The number of disc golf player has declined, by a large number.....

[dehaas]

Competitive disc golf is NOT recreational disc golf. I entered a few things last year. Am not this year. Doesn't mean I've stopped buying discs, nor going out as much as I can. Nor does that represent how much I pay in annually at the private / league disc golf level either.
Meh.

I would imagine there are a lot of covid boomers in this boat. New hobby, get real into it real quick. See tournament footage online and say I wanna be like Paul, Ricky, and Simon, join the pdga and sign up for a handful of tournaments and quickly realize tournament golf is way different than casual rounds. Also quickly realize the shortcomings of the am system and lose interest after continually getting smoked by baggers.

 

[Cgkdisc]

I would imagine there are a lot of covid boomers in this boat. New hobby, get real into it real quick. See tournament footage online and say I wanna be like Paul, Ricky, and Simon, join the pdga and sign up for a handful of tournaments and quickly realize tournament golf is way different than casual rounds. Also quickly realize the shortcomings of the am system and lose interest after continually getting smoked by baggers.

At least from a competition standpoint, a different model is needed to retain competitive players over 40.

 

[Countchunkula]

I hope the number of casual chuckers has declined. Not a fan of crowded courses full of people who don't know what they're doing.

I agree, but I'm equal opportunity. Super serious players who are all geared up and sorting through all 30+ discs before each shot are obnoxious too.

I just don't like waiting.

 

[acrosley]

As others have mentioned a lot of us with PDGA numbers haven't bothered to re-up. Personally it was worth it initially to get a number and a neat little welcome pack but I don't play enough tournaments to justify the cost. I am slightly chagrinned that you have to be active to play in B tiers now.

I haven't noticed much decrease in traffic on my local courses (West central Indiana) but they weren't exactly filled to the brim to begin with. It does seems like registrations fill up much slower than 2 years ago FWIW however.

 

[PastorofMuppets]

Not sure how everyone else's areas are, but I know in my area there is probably at most 10 players who have active PDGA numbers and play sanctioned tournaments. Whereas there is probably over 100 that play casually on and off throughout the year. Most have no desire to conform to rules, pay entry fees, play tournaments, or travel. Couple that with people who feel completely disconnected from the PDGA when they were members and took a hard line on not renewing, small sample group, but they exist. The sport is fine, PDGA membership might not be long term for those not seeking to be professionals.

 

[Sewer bill]

Has play it again sports had a boom in inventory? I feel like that might be another indicator.

 

[coupe]

Has play it again sports had a boom in inventory? I feel like that might be another indicator.

The 3 PIASs I've been selling used plastic to for the past 20-some years have. Pre-pandemic they offered $2 cash/$3 store credit for baseline, $3 cash/$4.50 credit for intermediate, and $4 cash/$6 credit for premium. As late as Nov '22 they were paying $3/$4.50/$6 for both cash and credit because they couldn't keep up with demand. (More than once I dropped 30-40 discs at a time that went straight into their used bin, and two days later they were all gone.) Now they're back to the pre-pandemic cash/credit split and the used bins are pretty much always overflowing.

 

[dehaas]

At least from a competition standpoint, a different model is needed to retain competitive players over 40.

Are you talking about the large approaching herd of pre DGPT MPO touring pros?

 

[txmxer]

The 3 PIASs I've been selling used plastic to for the past 20-some years have. Pre-pandemic they offered $2 cash/$3 store credit for baseline, $3 cash/$4.50 credit for intermediate, and $4 cash/$6 credit for premium. As late as Nov '22 they were paying $3/$4.50/$6 for both cash and credit because they couldn't keep up with demand. (More than once I dropped 30-40 discs at a time that went straight into their used bin, and two days later they were all gone.) Now they're back to the pre-pandemic cash/credit split and the used bins are pretty much always overflowing.

That coincides with supply of new discs getting back to normal so not necessarily an indicator of demand.

 

[discNDav]

I haven't renewed in about 12 years but still travel to play casually often.

 

[txmxer]

So, the consensus is generally—if you play a few or more sanctioned events you get payback for membership.

If you aren't playing sanctioned events you get little to no value out if membership.

I've played and play regularly play 6-7 courses within an hour drive. Casual play. I haven't played a sanctioned event in a year or more. I see no connection between my version of DG and the PDGA. They don't install new baskets or provide course maintenance. The PDGA is at best one or two steps removed from my DG experience.

When I played ball golf I didn't join the PGA.

When I played basketball I didn't join the NBA or the NCAA or the AAU. I paid league dues if anything.

When I raced motocross I did join the AMA, but it was the same non issue. They do little to enhance my activity. It was a feel good choice.

Maybe bridging that gap is impractical. The current PDGA magazine has Calvin on the cover.

So it's a professional disc golf magazine. Great. Not a big deal.

I enjoy DG, and I am happy to contribute to its continuation. More courses and maintained courses.

Does the PDGA have a person or group that is actively focused on those two aspects?

 

[DanJon]

I noticed the course I have opened up and have far fewer players this year. So i did a little research and found the active registered players has fallen off rather dramatically. The PDGA does a nice job of keeping up with all kinds of stuff so I looked at player statics and used the numbers from that to come up with my conclusion.

