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Disc Golf World Tour

Talk about much ado about nothing. Polo shirts aren't making it down to your local C-tier, let along league and casual play. Growing the sport isn't going to take away casual play, even very casual play. Neither group has much to worry about in the other.
 
Effectively interacting with media and fans is something that is a learned skill, not a natural one. Upper echelon athletes in major sports (baseball, football, basketball) typically get practice with this in High School. At the Collegiate level, they get more practice and receive a lot of coaching on how to handle the media and present a marketable image out. By the time the are pros, they have are well seasoned and are generally capable of handling these situations. Most world class professional disc golfers are "winging it" when interacting with media as they didn't have practice beforehand. This lack of media savvy hurts their marketability. Only a handful of the pros (in particular; McBeth - all american guy, Lizotte - talented trickster) have much of any marketable personality and seem to grasp both social and traditional media.
 
Wuuuuut are you guys talking about? Pros in general are a bunch of goons lol. And if dude thinking snow board co executives are all suit and tie hes got it way twisted. Even google isnt hard core suit and tie at corp levels.

 
I nominate you for disc golf czar! :clap: :clap:
There are a number of things that really need to be thought through before the sport commits to some image on this topic. First, I'm a business manager, the tie and suit type. Second, the PDGA has been selling the ball golf image thing for disc golf for ten years now, and probably longer. Third, snow boarding.

Snow boarding is a stoner sport, and it's as mainstream as it gets. Instead of trying to look like skiing, they took on the bad boy image and integrated it into their marketing and business plan. Trust me, the guys making those decisions don't have tattoos, they aren't angry young men, they are business guys in suits who understand their market and demographic.

No ski resort tries to forego the boarding crowd (with a few rare exceptions). They embrace it and the money it brings. They sell merchandise and make thrasher courses for the young guys to rip it up. Simple enough.

Trying to make disc golf, ball golf is, IMO, a mistake. Make it what it is. Now, we are a little more complex the boarding in that we have a dichotomy. We have young thrashers, and old guys, and the two are very different. But as an old guy, and a businessman, I ain't interested in hangin' with ball golfers drinkin' martinis. I find them to be donkeys. Disc golfers are way more relaxed and way more tolerant IME.

Disc golf across the board has two things BG doesn't. First, we like that image of difference, embrace it, but second, we believe in taking care of our venues, ball golfers pay someone to do that. Don't hide the first, embrace the second. We like nature, we clean parks, we'd never dump a thousand pounds of fertilizer on a course, and let it soak into the ground water, we care about the world you live in. That's a powerful image, organic, and easy to market.

Back to the topic at hand. Pros as spokesmen. Let them dress as they will, and tattoo as they will. But no basketball player makes a donkey out of himself to the press. They understand, as well as an disc golfer does, that what you say, and how you act matters. How you look is your business. Rad clothes, fine, just conduct yourself like an adult when you are in the public eye. That will go a lot further than wearing a polo and plaid shorts. Then, when you do talk, talk about how disc golf gets you out in nature, away from manicured lawns, into trees and with animals. Talk about how the sport preserves the environment and how we want to convert people from high environmental impact sports to ones integrated into the woods. That message will carry with adults, and the younger players will see those cool clothes and buy the heck out of them.

JMO
 
Wuuuuut are you guys talking about? Pros in general are a bunch of goons lol. And if dude thinking snow board co executives are all suit and tie hes got it way twisted. Even google isnt hard core suit and tie at corp levels.


Whether or not they are wearing a tie and jacket, that is where they are. Even the Google guys. If you look at the way they conduct business, what they buy and where they invest their money, it is true. Take Google, they invested lobbyists in Net Neutrality, buying and selling politics to keep their investment safe. That isn't a bunch of cool programmers hanging out in the loft in shorts being coolio, that's a solid business tactic meant to yield dividends and cash. You think the board manufacturers, not the solo guys making boards, but the big companies aren't businesses, run by businesspersons for profit? You should think again. By the way, being suit and tie guy doesn't mean you wear it, it simply means you understand it and how it works. I wear jeans, but I understand the crowd and how they work. Sports is money, the guys that run the show know the demographics of their clientele, and they don't try and make them be something they aren't. They figure out a way to make money on what their clientele is. Trying to make disc golfers ball golfers isn't knowing your clientele, it's trying to make them something they aren't....

I did appreciate the dude though. Hey look, I'm a dude!
 
Lol yeah tattooed NBA players to max dont get any TV time or adds.

