Pencil Whippers - How do you deal with them?

[bradharris]

Whoever is in charge, whether it's a TD or league official, needs to confirm reports of cheating and then suspend him. Allow him back only when he's performed some "community service" in the form of volunteering at the course and has issued a public apology. If he cheated in events that are part of any sort of point series, strip him of any points earned.

 

[DiscJunkie]

He must be booted, permanently.
Ask him to seek help, he has a problem with his behavior that is a mental illness. He will not change just because he is caught or "shamed". That would work on most people, but probably not him.

 

[DiscJunkie]

:clap::clap:

An email has been sent to all of our local league/tournament directors notifying them of his recent actions. It is suggested that he not be allowed to play leagues/tournaments for the remainder of 2012. Many of us have agreed that if a league/tournament director allows him to play, that we will ask for our entry fee back.

I think this is a reasonable and effective action.

 

[giles]

In reality, properly taking scores is without a doubt the rule that is broken the most in disc golf.

The rules require that scores be done like this in this example...

John got a 2, Jay got a 3, I got a 4, Sam got a 5. I have the card...

Me - "Hole 3, John?"
John - "2"
Me - "2"
Me - Jay?"
Jay - "3"
Me - "3"
Me - "I got a 4"
Me - "Sam?"
Sam - "5"
Me - "5"

Almost everyone does it wrong.

It is funny when you do it right then hand it off and the next guy doesn't do it right. "Did you not see how good that worked!'

 

[MrFixIt]

Truthfully, I wish some people would learn how to take score.

- Stop trying to take the scores while in route to the next tee. People tend to wander between holes to talk to a friend on another hole, or grab something from the car, or take a quick number 1 in the woods. Wait until you get to the next tee box where everyone will be present once again. Getting the next hole's box order is easier this way.

- Just because you're the one taking scores doesn't mean you get to record yours in silence. Verbally announce your score to the group so they can hear it. Otherwise, how do we know that you're not writing down a 3 when we know you took a 5?

- Don't tell me you got "par" or "birdie" when I ask you. We write down numbers on the scorecard, not pictures of avian creatures, so give me one please.

^^^ This.

 

[mndiscg]

I have played with a player that did this constantly. Eventually I refused to be in his group and warned anybody else about his tactics. He constantly bragged about shooting way under par and aceing all kinds of holes when he was a par player at best and couldn't throw far enough to ace almost any hole at our home course. You need to deal with these players every time and harshly.

 

[_MTL_]

I have played with a player that did this constantly. Eventually I refused to be in his group and warned anybody else about his tactics. He constantly bragged about shooting way under par and aceing all kinds of holes when he was a par player at best and couldn't throw far enough to ace almost any hole at our home course. You need to deal with these players every time and harshly.

Bragging / lying about something you can't do > Pencil whipping.

Huge difference.

 

[chris deitzel]

Seen it a few times over the years. Guess this is a good place to call out Jason Jalonen from Canada in.

It was hole 17 of the tournament, Jason went to the bathroom. I pulled out the scorecard with my group because we knew the match was close. After checking the score, I knew that I was 2 strokes ahead of Jason and 4 or 5 strokes ahead of everyone else. Jason comes back and asks to see the card. He gives it back to me. I check the scores again and now I am tied with him.

I look at the card and notice an eraser smudge and ask him what he got on that hole. He says "3" as is written on the card. The other 2 guys in my group say "No man, you got a 5 on that hole"

Oh yeah he says.

What an ass. Check your cards if you ever find yourself in a group with Jason Jalonen.

 

[jtreadwell]

Bragging / lying about something you can't do > Pencil whipping.

Huge difference.

Sounds like he was cheating too.

 

[Norcal]

Even worse are the players who conveniently "forget" a stroke when reporting.

What did you get there? A 3? Dude, you were in the woods. Oh ya. a 5. Grrrrrr

I had that experience this weekend playing on the AM1 lead card of a PDGA sanctioned B tier. The "forgetful" player had the cards and was also holding onto a thin lead. It made me wonder if he had made any other "mistakes" in recording his scores.

As a result of that experience, from now on I will be independently keeping the scores of everyone in my group. The PDGA should consider implementing a score keeping rule similar to traditional golf where you track the score of your competitor and vice versa. Such a rule would reduce opportunities for cheating.

 

[jtreadwell]

Keep a second scorecard, then for every stroke he has less than the other scorecard, the best driver in the league throws a driver at him from 30ft.

 

[_MTL_]

The PDGA should consider implementing a score keeping rule similar to traditional golf where you track the score of your competitor and vice versa. Such a rule would reduce opportunities for cheating.

Agreed.

The only thing I would say against it is it does increase the costs to run an event doing it that way.

 

[giles]

Don't let Dave Ballina in Pagosa Springs CO at Reservoir Hill keep score.

He could be legit, but shooting -2 in double when all I remember his team having were bad shots and missed putts.

 

[tripp]

Make sure everyone knows that scores should be called out after every hole. The TD might want to announce this before hand. When someone claims they got a 3 when you know they got a 5, call them on it. If it happens more than once make sure they know it is not ok.

 

[DikkaD]

Break his knuckles and shackle his feet.

 

[mrbilladelph]

As Diamond dave would say... Don't go ninja'in nobody that don't need ninja'in

 

[JTacoma03]

Make a gigantic pencil out of a branch and whip him with it.

 

[chris deitzel]

For PDGA events they need to make this model the standard...

Everyone in the group gets a scorecard.
Everyone keeps everyone's score (in the same name order on all cards)
At end of round everyone compares everyone's scores.
This way you make sure there is no cheating.
All players in group have to go to the TD after round and turn in one card that is correct.
And it makes it easier for the TD to check cards, because there should not be any errors in scoring as the group just checked all 3-5 cards to makes sure everyone has the same score.

I have seen this used a few times and it is the only way you can stop people from cheating.

 

[Craig639]

Luckily I haven't seen him since a week after Jr caught him. He came back the next week and got called out by a card-mate. I was uncomfortable watching it unfold. I can't imagine trying to finish a round with emotions flaring like that.

Too bad, he had some game.

Another one of his trademarks is when the LD "brings it in", sends out the cards, and he's still warm-up putting. Then has the audacity to ask everyone what hole he's on. Stooge

 

[Billym]

I caught a guy whipping his card this weekend and called him out at the end of the round.
We got the TD and showed him and the offender that he wrote 3's on two consecutive holes he 4'd.
He also lied about his score on a really long hole (1000') and to be honest I went on the other side of the fairway and didn't see all his throws (my mistake).
The 2 others in our group agreed with me and were pissed. The TD did nothing, maybe he misunderstood my way of calling the guy out. He didn't make mistakes on his card he cheated.
The next round the group watched him like a hawk and kept his score and never passed him the cards, he tried 4-5 tiems to lie about his score. They caught him every time and he DFLd off the lead card.
He also moved an object illegally to clear his throwing motion that we gave him a warning on.
What a jerk!
He better not show up to a future tourney I'm playing in.