Pro(all) Am(all) Am(female)
2023 20208 101327 8103
2022 30995 141605 11683
2021 31059 113698 9318
2020 22322 57980 4172
2019 23973 53288 4271
2018 22382 46283 3945
2017 20286 39566 3382

2015 16355 27652 2162

2012 10482 15403 1237

The number of Pro female in 2010 was 769 and in 2023 it is currently at 1559. I thought there would be greater growth in that area but those numbers have not kept pace with the larger picture. On the Am side, the numbers are more in line with overall growth the sport has seen lately.

So this year we have seen about 30% of registered player vanish from the PDGA ranks. My guess is the non-registered numbers are likely off by at least that much. 2024 will be very important year, if the numbers fall, the size of the number will matter. 2% loss and none really cares, 30% and some companies might have to consider getting out of the sport. I think the loss is more in the 10-15% range, just a guess. 2025, my guess is there is a bit more contraction and then in 2026 we get back to normal growth or at least find a bottom.

Our sport is not on deaths door, just normalizing. if you need any more proof, just look at you local disc store stocking levels. They have tons of new discs and used numbers are out of control.

The Dynamic sale was well timed but I am not sure I would have done a stock and cash deal. The stock might be a problem. That deal had some interesting side notes that puzzled me. But I don't own a large disc company so maybe I am missing something.

Now for those who say "but the rest of the world is taking up the sport". Not so fast, the US market is 75% of all register players. The other 25% is all other countries combined. Take Finland for example, 5562 registered player, it's only 10% larger then the North Carolina market at 5017. Finland's population is 5,536,146, not bad, but the population of North Carolina is 10,439,388. Larger market population. There is a side note, Finland does have 2 times as many courses as North Carolina. But courses don't buy discs. They just have more places to lose them......

Last item, we will learn about the health of manufacturers when the new signings happen, I think the 7 figure deals are dead for a while. To many great players to chose from and there are loads of them everywhere.

Lots of info based on a fundamental misunderstanding, the majority of disc golfers are not PDGA members, sorry bud.

 

[DanJon]

At least from a competition standpoint, a different model is needed to retain competitive players over 40.

This is where the PDGA and DGPT (backed by manufacturer dollars) should be focusing serious efforts.

Positioning professional disc golf and disc golf in general as a lifetime sport is essential to the sport's long time success.

Older people have more money and free time.

 

[da Crippler]

Older people have more money and free time.

Not true. Too many seniors are living hand to mouth, mostly because of inflation fueled by corporate greed.

 

[biscoe]

Are you talking about the large approaching herd of pre DGPT MPO touring pros?

I doubt he is- those guys will continue to have a financial incentive to play. I think he is talking more about players like myself who are not winning on a regular basis.

 

[uncle pennybags]

I noticed the course I have opened up and have far fewer players this year. So i did a little research and found the active registered players has fallen off rather dramatically. The PDGA does a nice job of keeping up with all kinds of stuff so I looked at player statics and used the numbers from that to come up with my conclusion.

Pro(all) Am(all) Am(female)
2023 20208 101327 8103
2022 30995 141605 11683
2021 31059 113698 9318
2020 22322 57980 4172
2019 23973 53288 4271
2018 22382 46283 3945
2017 20286 39566 3382

2015 16355 27652 2162

2012 10482 15403 1237

The number of Pro female in 2010 was 769 and in 2023 it is currently at 1559. I thought there would be greater growth in that area but those numbers have not kept pace with the larger picture. On the Am side, the numbers are more in line with overall growth the sport has seen lately.

So this year we have seen about 30% of registered player vanish from the PDGA ranks. My guess is the non-registered numbers are likely off by at least that much. 2024 will be very important year, if the numbers fall, the size of the number will matter. 2% loss and none really cares, 30% and some companies might have to consider getting out of the sport. I think the loss is more in the 10-15% range, just a guess. 2025, my guess is there is a bit more contraction and then in 2026 we get back to normal growth or at least find a bottom.

Our sport is not on deaths door, just normalizing. if you need any more proof, just look at you local disc store stocking levels. They have tons of new discs and used numbers are out of control.

The Dynamic sale was well timed but I am not sure I would have done a stock and cash deal. The stock might be a problem. That deal had some interesting side notes that puzzled me. But I don't own a large disc company so maybe I am missing something.

Now for those who say "but the rest of the world is taking up the sport". Not so fast, the US market is 75% of all register players. The other 25% is all other countries combined. Take Finland for example, 5562 registered player, it's only 10% larger then the North Carolina market at 5017. Finland's population is 5,536,146, not bad, but the population of North Carolina is 10,439,388. Larger market population. There is a side note, Finland does have 2 times as many courses as North Carolina. But courses don't buy discs. They just have more places to lose them......

Last item, we will learn about the health of manufacturers when the new signings happen, I think the 7 figure deals are dead for a while. To many great players to chose from and there are loads of them everywhere.

