should disc golf go big or stay the way it is?

[craftsman]

I really hope this sport blows up and gets mainstream. Industry expansion means jobs, competition pushes technology, and increased participation leads to more courses.

That said there will be cons, but I don't think I'd worry about Nike or the like taking over Innova's spot. Just because a sport is mainstream doesn't mean it'll ever be close to the profitability of Football, Basketball, etc.

I disagree. More a holes equals more public courses getting pulled.
I don't know any ball sportsman (excluding bg) that spend more on thier equipment then me.
Jobs doing what? Do you mean at the factories- cause even though I'm a craft fanboy, all of the main companies seem to be concerned with helping the sport over profit. That would have to change if they had to compete with a company making discs in china. Or do you mean jobs at the p2p booths?

 

[craftsman]

Ah, the debate continues. I am sure I have posted about this before, even had some kind of poll on it.

I would really enjoy it if disc golf went big. There is no way that the big brands would go out of business and I doubt even if it goes big that Nike or Spaulding would be able to put anything out that would begin to take down the current bigs. More people playing would make courses busier but it would also mean more courses being built.

The "big" brands are not really big

 

[DavidSauls]

The topic question presumes a choice.

"Big" is not defined but presumably you mean highly-paid top pros and live ESPN coverage. If so, I don't believe we have a choice---it's not going to happen.

If I'm wrong and it is possible, we probably don't have a choice either. If the popularity of disc golf booms to the point that someone sees a big market and wants to invest lots of money and promote it, it'll be hard to stop them.

 

[ZMan44]

Interesting question, and one I have actually been thinking about. Here's my story...last June I tore my ACL playing Softball. I had surgery in September and completed rehab in late February. No disc golf for nearly 9 months. Then I played a few weekend round with friends at a few different courses in the area. About a week ago, I made it out to my home course at 4:30 in the afternoon. The course has about 15 parking spaces and some are in the grass where people can park. I drive to the back of the park (course location) and there were people parked EVERYWHERE. Where 15 cars used to be a BIG Saturday, this was a random afternoon and I counted 52 cars, parked in every conceivable position. I asked my friends and they said they hadn't really noticed the change because it was gradual for them. For me, I could hardly believe my eyes.

In our area, they are building new courses fairly regularly, which is the nice part of growth. More players = more discs sold by the companies, so that is good as well. Unfortunately, as has been stated, many of the noobs have no idea about the etiquette involved in playing disc golf. We had a group of 3 last week, and we played behind a group of 7. They were also attempting to teach a 5 or 6 year old how to putt at EVERY hole. I don't mind teaching the kids, but there was a practice basket. They finally let us play through after about 8 holes.

Going "big" has its positives and negatives. If you had asked me a year ago, I would have said disc golf would never be "big". While I still don't think it will ever get to the level of Baseball, Basketball, Football, Golf, Soccer, Tennis, or Hockey...I can definitely see it sneaking into the popularity level of the second tier sports like lacrosse.

 

[toothyfish]

Big is hard to define...what are we comparing to?

As big as ball golf - doubtful
Big like the X Games - possible, I could see TV coverage and the attraction of sponsers outside of the sport getting involved.

Regardless, it could still be the casual sport that it is for many of us. As long as it remains in public parks, whats to change? Casual rounds, weekly doubles, etc. It's a socal sport and that would remain.

If it gets bigger at the pro level (meaning more prize money, deeper payouts, some live TV coverage, etc) it usually trickles down as more local events will see increased sponsership. Could mean more funding for your local courses and clubs, too. Imagine a club that had a sponser so it could afford to help young up-and-coming players afford to play NT events by helping with entrance fees and travel exspenses. Wear logoed shirts, carry logoed towels, maybe a patch for the bag...heck, team events would be really cool where there would be something to give back to the sponser in the form of a trophy, picture, news article. Maybe this is happening already...

I did this for years with cycling, a "small" sport in the US. I raced for local/regional teams and received equipment, entrance fees reimbursment, etc. Didn't cover all my costs, but allowed me to compete nearly every weekend...won prize money, too, as an amatuer.

Bass fishing is huge, right? $250,000 to win the Bassmasters...I can still fish my lakes the same way I did 20 years ago...

Of course, it means change. Doesn't mean it's bad...

 

[bcr123psu]

No one really would benefit from a blow up. I could even see the top manufacturers going out of business if a major player came in to sweep the industry. Imagine that we'd be all longing for the days of the buzzz and roc and pissed that innova and discraft got put out of business by some massive conglomerate.

