.

Why the pavers on the sides of the tee box? I prefer all sides be level to allow various teeing angles and to reduce injury potential.