803.01 Moving Obstacles

[biscoe]

Here ya go:

802.03 Excessive Time A. 2.

1 After the previous player has thrown; and,
2 After they have had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine the lie; and,

Arrive at and determine the lie. If there is a discussion with a card mate if it a legal stance, that does not eat into the 30 seconds. That would be part of determining the lie correct?

If it takes the player 45 seconds to get through the bush and get to the lie, then the 30 seconds starts, as long as someone on the card announces they are starting the 30 second clock.

There is zero requirement to announce you are starting the 30 second count- you are on the other hand required to announce you are starting the clock on looking for a lost disc. I tend to agree that the time needed to get through the bush to the lie is not subject to being part of the 30 seconds however.

 

[foxdawg10]

There is zero requirement to announce you are starting the 30 second count- you are on the other hand required to announce you are starting the clock on looking for a lost disc. I tend to agree that the time needed to get through the bush to the lie is not subject to being part of the 30 seconds however.

Has that changed? Maybe it's an urban legend that the 30 second rule needs to be announced.

 

[biscoe]

Has that changed? Maybe it's an urban legend that the 30 second rule needs to be announced.

Has not changed, has never needed to be announced.

 

[Steve West]

There is zero requirement to announce you are starting the 30 second count- you are on the other hand required to announce you are starting the clock on looking for a lost disc. I tend to agree that the time needed to get through the bush to the lie is not subject to being part of the 30 seconds however.

No one is throwing when the group is looking for a disc, so announcing that the clock has started will not distract someone.

We should not be talking to someone who is about to throw, so no announcing the 30 seconds has started, and no announcing that it has expired, until the thrower is done throwing.

And yes, the time needed to get through the bush to the lie is not subject to being part of the 30 seconds. Taking more time than needed is part of the 30 seconds.

 

[chevis]

803.01

1. A player must choose the stance that results in the least movement of any obstacle that is a permanent or integral part of the course. Once a stance has been taken, the player may not move an obstacle in order to make room for a throwing motion. It is legal for a player's throwing motion to cause incidental movement of an obstacle.
2. A player is not allowed to move any obstacle on the course, with the following exceptions:
   1. A player may move casual obstacles that are on the playing surface farther from the target than the front edge of the lie. A casual obstacle is any item or collection of loose debris (such as stones, leaves, twigs, or unconnected branches), or any item as designated by the Director. Objects intentionally placed as part of the course or event are not casual obstacles.

no where in the rule does it say how to get to your lie or establish your stance, only that you must choose the stance with the least movement of obstacles. doesn't this mean you could go into the bush from any direction to establish your lie/stance as long as the stance you choose is the one with the least movement of any obstacle?
now one could argue that going in from the front is moving an obstacle in order to make room for your throwing motion, but as long as all the branches return to how they were before you entered, there shouldn't be a problem... what is interesting is the q/a that states you can't knock down a spiderweb in front of your lie, so if there happens to be a spiderweb you cannot go to your lie from the front; which your opponent could then argue there was a spiderweb you didn't see. i guess to avoid any possible call you should approach your lie from behind.

 

[TheOtherBill]

What about this old 'Barry Schultz move' where he steps into the bush (at 27 seconds in)? That clearly moves some branches and explicitly says "backing into the bush" and moves branches with his torso as well.

 

[foxdawg10]

803.01

no where in the rule does it say how to get to your lie or establish your stance, only that you must choose the stance with the least movement of obstacles. doesn't this mean you could go into the bush from any direction to establish your lie/stance as long as the stance you choose is the one with the least movement of any obstacle?
now one could argue that going in from the front is moving an obstacle in order to make room for your throwing motion, but as long as all the branches return to how they were before you entered, there shouldn't be a problem... what is interesting is the q/a that states you can't knock down a spiderweb in front of your lie, so if there happens to be a spiderweb you cannot go to your lie from the front; which your opponent could then argue there was a spiderweb you didn't see. i guess to avoid any possible call you should approach your lie from behind.

Next time I'm just going to make a better shot, not end up in bush, lol.