I would like to see more publicity and coverage for the sport and a greater understanding by the public in general. But, like optidiscic said, be careful what you wish for. If(when) a large producer of athletic equipment (a company like Nike, for example) determines that DG is an new growth market, they'll use their extensive economies of scale and massive advertising machines to not only gain a dominant market share, but they'll gobble up or shut down any company that stands in their way. In an effort to reduce costs and appease Wall Street they'll figure out what the crappiest disc the majority of people would be willing to accept and put the cheapest, lowest-grade discs in our hands and we'll be powerless to stop them.

 

[Sethster]

The last thing I really remember "blowing up" is poker. ESPN has taken that and they have brought it to a whole new level. Thousands of people enter the biggest events, and everyone comments on the "amateur" play and behavior.

If this were to happen to disc golf, the local clubs would have a huge responsibility. The clubs would have to show the new patrons of the sport the proper ways to play, act, and appreciate disc golf. (Not to mention handle a increase in course traffic)

I also don't think it'll ever rise like poker has, but some coverage would be nice to see. Some good edited coverage or live feeds would be great on ESPN. (An ace for top plays?) Maybe we'll see some outside sponsors too, but Innova and Discraft may need to adapt their business models as the sport grows.

 

[Ryan P.]

Slow, Steady growth will bring about the positives of being "big" and cut down on the negatives.

As for whether or not I think it will go big, I think it will, but it's not going to be soon, and I'm happy for that.

 

[Marty McFly]

Marty Marty oh good to see you Marty it's doc I just came from the future...and I'm warning you be careful what you wish for....before I climb back into the delorean...you got any extra plastic?

Don't you mock me...

 

[toothyfish]

I don't think we have to worry about Nike taking over disc golf...they did get involved with ball golf a few years ago, but it was already HUGE. They got a piece of the action, not the whole thing. They also "make" a line of cycling apparal, but didn't take anything over, probably to come alongside the American teams competing in the Tour de France. Probably a deal with an existing manufacturer to put the "swoosh" on their product.

I'm sure Nike's marketing group has their sights on opportunity with alot more zeros behind it.

What I would expect to see, as I lead to earlier, is an increase of sponsership of bigger tournaments, from companies outside the sport, increasing the payouts and the number of tournements at the top level. When the NT consists of 20-30 tourneys a year with big payouts, and the USDGC final round is on ESPN 2 or Versus, now you're bigger. That's what I would expect to see next, before anything changes on the equipment side.

I'm not sure if there is "big" interest in disc manufacturing, it's a bit of a niche business amongst a couple bigger names, and a few smaller companies on the rise.

 

[JTacoma03]

I don't know any ball sportsman (excluding bg) that spend more on thier equipment then me.

Then you spend way too much, or you don't know people who play other sports on a regular basis. If DG equipment had that sort of high level of profitability, we'd see larger companies gettting in on the take. This isn't a matter of opinion, it's economics.

that said...

If(when) a large producer of athletic equipment (a company like Nike, for example) determines that DG is an new growth market, they'll use their extensive economies of scale and massive advertising machines to not only gain a dominant market share, but they'll gobble up or shut down any company that stands in their way. In an effort to reduce costs and appease Wall Street they'll figure out what the crappiest disc the majority of people would be willing to accept and put the cheapest, lowest-grade discs in our hands and we'll be powerless to stop them.

Hold on there, go put on comfortably numb and take a bong rip. This sounds like hippie paranoia to me. Has Nike taken over Skateboarding? Snowboarding? Surfing? Hell ANY extreme sport? Name the top 3 Tennis brands. Even in baseball smaller brands thrive - Louisville Slugger, MacGregor, Wilson, etc.

You're totally overlooking the # of patents Innova has as well.

You're TOTALLY forgetting that WE the consumer have the power. If Nike were to attempt the crappiest discs possible and shove them at us, we'd reject them faster than a lightning disc. It's all about what the pros play with when the sport gets to that level of recognition. If Climo throws Innova, Doss throws Discraft, and Locastro throws Gateway - chances are we will too.

 

[jkdisc]

IMO dg wont ever get too big, say to like MLB or NFL. It will grow in popularity and there will be more interest and im good with that.

 

[Kramer]

The reason that off-related sponsorships go to MLB, NFL, or NBA is because of their media coverage (larger audiences).

