xtra

[Micah1]

Anyone here have much experience throwing xtra's I recently had a chance to throw one and found that I really liked them for thumbers and found them to be quite stable/ overstable and predictable. How do they work in head winds?

 

[Nice Drive Kid]

Allz I know is they're dizzcontinued and that's why I stay away from em

 

[Blake_T1]

xtras are way cheap if you can find them.

they were my main overstable driver from 2000-2004. i carried an elite pro (x) for moderate overstable and a z for a pig.

speedwise they'd be an 8 or so on innova's scale. stabilitywise pretty comperable to a banshee but with a lot more carry.

people were betting on this to set the distance record (post XL) and stokely was supposedly throwing the elite pro version 700'+ but then the XS came out before big D and that became the distance disc of choice.

 

[cwild]

do they still make the xs?

 

[SkaBob]

Yes

 

[dgdave]

the xtra is much more overstable than the xs.

I love the elite pro xtra. it was my distance driver for a long time. good glide for how overstable it is.

 

[Working Stiff]

I know I've posted this before, but Discraft had a nice line of drivers that came out in 1998-2000 in the Elite Pro series. From least to most stable they were the XL, XS, X2, Xtra and Xtreme. On the Innova scale, they were speed 8. They stood up very well to the Innova drivers that came out at the same time (Leopard-Eagle-TeeBird-Banshee.) The Discraft drivers were faster and longer than their contemporary Innova drivers and the distance title was held by a Discraft disc for a long time.

Fast forward a decade...the Eagle-TeeBird have become sainted discs that are a must have for many players and have come to define the term "fairway driver." The X2, Xtra and Xtreme are long gone, and the XS and XL are often overlooked when talking about a good fairway driver.

Why is this? I don't know, but I know it was NOT because the Discraft drivers were no good. They are very good discs, and if you can find them you can pick them up for next to nothing. If I could find a stash of X2s or Xtras I would defiantly pick them up.

 

[Glock231]

The elite z xtras are crazy stable, at least the one I threw. Nice disc though.

 

[Crossed Reality]

I'm the only person I know who uses an XS nowadays. It's the only driver I keep in my bag (I'm very minimalist) other than a 141 gram beat-to-shit Cheetah for rollers.

 

[rusch_bag]

I found an old elite XS in my stack of shit the other day that I didn't know that I had. Maybe I will try throwing it a little.

 

[elevated plastic]

I replaced mine w/ a Z Xtreme, doesn't go that far, but man is that thing stable

 

[Hoey1]

I From least to most stable they were the XL, XS, X2, Xtra and Xtreme.

The X2, Xtra and Xtreme are long gone, and the XS and XL are often overlooked when talking about a good fairway driver.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was pretty certain the XS is slightly more understable than the XL. Definately agree though that they both are often over looked.

 

[garublador1]

I From least to most stable they were the XL, XS, X2, Xtra and Xtreme.

The X2, Xtra and Xtreme are long gone, and the XS and XL are often overlooked when talking about a good fairway driver.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was pretty certain the XS is slightly more understable than the XL. Definately agree though that they both are often over looked.

I was under the impression that the XS is faster than the XL. If the XL is analogous to a TL the XS is analogous to a Viking.

 

[Blake_T1]

Why is this? I don't know, but I know it was NOT because the Discraft drivers were no good. They are very good discs, and if you can find them you can pick them up for next to nothing. If I could find a stash of X2s or Xtras I would defiantly pick them up.

WS: discraft the company and often their players have a tendency to push their latest and greatest. in turn, the sales on older discs suffer as the competitive regime drop the oldies but goodies for the newer discs. the rec crowd generally sticks to their stable to understable drivers when it comes to slower discs. the result is suffering sales on older models and discraft discontinues them.

hence, many of their best discs got tossed by the wayside since everyone stopped buying them.
X-Clone, X2, Xtra, MRV, etc.

 

[SpikeHyzer]

I have a stack of Z-Xtra's that I use only for thumbers. This disc has the flight path of a firebird thumber, but is a whole lot easier to grip for the thumber. Pure money.

 

[Hoey1]

I From least to most stable they were the XL, XS, X2, Xtra and Xtreme.

