Lloyd Weema article in Ultiworld Disc Golf

[Cgkdisc]

I guess this is a bit of-topic, but it struck me, as I couldn't imagine it was a thing..
Sponsored players, much less Sponsored pros, having to pay their own reg fees for a tournament?
That blew my mind a little, that they would have to deal with coughing up reg fees as they travel the country week to week putting their sponsors wares on display..
I know there are many levels of "sponsorship" but I had, incorrectly apparently, assumed along with discs, a bag or some clothes, etc, paying the fees to get their players into tournaments and seen by the widest possible audience would be a "no-brainer" for a company.
In fact, I would've thought that's some of what a team manager/owner did. Made sure their players were signed up, paid reg fees, etc, so their players driving around the country all season weren't having to deal with all that.

Wow, eye-opener for sure.

It shouldn't be surprising. It's the nature of being independent contractors versus employees. Typically, a contractor is responsible to pay expenses, some which may be reimbursed and others that are not. Their sponsor contract specifies what items are reimbursable.

 

[brutalbrutus]

Another thing some people might be missing when they bash someone for maybe not having entry fees on hand when registration opens for an event, is that these guys/gals are playing what 15-20(for some of the road warriors, its more like 25-30) events that they need to pre-reg for...


That's a couple grand that they would have tied up in fees.

 

[Aylien]

If they are touring full time, it's kind of their job to save enough money for entry fees. They know a year ahead of time roughly what next years entry fees will be. If they can't swing it or don't save that money, then perhaps touring isn't for them.

 

[DiscJunkie]

Guys and Gals,
This seems like a bit of a thread drift, so allow me to apologize for adding to it.
But...
I am 61 years old and have several children who are about the age of a lot of the guys and gals who tour.
My advice to my children was to pursue their dreams while they were young, and if that meant doing something risky - then better to do it at 25 than wonder what it might have been like after they get my age.
I am not surprised that these kids and young adults have problems paying bills and managing money and scheduling. I sure did when I was their age.
It's an adventure and a life experience they'll be able to recall for the rest of their lives.
Some of them will make it and thrive, many will not.
So, for the love of disc golf, cut them a break.
Let them be young, live their dreams and show a little compassion.
/thread drift.

 

[GMcAtee]

I've been apart of leagues for the past 5-6 years and not a single one of them was douchey or entitled enough to expect a public course to be closed for them.

I've seen some.

 

[Noill]

I should join a league again...been years since I was in one

When I was in, we often played without much or any casual player presence at all... it was typically smaller and way less popular courses, but that is a consequence of there being zero high quality courses in or around Chicago. YMMV

 

[ballgolfconvert]

I've seen some.

I don't know of any either. Generally people respect leagues and start on holes where they won't interfere.

 

[ru4por]

I don't know of any either. Generally people respect leagues and start on holes where they won't interfere.

Allow me to tell a story. It is of a course in Michigan that is going to shortly get pulled. One of the said reasons for the municipality pulling the course was an incident between an entitled disc golfer and some members of the track cross country community.

Apparently, the park is used by the local high school cross country teams on Saturday mornings for cross country meets. A golfer took umbrage at his game being disrupted by this and interfered with some of the competitors and took up his complaint with the coaches/school administrators at the meet. His contention was that the park was a disc golf first area, disc golf occupying the space 7 days a week, sunrise to sunset. He paid taxes and had every right to play where he wanted and when he wanted.

I am sure that you would not interfere with casuals and obviously are not going to get in someones face, but I was hoping this tale would drive home the pitfalls of entitlement. We are, nearly always, in a public park with both casual player and often many more folks. (dog walkers, hikers, bird watchers, picnickers, sunbathers, geocachers, pokemon go'ers....) We need to embrace, respect and accommodate all of these park users. Failing to do so...even one time can cost the park the course.

Casuals in league time are an opportunity here. They are treated great, invited to join, play through and are given royal treatment. We want them as club members, league members and advocates of sportsmanship and fair play.

 

[davetherocketguy]

Allow me to tell a story. It is of a course in Michigan that is going to shortly get pulled. One of the said reasons for the municipality pulling the course was an incident between an entitled disc golfer and some members of the track cross country community.

Apparently, the park is used by the local high school cross country teams on Saturday mornings for cross country meets. A golfer took umbrage at his game being disrupted by this and interfered with some of the competitors and took up his complaint with the coaches/school administrators at the meet. His contention was that the park was a disc golf first area, disc golf occupying the space 7 days a week, sunrise to sunset. He paid taxes and had every right to play where he wanted and when he wanted.

I am sure that you would not interfere with casuals and obviously are not going to get in someones face, but I was hoping this tale would drive home the pitfalls of entitlement. We are, nearly always, in a public park with both casual player and often many more folks. (dog walkers, hikers, bird watchers, picnickers, sunbathers, geocachers, pokemon go'ers....) We need to embrace, respect and accommodate all of these park users. Failing to do so...even one time can cost the park the course.

Casuals in league time are an opportunity here. They are treated great, invited to join, play through and are given royal treatment. We want them as club members, league members and advocates of sportsmanship and fair play.

This post should be a sticky. In its own thread so it stays right at the top of this forum all the time.

With my crew I emphasize this mentality of sharing the park. With everyone. When non dg'ers get in our way we just ask politely for them to move for 5 minutes while we play through and if there are kids I make sure they have an opportunity to "try out" one of my putters and if I have extras on me they get a mini. It is entirely possible to share the course. It may take a few minutes extra to play but who cares? Isn't it just more fun to get along with everyone?