Bunch of fluff and BS. Look at some of thr most prolific stars out there and being professional has little to do with it.

The NBA enacted a shirt/tie dress code for before and after games like a decade ago, FWIW.

No one's worrying about your internet expertise or casual round dominance, either. This conversation is about the Pro level. You don't even belong to the PDGA, so...

I'm consistently shocked at the level of immaturity and disrespect casual disc golfers exhibit on the course. Being part of a 'counter- culture' or subculture' doesn't excuse anyone from basic social awareness and courtesy, tho I hear those words thrown around to excuse it.

Also, Lyle O pretty much nailed it. Look however you want to look, use it as a selling point, but at least be able to talk the talk required in the business world.
 
Even google isnt hard core suit and tie at corp levels.
You have absolutely no clue what the executive atmosphere at a company like Google is.

It is VERY suit & tie. Just because Sergy and Larry don't wear a 3-piece to work doesn't mean their vast team of EVP's, VP's and other high ranking executives don't.
 
So anyway, I find it very interesting that the onus seems to be on the local TD's/Organizers to raise money for the actual purses.

Since the majority of the money invested by Innova will be going toward production.

Does anyone else see any issues arising from that model?
 
Clothing choice beyond functionality has to do with who has the monetary or affiliation power or cares whether they do. Snowboarders apparently cared about functionality and somewhat how they looked for their competitors and opposite sex fans when they first got big media exposure. Sponsors and promoters wanted to make money and noticed the snowboarders were fun to watch so they accepted their clothing choices.

Few have seemed to care about disc golfers or their clothing choices except disc golfer sponsors. Promoters and non-disc golf sponsors hold the power in this case since there's been little indication enough people want to watch disc golf in the U.S. So dressing more professionally is at least one thing that might move the needle a little bit. But I believe until the game is made more interesting to watch as noted in my Spectator series on PDGA.com, clothes will make little difference to the public at large if they aren't looking. Cleanliness is a separate issue and is still a key part of the dress code in most sports.
 
So anyway, I find it very interesting that the onus seems to be on the local TD's/Organizers to raise money for the actual purses.

Since the majority of the money invested by Innova will be going toward production.

Does anyone else see any issues arising from that model?

You mean aside from the model being exactly the same as pretty much every other event around the world?

I guess the idea is that if Innova is footing the bill to make the production of each event on par with the production we see out of the USDGC and the European Open (and I don't mean media production, I mean course set-up, accommodations, player amenities, etc), then anything that can be raised can be put into the purse rather than be used to off-set costs and expenses.

I can see where having that level of event production can be influential when approaching potential sponsors. While sponsors certainly are looking for as many eyeballs as they can get when they give a tournament money out of their advertising budget, the impression that it is a first-rate event and not something being organized by hobbyists could loosen their purse strings a bit faster and make them a touch more generous. It's the notion of the "other guy" (Innova in particular) sees it as worthwhile to invest significantly in the event, so they will too. Might not be a huge thing, but it could be the difference between getting $200 instead of $100 from each sponsor, or $100 instead of $50.
 
What you just described there is the very sort of yuppie conformist homogenization that a makes a lot of established players cringe when they hear the term "grow the sport". Next you'll be asking them to give up their beer (even after the round) and never use four letter words.

For every disc golfer I've met who wanted to make disc golf more mainstream, I've probably met about five for whom that time on the course is their few hours of release from the mainstream. That's what beings them peace the rest of the week. Dressing down for the occasion is part of the appeal.

Such truth. I'm in the military. Have been since I became an adult (I'm 32 now) and despite what movies may portray, we aren't all brainwashed...sometimes it's good to let our hair down, so to speak. I like playing a non conformist sport that can barely be called a sport. I am one of those who rankles at the phrase "Grow The Sport" because I know what it means. It means corporate nonsense.

Watch the movie BASEketball. That's what we must avoid.

Or, the other option, is to totally separate pro disc golf from amateur disc golf from casual disc golf. Make it like the Bigs, the Minors, and beer league Softball. Maybe that's what Jussi is trying to do here. I don't know.
 
Or, the other option, is to totally separate pro disc golf from amateur disc golf from casual disc golf. Make it like the Bigs, the Minors, and beer league Softball. Maybe that's what Jussi is trying to do here. I don't know.
I feel like we already have that to some extent.

Outside of the discs and baskets... the pro/tournament game is pretty much a completely different game from the way most casual players approach a round of disc golf.
 
Of all the things money can be thrown at, why ANOTHER tour. NT already exists, the Majors already exist. If you want to make some standards across the board fine go for it.

