Sudden Death Options

[ERicJ]

And I've never seen a disc golf TD have a meeting to go over rules differences with tiebreaker participants. Not that that in any way means it doesn't happen. But all I ever see is a TD say "You guys are tied, go do a playoff."

 

[biscoe]

And I've never seen a disc golf TD have a meeting to go over rules differences with tiebreaker participants. Not that that in any way means it doesn't happen. But all I ever see is a TD say "You guys are tied, go do a playoff."

Ever see a TD say "You guys are tied, go play a round"?

 

[DavidSauls]

Out of curiosity, how has the teeing order been determined for tie-breakers at Worlds?

It wouldn't be definitive but, lacking clear instructions in the rulebook, it might have some weight as a precedent.

Not that it matters a whole lot, since prior best round, prior best hole, and flipping, each have a reasonable rationale. Anyone ever get bent out of shape because the wrong method was used?

 

[uncle pennybags]

Ever see a TD say "You guys are tied, go play a round"?

Happens all the time at my local c tiers.

 

[araytx]

Since the rulebook doesn't actually define a "round" it's probably pointless to argue it. But do a search for "round" on the rulebook PDF and see how many rules are specific to a "round". If you say a playoff is NOT a round then a bunch of rules don't apply and it's not the same game anymore.

Come on my friend. Just because it's not a "round" doesn't mean that "all rules for a round don't apply to it." The rounds have their rules, and the playoff tiebreakers have their rules. They're not all the same but some are. Just like NCAA football, soccer, tennis, etc. similar rules but not the same. Yes, there are some rules for rounds that don't apply in the tiebreaker. Like tennis's tiebreaker not being a game. Similar but not same.

And I've never seen a disc golf TD have a meeting to go over rules differences with tiebreaker participants. Not that that in any way means it doesn't happen. But all I ever see is a TD say "You guys are tied, go do a playoff."

Then you've not watched a lot of DG videos or live coverage. I've seen that several times. I'll pull on up and post it later today.

Happens all the time at my local c tiers.

Our point made.

 

[ejvogie]

And I've never seen a disc golf TD have a meeting to go over rules differences with tiebreaker participants. Not that that in any way means it doesn't happen. But all I ever see is a TD say "You guys are tied, go do a playoff, and start on this hole."

FTFM

Happens all the time at my local c tiers.

^here as well

 

[JC17393]

With the playoff today at the Vibram, I hope that answers the question of how teeing order is determined at the highest level of PDGA events. Michael Johansen had the hot round in round 4 to force the tie, and he got honors to tee first as a result.

 

[JoakimBL]

I realize that the discussion has moved on, but wanted to comment on this anyway:

How: random.org app on my phone.

When: after the round.

Why: if you start on the last hole and work backwards or first hole and work forwards then you can have the same predetermined perceived throwing style favoritism that Chuck started this thread with. If you pick the tiebreak starting hole at random (assuming the course is balanced) you take away that predetermined favoritism. So it is basically flipping a coin to see who gets the favoritism but the final determination is still based on the outcome of the holes not the coin flip itself.

This way of doing it, would statisticly favor the hot round. And in cases where the leader might have had a bad round, and the other a hot round from a lower card, he might have a lot of holes with better scores. In an extreme situation for emphasis, a player can be in a position not to be able to win this way, as the other player has tied or won all holes. So if you advocate this as fairer than hot round, you would be wrong.

 

[JoakimBL]

I can see the argument for a play off not to be considered a "round". That however doesn't make an argument to invent an arbitrary different way of determining the teeing order, that the rulle book or competition manual doesn't mention anywhere. The only logical way, is the same way as determining the order of the next round. That some are used to it, doesn't make it logical.

 

[araytx]

I can see the argument for a play off not to be considered a "round". That however doesn't make an argument to invent an arbitrary different way of determining the teeing order, that the rulle book or competition manual doesn't mention anywhere. The only logical way, is the same way as determining the order of the next round. That some are used to it, doesn't make it logical.

If you can see the argument for a playoff not to be considered a new "round", then rationalize for me the difference between the rule book's teeing order being determined by hot round vs teeing order being determined by last hole played.

 

[JC17393]

It's not a continuation of the previous round, as the previous round ended with the final hole out and the totalling and turning in of the scorecard, so how exactly does one use last hole played? Further, what if the players that are tied played on separate cards in the previous round? Which previous hole should be used to determine teeing order in that case?

We saw a demonstration live on the internet barely 48 hours ago in which the PDGA Events Manager stated that Michael Johansen, by virtue of his better previous round, was to tee first in his playoff with Bradley Williams. This wasn't an arbitrary decision by a TD, this was the TD deferring to the knowledge of the PDGA official to ensure the correct procedure was used.

 

[JoakimBL]

If you can see the argument for a playoff not to be considered a new "round", then rationalize for me the difference between the rule book's teeing order being determined by hot round vs teeing order being determined by last hole played.

it's a new something. That something may not be a "round" but it is most definitely not a continuation of the same round. As JC says, they may not have played on the same card, so that alone dictates that when the playoff begins, it is something entirely new. It would be preferable if the rule book stated exactly how to determine the teeing order, but it doesn't. Most closely related is the beginning of a new round, so logic dictates that is what you do. You don't flip a coin (which makes sense, because the play off may have more than two players anyway), there is not mention of coin flips anywhere in the rules, so why would you all of a sudden bring that into it?