Are you the uDisc Course Ambassador for your local? If so you can get a bunch of interesting data from there about course usage. It might be more meaningful than PDGA stats. (but not by a huge margin, because not every one scores casual rounds)

 

[mostlynorwegian]

Are you the uDisc Course Ambassador for your local? If so you can get a bunch of interesting data from there about course usage. It might be more meaningful than PDGA stats. (but not by a huge margin, because not every one scores casual rounds)

This. the U-Disc knows I play.
What courses, and how often.

 

[ru4por]

So, the consensus is generally—if you play a few or more sanctioned events you get payback for membership.

I am not convinced this is a consensus, but I am sure it is an oversimplification. The PDGA provides quite a bit more for me. It provides me a rating and a master's ranking. For many years it was the only course directory and a primary communication board. In my area they indeed have helped put in courses [for Worlds] and helped provided maintenance for the event. They provide insurance for sanctioned events and have helped with the draw for our tournaments. They help drive attendance in one of our leagues, via sanctioning. Indirectly, they provide encouragement for some sponsors of our events. [Discraft is far more engaged for our A Tier, than our unsanctioned BYOP events]. The PDGA has EDGE under its umbrella. The PDGA scoring app and TD tools are fantastic. The PDGA provide a fairly comprehensive set of rules and competition guidelines.

If you aren't playing sanctioned events you get little to no value out if membership.

I've played and play regularly play 6-7 courses within an hour drive. Casual play. I haven't played a sanctioned event in a year or more. I see no connection between my version of DG and the PDGA. They don't install new baskets or provide course maintenance. The PDGA is at best one or two steps removed from my DG experience.

I don't really agree with this. You are still playing with PDGA sanctioned discs, on a course potentially installed with PDGA help [more likely maintained or installed partially on the back of some club making money on PDGA events, on equipment set to PDGA tech standards, all while likely striving to play by PDGA rules.


When I played ball golf I didn't join the PGA.

When I played basketball I didn't join the NBA or the NCAA or the AAU. I paid league dues if anything.

When I raced motocross I did join the AMA, but it was the same non issue. They do little to enhance my activity. It was a feel good choice.

Maybe bridging that gap is impractical. The current PDGA magazine has Calvin on the cover.

So it's a professional disc golf magazine. Great. Not a big deal.

I really enjoy the magazine and it is NOT a professional magazine.

I enjoy DG, and I am happy to contribute to its continuation. More courses and maintained courses.

Does the PDGA have a person or group that is actively focused on those two aspects?

I think you should be careful what you wish for. Disc golf is a grassroots game, built on the back of a volunteer army. Courses are put in all the time, maintained all the time. Waiting on an additional organization to accomplish these could be a nightmare.

Despite my disagreement above, I DO agree that it would be nice if the PDGA did more to help the AM game. IMO, they could start by dumping the entire PRO side.

 

[txmxer]

Despite my disagreement above, I DO agree that it would be nice if the PDGA did more to help the AM game. IMO, they could start by dumping the entire PRO side.

you should re-read all you posted.

Your first point is almost exactly what I said--maybe an oversimplification, but if you don't play sanctioned events, most of what you said is irrelevant.

I am not convinced this is a consensus, but I am sure it is an oversimplification. The PDGA provides quite a bit more for me. It provides me a rating and a master's ranking.

I don't need a rating nor a ranking for casual play.

For many years it was the only course directory and a primary communication board.

But not today.

In my area they indeed have helped put in courses [for Worlds] and helped provided maintenance for the event.

They put in a course for world's? Great. A course.

They provide insurance for sanctioned events and have helped with the draw for our tournaments.

Once again...

They help drive attendance in one of our leagues, via sanctioning.

rinse and repeat.

Indirectly, they provide encouragement for some sponsors of our events. [Discraft is far more engaged for our A Tier, than our unsanctioned BYOP events].

The PDGA has EDGE under its umbrella.

Good point and part of the answer to my question.

The PDGA scoring app and TD tools are fantastic.

Thus no impact on me or 95% of people that actually play DG regularly, just not sanctioned events.

The PDGA provide a fairly comprehensive set of rules and competition guidelines.

Which for the most part vary only slightly from the original rules of disc golf. Even in sanctioned events I have played, the vast majority of people I encountered only vaguely know the basics of the rules.

 

[njgrosser]

So, the consensus is generally—if you play a few or more sanctioned events you get payback for membership.

If you aren't playing sanctioned events you get little to no value out if membership.

^This basically describes my membership (and current lack-thereof).

I joined the PDGA in December 2019 because I wanted to play in some tournaments in 2020. I played one in January, but then the world stopped before I could play another that year.

I renewed for 2021, and maybe played two tournaments. By then, I had also gotten married and bought a house that was unfortunately about 25 minutes from the nearest disc golf course. I could never get my wife to do any women's disc golf events, so I decided to just play casually with her instead of playing in events by myself. So I didn't renew in 2022 and haven't renewed since. I still play casually at least a couple times a month.

The only real benefits to a PDGA membership for me was the slightly reduced tournament fee and a uDisc account being covered. Once they removed the uDisc promotion and I wasn't playing tournaments, there was no reason to maintain membership.