What money really should be used for is developing a media infrastructure. We have the players, the talent, the stories etc but we currently do not have a unified way to tell the story PROFESSIONALLY.

What good is having a tour when you can't tell the story effectively, professionally and promptly?
 
The NBA enacted a shirt/tie dress code for before and after games like a decade ago, FWIW.

No one's worrying about your internet expertise or casual round dominance, either. This conversation is about the Pro level. You don't even belong to the PDGA, so...

I'm consistently shocked at the level of immaturity and disrespect casual disc golfers exhibit on the course. Being part of a 'counter- culture' or subculture' doesn't excuse anyone from basic social awareness and courtesy, tho I hear those words thrown around to excuse it.

Also, Lyle O pretty much nailed it. Look however you want to look, use it as a selling point, but at least be able to talk the talk required in the business world.

Who do you think buys most of the discs from say a company like innova? Lol... You guys are truly clueless re: disc golf IMO and dont even understand thr target market.

Also corp google is not super suit and tie. Watch a number of their documentaries lol. Ive seen many lame ass dudes in suits just like professionals.

Live.
 
Of all the things money can be thrown at, why ANOTHER tour. NT already exists, the Majors already exist. If you want to make some standards across the board fine go for it.

What money really should be used for is developing a media infrastructure. We have the players, the talent, the stories etc but we currently do not have a unified way to tell the story PROFESSIONALLY.

What good is having a tour when you can't tell the story effectively, professionally and promptly?
Well for one, it is their money and they can do whatever they want with it. Also if you read the mission statement it sounds like it involves improved media coverage.
dgwt said:
All DGWT events will have upgraded event productions where we are focusing on the fans. People will be able to follow all DGWT events through the internet and/or local and national TV stations. Unprecedented professional media coverage is a top priority of the DGWT. Each event will be painstakingly planned and executed to give the viewers the best experience.
 
Well for one, it is their money and they can do whatever they want with it. Also if you read the mission statement it sounds like it involves improved media coverage.

Definitely, but as we've seen, color me skeptical.
 
Who do you think buys most of the discs from say a company like innova? Lol... You guys are truly clueless re: disc golf IMO and dont even understand thr target market.

Also corp google is not super suit and tie. Watch a number of their documentaries lol. Ive seen many lame ass dudes in suits just like professionals.

Live.

^^Hilarious. What are you even talking about?

Maybe work on the reading comprehension skills and check the comments re: suit and tie.

Again, this is about the Pro level of the sport, none of this is going to change your small corner of the world. And I buy discs too bro, and will continue to do so no matter what the pros or Jussi do, or whether or not I can watch tourney coverage for free online.

I think Jussi is arrogant and humorless, but he is approaching DG as a business for those that play the game professionally, from a media saavy perspective.

My life doesn't depend on the sucess of DGWT, buy I think it would be great if it did succeed, so more people could make a living doing it, and more people would discover this awesome thing.

But there's already too many people clogging my local course, right? Waaaah

Live? Or whatever.
 
Lol we have too many courses here to be worried about people clogging anything up yet still my neighbors don't know wtf the game is. That's the problem with DG is people like you honestly and even Jussi who think they "know" but this **** has been around before I was born and is where it is.

We throw discs around parks. nothing professional or entertaining about it at all.

again, live and get real. I live in the real world not sure about some of these dudes on DGCR or in the "tourney" world. Rest of the world doesn't give F about your pro status regardless of how you want to dress I promise lol. Carry on with your insults to the majority of the DG community being you seem to know so much and be so in touch with players like myself.

DG doesn't live without US, sorry....
 
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Of all the things money can be thrown at, why ANOTHER tour. NT already exists, the Majors already exist. If you want to make some standards across the board fine go for it.

What money really should be used for is developing a media infrastructure. We have the players, the talent, the stories etc but we currently do not have a unified way to tell the story PROFESSIONALLY.

What good is having a tour when you can't tell the story effectively, professionally and promptly?

QFT. And while DGWT claims professional media is going to be a large part of this, I'm curious as to their definition of professional. If they're sending out press releases and getting disc golf covered by local professional news media? Awesome, that's a huge step.

If it's the same people who are always covering this stuff, like at the USDGC, then I hope they hire a copy editor.
 
What money really should be used for is developing a media infrastructure. We have the players, the talent, the stories etc but we currently do not have a unified way to tell the story PROFESSIONALLY.

Not enough at the pro level.
 
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