The X2, Xtra and Xtreme are long gone, and the XS and XL are often overlooked when talking about a good fairway driver.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was pretty certain the XS is slightly more understable than the XL. Definately agree though that they both are often over looked.

I was under the impression that the XS is faster than the XL. If the XL is analogous to a TL the XS is analogous to a Viking.

sounds apt.

 

[Blake_T1]

the XS varies in stability greatly from plastic to plastic, so does the XL.

 

[Working Stiff]

WS: discraft the company and often their players have a tendency to push their latest and greatest. in turn, the sales on older discs suffer as the competitive regime drop the oldies but goodies for the newer discs.

Not a big deal, but Innova does this as well.

My guess has always been that Innova sells a lot more discs, so even a slow seller might move enough numbers to justify the space on the shelf. The sales of the XD might be small compared to the Aviar, but large enough to justify the space XD's take up in the warehouse. Discraft sells a fraction of the golf discs Innova does, so their slow sellers don't push very many numbers at all. The shelf space would be better used for a FLX version of something that DOES sell. They have a smaller profit margin, and that leaves them with less margin for error in their inventory. So while I can look at Discraft and think "The Xtra really filled a hole in their line-up. Why did it go away?" The fact is that I don't have to consider sales and inventory.

Also, Discraft likes us to think of them as a disc golf company. From some dealing with them a long time ago, I always got the impression that if disc golf disappeared and they were left to sell Ultra-Stars and Sky-Stylers, that would be fine by them. I see them as a Freestyle/Ultimate company that sells some golf discs. Innova is a disc golf company that sells some doggie toys. That may or may not affect how they approach business decisions regarding what golf discs go OOP.

As for the XL & XS, that is probably right. The XS came out at right about the same time that my oldest kid was born, so I don't really remember anything about it.

 

[Blake_T1]

yah, it's definitely an economics thing.

if you sell 50 z buzzz to every 1 z breeze, it's not economically viable to produce any z breeze.

that's assuming, however, that the demand curve is outside of the manufacturer's control... but that isn't true. if a slow driver is beginner friendly, what's the easiest way to boost its sales... put a 0 stability rating on it.

if a disc like the X2 has grown archaic in its speed but is still one of the most accurate and predictable discs on the planet... then advertise it as the most accurate and predictable driver made by discraft, etc.

phasing out items immediately after they are out of the spotlight sacrifices the sunk costs of actually making it in the first place.

there's 3 ways to really get some hype about discs. discraft seems to choose only 2 of them (the first 2).
1. bring out a new disc.
2. make good discs that sell themselves by being good discs.
3. advertise or market discs in a certain way.

i like their products but i feel they have always over or underestimated the player base.

e.g. all beginners should be throwing storms, stratii, glides, breeze, etc. which underestimates what players want to throw.

e.g. all serious players have enough arm for surges, forces, pulses, avengers etc. which overestimates what players can throw.

this kind of thing leads to some serious gaps in the line, especially amongst moderate stability.

 

[Working Stiff]

Discraft is strangely quiet in many ways. Since Keith Murray left, there is no real "personality" i.e somebody working for the company on the Internet promoting their products. Disc golf is like a small town...it's who you know. It's personality driven. The fact that Dave Dunipace and Dave McCormack pop up on the Internet where players can ask them questions helps build loyalty to their brands. Jim Kenner does not have to be that guy. As a matter of fact, he has such a low profile in disc golf he might be a bad choice. But there ought to be somebody on the Discraft payroll who can be the voice of the company to disc golfers.

I'll use the Zoom or Zone as an example. Nobody really knows if it is one disc, two discs, a putter or a midrange. Obviously they had some protos out to the public. By now Innova or Gateway would have answered some questions and started to build some excitement for the upcoming product. Discraft says nothing and expects us to build up our own excitement. Guess what? I'm not excited.

Players love the Innova ratings. I can usually figure out what to expect from a Discraft discs, but it takes some reading over and above looking at four numbers. I'm sure Innova would sue the pants off Discraft if they tried to co-op the Innova ratings, but Discraft could come up with a more user friendly ratings guide to push their products. That would help market their discs right there.

Innova has its strange marketing strategies as well. Gateway is so seat-of-the-pants I don't think what they do even qualifies as marketing. So it is not as if Discraft is unusual. However I see so many things they could easily do that would make a difference, it makes me wonder why they don't.