Until there is a way to get multiple streams of media involved in disc golf, don't expect to play at the Taco Bell Open, or the Dorito Distance Throws.

 

[bcr123psu]

Hold on there, go put on comfortably numb and take a bong rip. This sounds like hippie paranoia to me. Has Nike taken over Skateboarding? Snowboarding? Surfing? Hell ANY extreme sport? Name the top 3 Tennis brands. Even in baseball smaller brands thrive - Louisville Slugger, MacGregor, Wilson, etc.

You're totally overlooking the # of patents Innova has as well.

You're TOTALLY forgetting that WE the consumer have the power. If Nike were to attempt the crappiest discs possible and shove them at us, we'd reject them faster than a lightning disc. It's all about what the pros play with when the sport gets to that level of recognition. If Climo throws Innova, Doss throws Discraft, and Locastro throws Gateway - chances are we will too.

This isn't hippie paranoia (although, thanks for the BH offer), but how competitive forces work. Read a half dozen or so Harvard Business Review case studies on immerging markets and you'll see that this is how things play out when there is a substantial, sustainable profit to be realized. The first movers and the innovators pave the way and do all the grunt work. Then a larger fish comes along and eats or kills the small fish and focuses on profit maximization by squeezing the supply chain.

I was using Nike as an example of a larger company that has the industry clout to step into the DG market and take over. I wasn't saying that they were actually going to do that. Henceforth, I'll refer to whatever industry giant you'd like to use for the purposes of comparison as Company X.

But it's all about the money. As long as Company X can make a disc that Climo, Doss, Jenkins, Locastro, Feldberg, etc. would be willing to throw (even though it's inferior to an existing brand) and endorse them at levels unattainable by Innova, Discraft, or Gateway, then you'd start to see a change in the behavior of buyers.

Further, retailers would be bombarded with Company X products, displays, and other swag. The average Joe disc golfer might not be able to discern the subtle differences between Company X and Innova discs, but would see that there are more Company X discs promoted by more top pros and they more prominently displayed and would likely buy Company X over Innova.

Yeah, we have the power, but I believe that there are enough consumers that aren't as well-informed as the people on here that would go with the cheapest, shiniest product from Company X and, in time, would put the smaller companies out of business.

 

[DiscJunkie]

I'm very conflicted about the "present state" vs. "big sport" debate.
I know that bringing this sport into the mainstream would mean more and better courses.
BUT,
Mainstream means $$ out of my pocket.
Right now I travel 3 hrs to see the USDGC every year. Admission last year was $25 for all three days. What do you think it would cost for the Masters or Super Bowl, etc?

 

[craftsman]

Then you spend way too much, or you don't know people who play other sports on a regular basis. If DG equipment had that sort of high level of profitability, we'd see larger companies gettting in on the take. This isn't a matter of opinion, it's economics.

that said...



Hold on there, go put on comfortably numb and take a bong rip. This sounds like hippie paranoia to me. Has Nike taken over Skateboarding? Snowboarding? Surfing? Hell ANY extreme sport? Name the top 3 Tennis brands. Even in baseball smaller brands thrive - Louisville Slugger, MacGregor, Wilson, etc.

You're totally overlooking the # of patents Innova has as well.

You're TOTALLY forgetting that WE the consumer have the power. If Nike were to attempt the crappiest discs possible and shove them at us, we'd reject them faster than a lightning disc. It's all about what the pros play with when the sport gets to that level of recognition. If Climo throws Innova, Doss throws Discraft, and Locastro throws Gateway - chances are we will too.

Couple things;
- Talk to me about dg equipment costs in a couple years
all of the best players I've seen have thousands of dollars worth. Just my normal bag and what's in it equals over $500. Not including shoes and clothes.
- Nike bought out vans and I believe chuck Taylor. They haven't produced skateboards yet because without the expierence, production is too costly. That's why they got a pro to help design thier 6.0 skate line. Plastics engineering is more complex then skateboards. If they knew what we wanted and could produce it cheaply- they would.
- patents are time sensitive- they expire.

 

[chuckdisc]

Slow, Steady growth will bring about the positives of being "big" and cut down on the negatives.

As for whether or not I think it will go big, I think it will, but it's not going to be soon, and I'm happy for that.

oneday!...

 

[craftsman]

Btw, bells, pepsi, viatiman water, monster, and budweiser have all sponsored dg at one time.

 

[beatUPboss]

thank all of u 4 your two cents for every dollor

 

[Apothecary]

oh, to be sponsored by budweiser...