Double Dragon Can Can Power Pocket Excellent Explanation

[Lastchancer88]

I've watched this vid about 6 times through now and it's just so jam packed full of info. Thought we could riff in a new thread.

Really appreciate the can-can drill. It gives a good feel for how it feels to transfer everything to the front side (crush can) and how the back leg kinda releases for the rest of the throw (toe drag). Also the explanation of Simon's footwork was pretty eye opening. I don't think a ton of people realize it's not just stepping wider to close off to the target.

Also really appreciate the power pocket explanation. I've been trying to understand the "wing down" style for so long and it just never clicked with me. Now I understand it wasn't working because I wasn't allowing the natural rotation of arm and shoulder (pronated and internally rotated). I like the unscrew the jar analogy as well for release. Explains why Gurthie gets that crazy late uncorking that leaves with zero wobble most of the time. I think a lot of folks see McBeth or certain pros keep the disc fairly level and end up shaping their body in weird ways to get that result at the cost of throw mechanics. I definitely do.

The sidearm in baseball being the reverse of the backhand is a great way to feel the whip/late accelerating. Lots more...

SW, you da man.

 

[drk_evns]

This gets you to feel the weight of the pendulum/swing with the added benefit of the kick making you sort of "fall" towards the target in dynamic balance.

It certainly showed me how much more used to the feeling my right side is compared to my left.

 

[lostDoughnut]

watching the PLDA world championships day 1 group b and this player Fumi Kobayashi has a very interesting movement that he does with his left leg that reminded me of the double dragon drill.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CRBbPCYnSre/

 

[azplaya25]

I think this swing drills video is a great compliment to the can can drill. Almost like this should be the prerequisite. Getting a feel for whipping the club with a diagonal kick from a standstill before adding in the faster and more powerful x step kicks.

https://youtu.be/7IFO7J3AV5Y

 

[sidewinder22]

Milo Lines kicking the can:

 

[zenbot]

 

[Hampejo]

Milo Lines kicking the can:

How does this go together with the advice to not be overly active with the front leg and instead be more passive with front leg and let the rear leg drive the front leg to the ground?

 

[sidewinder22]

How does this go together with the advice to not be overly active with the front leg and instead be more passive with front leg and let the rear leg drive the front leg to the ground?

You can't think about it being active or passive. What is the intention or task of the swing or kick? You have to let loose to allow the leg or arm to swing and brace up for the hit/kick.

 

[Hampejo]

You can't think about it being active or passive. What is the intention or task of the swing or kick? You have to let loose to allow the leg or arm to swing and brace up for the hit/kick.

Not my words [emoji4]

Looking good, second one better. Looks like your front leg is over-active in the stride and pulling you open or off your rear leg, should be more relaxed/passive and set down into the plant by the rear leg drive.

What I think I'm asking is whether it is the back leg or the front leg swing which should bring us forward? Or perhaps both? A combination of the spring in x-step and lagging behind with front leg baseball style?

 

[sidewinder22]

Not my words [emoji4]

What I think I'm asking is whether it is the back leg or the front leg swing which should bring us forward? Or perhaps both? A combination of the spring in x-step and lagging behind with front leg baseball style?

That was specific advice for you at that time, and was talking about you being "over active" and trying to get you to being "more passive/relaxed", not totally passive.

If you are in a standstill, simply lifting the front foot off the ground will start to bring you targetward as your mass is ahead of your rear foot pressure point and gravity pulls you targetward. Pitchers are swinging the front leg backward while driving forward on rear leg. The front leg will eventually catch back up with the CoG and pull you off the rear foot. It's very much like walking or running.

In an x-step you already have forward momentum before being on the rear foot, so half the battle is just not screwing up that momentum and slowing it down on the rear foot. Long x-steps put your rear foot/pressure too far in front of your mass which will slow you down and kind of defeats the purpose of the x-step.

 

[Hampejo]

That was specific advice for you at that time, and was talking about you being "over active" and trying to get you to being "more passive/relaxed", not totally passive.

If you are in a standstill, simply lifting the front foot off the ground will start to bring you targetward as your mass is ahead of your rear foot pressure point and gravity pulls you targetward. Pitchers are swinging the front leg backward while driving forward on rear leg. The front leg will eventually catch back up with the CoG and pull you off the rear foot. It's very much like walking or running.

In an x-step you already have forward momentum before being on the rear foot, so half the battle is just not screwing up that momentum and slowing it down on the rear foot. Long x-steps put your rear foot/pressure too far in front of your mass which will slow you down and kind of defeats the purpose of the x-step.

Thank you for clearing that out! I now see what you mean.

 

[sidewinder22]

Zach Holton Kicking the Can at the 2021 PLDA World Championship Finals.

 

[sidewinder22]

Kyle Berkshire 2X goes back to back to repeat as 2021 World Long Drive Champion.

 

[Pinchofsalt]

Gave this a try.
Felt very powerfull and the body moved automaticly and well timed in great positions for a throw, not yet managed to transfer it to the course and a runup but when I do I'm convinced it will yield incredible results. Thanks Sidewinder!

 

[seedlings]

The "screwing on the lid" and "pushing down on the disc" coming out of the pocket. Every time I focus on this, the disc is nose-up like a dead duck. I'm probably doing it to some extent without concentrating, but it goes badly when I focus.

 

[Ggrz]

The "screwing on the lid" and "pushing down on the disc" coming out of the pocket. Every time I focus on this, the disc is nose-up like a dead duck. I'm probably doing it to some extent without concentrating, but it goes badly when I focus.

46 mins into the recent jomez vid with Cory Wong, Simon throws a couple nose up shots by bringing the disc from high to low and adding thumb pressure. Sounds similar to what you are describing there.

 

[seedlings]

46 mins into the recent jomez vid with Cory Wong, Simon throws a couple nose up shots by bringing the disc from high to low and adding thumb pressure. Sounds similar to what you are describing there.

Haha, yes. Simon was doing a trick shot. I was doing the Double Dragon Can Can. Well, trying to get a feel for the 'lid turn' or 'key turn' thumb press.

 

[sidewinder22]

The "screwing on the lid" and "pushing down on the disc" coming out of the pocket. Every time I focus on this, the disc is nose-up like a dead duck. I'm probably doing it to some extent without concentrating, but it goes badly when I focus.

46 mins into the recent jomez vid with Cory Wong, Simon throws a couple nose up shots by bringing the disc from high to low and adding thumb pressure. Sounds similar to what you are describing there.

Haha, yes. Simon was doing a trick shot. I was doing the Double Dragon Can Can. Well, trying to get a feel for the 'lid turn' or 'key turn' thumb press.

Simon is finishing downward/nose up.

Jared and Kyle finish upward/nose down.

 

[seedlings]

Simon is finishing downward/nose up.

Jared and Kyle finish upward/nose down.

In your DDCC vid, you say to finish pushing downward, screwing the lid.

 

[sidewinder22]

In your DDCC vid, you say to finish pushing downward, screwing the lid.

I didn't say to finish or followthru downward, but that may have been vague.

It should be a little pendulum on the release so it finishes back upward after pushing down.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4-IN1yMQXc&t=5m