Bradley Williams Suspended

[lyleoross]

The time does not really matter to me at all. Just refreshing that the DGPT marketing director doesn't go all racist on african american children in the pool with his elitist buddies.

You care to explain which side you're coming from on this? I was there when the I hate the PDGA crowd tried to take a chunk out of Dr. D. and I'd like to make sure we get it correct.

 

[CraigWesnofske]

You care to explain which side you're coming from on this? I was there when the I hate the PDGA crowd tried to take a chunk out of Dr. D. and I'd like to make sure we get it correct.

I support equal opportunity swimming.

 

[lyleoross]

Did you enjoy all the PDGA coverage of the sanctioned event with all the best disc golfers today? PDGA took how many years to get where they are? Only took Dodge 10 years huh. I am OK with that progress.

I knew that Steve was good at self promotion, but I didn't know he was this good. So, he gets credit for the introduction and development of videography in disc golf? He didn't just go out and hire Smashboxx? They couldn't have and didn't develop what they have on their own? The reason you've got what you've got is because Terry busted his hump and made a product that Steve could purchase with little effort on his part.

Now, I know that Maple Hill got into the videography side of this early, but they didn't introduce it to the sport either. Lets see, who's idea was that? Oh yeah, the PDGA's. If my recollection serves, and I'm old and faulty, the first Maple Hill was 2004? My first CD from Worlds was 2003. I may have earlier, I'd have to go check. The PDGA went out and got top of the line videography of Worlds and NTs before anyone else did it.

Here's the good part, they then did what any good non-profit does. As soon as private companies came along and started doing it, they bowed out. They didn't fight for territory; they understand their job is development, and when someone comes along to do it for profit, they get out. Kind of like the their taking Steve's offer of a Pro Tour seriously and having in their meeting minutes that they think it's a good idea, if standards are met.

Now, Steve is working hard to make the PDGA look bad, and he has plenty of support. But a lot of what is being said is inaccurate and unfair.

As always, maybe I'm wrong, maybe someone else did it first But for sure, I don't think it was Steve, and he doesn't get credit for the ideas and hard work of others.

 

[ru4por]

Companies will redo contracts to account for the changes. Disc golf sponsors will want the DGPT exposure! This is a very positive thing.

Exposure to whom?? All the AM players no longer playing the events?? All the vast viewers on the new DGPT TV contract. Disc golf is a tiny niche sport, there is nobody interested in getting exposed to it.

The time does not really matter to me at all. Just refreshing that the DGPT marketing director doesn't go all racist on african american children in the pool with his elitist buddies.

Why do you keep throwing out ridiculous trolling posts?? Really, you seem to have an interest in this topic.....try staying on it, relevent an avoid random hyperbole and conjecture. Again....geez. :|

 

[CraigWesnofske]

Exposure to whom?? All the AM players no longer playing the events?? All the vast viewers on the new DGPT TV contract. Disc golf is a tiny niche sport, there is nobody interested in getting exposed to it.

I'm not sure why you think that amateurs are not going to want to throw the discs that the top pros do.

Why do you keep throwing out ridiculous trolling posts?? Really, you seem to have an interest in this topic.....try staying on it, relevent an avoid random hyperbole and conjecture. Again....geez. :|

Equal Opportunity Swimming Matters!

 

[Aim For The Chains]

Equal Opportunity Swimming Matters!

:gross:

Do you think smashboxx is going to boycott the PDGA?! lol. I have supported them b4 Steve Dodge. He was late to the show.

 

[CraigWesnofske]

Vibram started in 2008, prior to that it was The Marshall Street Championship.

 

[CraigWesnofske]

:gross:

Do you think smashboxx is going to boycott the PDGA?! lol. I have supported them b4 Steve Dodge. He was late to the show.

Why would they do that?

 

[CraigWesnofske]

You should ask Smashboxx if that is what they are going to do.