 

[Hampstead]

No way to remember all the times we've let casuals play through during a weekly. We let them know the situation, give them an invite for next time and then sit back and patiently wait a few while they play the hole. Hardly an inconvenience.

 

[Consult20]

No way to remember all the times we've let casuals play through during a weekly. We let them know the situation, give them an invite for next time and then sit back and patiently wait a few while they play the hole. Hardly an inconvenience.

Always, always this. A lot of casual players don't even know the league is going on, I mean how would they? Just because they see four players playing a round together? I mean it's not like we're wearing t-shirts that say, "we're playing in a league right now".

 

[ballgolfconvert]

You all are completely misjudging the situation. We always try to accommodate players while we are playing league. There is generally the majority of the holes open and we also let people who start behind us play through if they catch us. Unfortunately not all groups play faster. Sometimes they are significantly slower. The one instance I had there was a temporary backup on the course and a notoriously slow non -league group had somehow gotten in the Que. Most days they let us through. That day they were defiant about letting the league play through. That was when I asserted the league priority / course reservation and let them know they were welcome to play behind us. They then complained vehemently online about it being a public course and all that and the disrespect they were shown. We try to respect everyone, but unfortunately not everyone, all the time deserves that respect. Work with us, we work with you. Case in point the guy interfering with cross country. Jerks are jerks and sometimes need to be treated accordingly.

 

[perklc]

It's a public course. Unless you are reserving the course through your park district, you can't assert a damn thing.

 

[DiscgolfStu]

It's a public course. Unless you are reserving the course through your park district, you can't assert a damn thing.

I was going to say this. Same thing with a ball diamond, tennis court, soccer field etc. If it's not reserved, it's open to the public. If a group (league) wants to pay to have exclusive rights to the disc golf course (or at least secure it in writing), then they have every right to tell anyone to take a hike.

 

[biscoe]

You all are completely misjudging the situation. We always try to accommodate players while we are playing league. There is generally the majority of the holes open and we also let people who start behind us play through if they catch us. Unfortunately not all groups play faster. Sometimes they are significantly slower. The one instance I had there was a temporary backup on the course and a notoriously slow non -league group had somehow gotten in the Que. Most days they let us through. That day they were defiant about letting the league play through. That was when I asserted the league priority / course reservation and let them know they were welcome to play behind us. They then complained vehemently online about it being a public course and all that and the disrespect they were shown. We try to respect everyone, but unfortunately not everyone, all the time deserves that respect. Work with us, we work with you. Case in point the guy interfering with cross country. Jerks are jerks and sometimes need to be treated accordingly.

Can you please answer these questions about your league:
1. Do you have an actual agreement in place with the course ownership (I assume parks dept) to hold leagues at the course in question?

2. Does this agreement allow you to close the course for leagues?

 

[davetherocketguy]

You all are completely misjudging the situation.

If a bunch of people are misjudging the situation then the issue is probably that you didn't explain yourself well.

We always try to accommodate players while we are playing league.

That was when I asserted the league priority / course reservation and let them know they were welcome to play behind us.

Always?

They then complained vehemently online about it being a public course and all that and the disrespect they were shown. We try to respect everyone, but unfortunately not everyone, all the time deserves that respect. Work with us, we work with you.

Well...they were right. They have just as much right to a public course as you. Dang dude I'll say it again: LET IT GO. If they hold you up they hold you up. Gain a little perspective here - it's just a league. You didn't rent out the entire course for your exclusive use so if they're DB's let them be DB's. So you have to wait a few extra minutes...who cares????

 

[ballgolfconvert]

It's a public course. Unless you are reserving the course through your park district, you can't assert a damn thing.

We do have the course reserved for the league every week. It has been mentioned numerous times. Yet we still let everyone play and try to accommodate them. This one time guys were jerks and were not willing to cooperate. only then did I assert my right. They had the choice to wait or go to another hole. I assume the people rallying against leagues and giving them any respect would be the same way. Almost all of you should know better, and if you condone the behavior of the folks who i had an issue with, then you are no better than them.

 

[ballgolfconvert]

Can you please answer these questions about your league:
1. Do you have an actual agreement in place with the course ownership (I assume parks dept) to hold leagues at the course in question?

2. Does this agreement allow you to close the course for leagues?

Yes to both questions, but we don't close the course and we accommodate non-league golfers.

 

[ballgolfconvert]

I was going to say this. Same thing with a ball diamond, tennis court, soccer field etc. If it's not reserved, it's open to the public. If a group (league) wants to pay to have exclusive rights to the disc golf course (or at least secure it in writing), then they have every right to tell anyone to take a hike.

So if two people are in the middle of a tennis game, how exactly are you going to take their court? Or if a couple of groups are playing a casual softball game. Are you going go to the mound and start hurling pitches. Explains a bunch when folks need to come up ridiculous situations to justify their views.

 

[DatRedDude]

Yes to both questions, but we don't close the course and we accommodate non-league golfers.

I would venture to guess you don't close the course because you can't. If you're in a public park you are dead wrong plain and simple.

Unless you are shelling out money to rent the park and shut it down you have no more right to play there then they do.

Open a private course and you can do whatever you please, in a public space you will have to deal with casuals. Love your dedication to trying to make everyone believe you are right though.