 

[LukeButch]

I knew that Steve was good at self promotion, but I didn't know he was this good. So, he gets credit for the introduction and development of videography in disc golf? He didn't just go out and hire Smashboxx? They couldn't have and didn't develop what they have on their own? The reason you've got what you've got is because Terry busted his hump and made a product that Steve could purchase with little effort on his part.

Now, I know that Maple Hill got into the videography side of this early, but they didn't introduce it to the sport either. Lets see, who's idea was that? Oh yeah, the PDGA's. If my recollection serves, and I'm old and faulty, the first Maple Hill was 2004? My first CD from Worlds was 2003. I may have earlier, I'd have to go check. The PDGA went out and got top of the line videography of Worlds and NTs before anyone else did it.

DiscTV produced a TV show that aired on some foxsportsnet affiliates in 2002. PDGA had nothing to do with it. And to say top of the line video work...LOL

MSDGC DVDs wern't the first, but they were WAY better than the other offerings at the time

Also he has gone out and hired smashboxx....and also paid for more cameramen, for Jamie thomas and others to fly in and do live coverage, and put video coverage as a priority when choosing DGPT courses and locations.

basically did steve do it all? no. has he pushed the sport forward? yep

 

[Aim For The Chains]

Vibram started in 2008, prior to that it was The Marshall Street Championship.

 

[Aim For The Chains]

basically did steve do it all? no. has he pushed the sport forward? yep

do you not remember them asking for donations to make it happen? lol. Basically same tune as the ADGT where "it is on disc golfers" or the AMs/Spectators.

Without support what do they really have from advertising etc?

 

[zj1002]

do you not remember them asking for donations to make it happen? lol. Basically same tune as the ADGT where "it is on disc golfers" or the AMs/Spectators.

Without support what do they really have from advertising etc?

Gotta build a Brand worth selling. It feels like that is what is going on. The DGPT is a bigger brand than the National Tour has ever been. Just look at the differences in websites. The DGPT looks like a brand.

 

[DavidSauls]

After reading the Ultiworld article on the PDGA's side, I'm starting to think that they're both right. Sort of.

Dodge seems to see the DGPT as the Next Great Thing in disc golf. Bigger than the NT. Perhaps bigger than the Majors?

The PDGA sees it as a tour of A-tiers. Something that could grow bigger than the NT, but isn't there yet. Until it does, they're staying the course with the NT.

So the DGPT demands equal treatment with the NT, and the PDGA doesn't grant it.

Perhaps the PDGA is right to continue the NT, until the new tours demonstrate they're superior. And perhaps the DGPT is right to go non-sanctioned, with more freedom to prove their case.

And we'll see how it all turns out.

 

[ru4por]

After reading the Ultiworld article on the PDGA's side, I'm starting to think that they're both right. Sort of.

Dodge seems to see the DGPT as the Next Great Thing in disc golf. Bigger than the NT. Perhaps bigger than the Majors?

The PDGA sees it as a tour of A-tiers. Something that could grow bigger than the NT, but isn't there yet. Until it does, they're staying the course with the NT.

So the DGPT demands equal treatment with the NT, and the PDGA doesn't grant it.

Perhaps the PDGA is right to continue the NT, until the new tours demonstrate they're superior. And perhaps the DGPT is right to go non-sanctioned, with more freedom to prove their case.

And we'll see how it all turns out.

I think this is probably pretty close to on mark. Peel away the nonsense and this is kind of what is left. I just think there is a great over estimation of how big the "next great thing" is in pragmatic terms. I hope there is a plan to cater to the AM side of things....they are your entire market.

 

[scarpfish]

Ah yes, those TDs of tournaments in the inner city ghettos where the game is played through alleys and your basket is an old garbage can. Yeah, I can understand why those imaginary TDs wouldn't sanction. Meanwhile, back in the real world, the rest of us can continue to spread awareness of what the PDGA provides and encourage them to join, rather than play down to the lowest common denominator.

Sounds more to me like you're spreading awareness that the PDGA is comprised of elitist asshats who think anyone picking up disc golf owes them a favor. That won't sell memberships around here, I assure you.

Maybe the city where you live has fallen on hard times, but I've never played a tournament where non-PDGA members were the majority, sanctioned or unsanctioned.

I didn't say such a thing. I said the TD's might consider that non-members are more likely to sit out if the event is sanctioned, than PDGA members sit out if it isn't sanctioned. This makes the choice to not sanction attractive. That being said, many of our TDs are either current or former PDGA members. Many of our players play their hometown unsanctioned event, perhaps one other, and don't see the need to cough up $50 for a rating they don't understand and a magazine they don't want.

I also never mentioned a city. The 33 event series I mentioned, where about 75% of the events aren't sanctioned, comprises a good chunk of my entire state. We've had a number of cases where the same city/area held sanctioned and non-sanctioned events alike. In some cases, the unsanctioned ones had better attendance, especially when they had a better history.

If the tournaments aren't sanctioned, nobody will get PDGA memberships. If nobody has PDGA memberships, the tournaments won't sanction.

See the problem?

I perhaps see a correlation, but not a problem. Its the PDGA's job to show the value of their memberships to potential members. Not the other way around. To someone playing 1-2 tournaments a year, that's a hard sell on top of his entry fees. Especially when there's cheaper options available.

Now to break the cycle, what's more likely... 50+ people go out and proactively get PDGA memberships, or, a couple TDs sanction and create incentive?

The likely result around here for that "solution" would be mixed. A few people would get (or renew) memberships, many more would just pay the $10 event fee, some yet might just stay home. The thing that you're forgetting is that unsanctioned tournaments are often the gateway to people experiencing tournaments which provide the incentive to getting a membership in the first place. Many of them, after a year or two realize that the benefits don't outweigh the costs, or that they don't have the time to commit to enough events to make the membership worthwhile.

That's the primary reason for PDGA member attrition. Their actual practices are seldom a factor in non-renewal.

 

[DavidSauls]

I think this is probably pretty close to on mark. Peel away the nonsense and this is kind of what is left. I just think there is a great over estimation of how big the "next great thing" is in pragmatic terms. I hope there is a plan to cater to the AM side of things....they are your entire market.

Personally, I'm skeptical that anything will be the "next great thing". I don't see how it can be without a major spectator base, and I don't see that happening. I'm willing to be wrong, though.

On the other hand, I'm not terribly impressed with the NT, and if it faded away in favor of something better, that would be fine. But I understand the PDGA not abandoning it just because someone came along with promises of the "next great thing"---even a someone, or someones, with some accomplishment.

 

[upstatedave]

Where is the who cares option in this pole. You do the crime, you do the time. If you don't like the results appeal. Other wise who cares.

 

[ru4por]

Personally, I'm skeptical that anything will be the "next great thing". I don't see how it can be without a major spectator base, and I don't see that happening. I'm willing to be wrong, though.

On the other hand, I'm not terribly impressed with the NT, and if it faded away in favor of something better, that would be fine. But I understand the PDGA not abandoning it just because someone came along with promises of the "next great thing"---even a someone, or someones, with some accomplishment.

Yeah, I agree. Ultimately, I have no qualms with any of this. I am an AM player, interested in playing Worlds and/or majors. If the PDGA gets out of the Pro business, I will continue to hope that the AMs will benefit in more focus on sanctioned events and their major events.

 

[DavidSauls]

I have a question, for those advocating that the PDGA get out of the "pro" business and only serve ams.

How are you defining "pro"?

The PDGA division guidelines? Your local 960-rated "pros", or low-900s older pros? Your local or regional 1000-rated players? Is the DGPT going to serve all these folks?

Or are we really just talking about Touring Pros, the top dozen or two dozen players?