Grip pressure?

[mm1315]

Ok I've been playing for about 4 years now and have kind of reached a plateau around 400'-450' with my Saints and Wraiths being my longest that I just can't seem to break past. I've narrowed it down to a couple things but wanted a few opinions on grip pressure.

Basically I have a similar grip to Feldburg with the middle and ring finger tucked in against the rim, the index and pinky acting more as guides (I have small hands so can't get the index finger tucked into the rim like the others or it causes me to throw way to nose up). I get a good strong grip on it then with my other hand I twist and torque it to the point it can't move (this is where I'm wondering if I need to change something) turning my hand basically into a vice grip that you can't even try to take out of my hand. Basically the only way the disc is coming out of my hand is with a proper throw and a lot of snap to cause it to rip out of my fingers. This grip prevents me from using blizzard plastic or anything under 165 due to there not being enough weight to rip it out. I am very consistent and accurate able to hit my line 95% of the time this way but I'm wondering am I sacrificing distance for the consistency?

I've heard others say you need a light grip like you're trying to hold and egg and at the last second grip really tight (like right before the hit) to get true distance. And from watching pros in video that's what it seems like as well. I have good armspeed, reach back and general fluidity in my swing as well as a consistent hit. But I'm concerned my grip may be the issue of not reaching over 400-450'.

Thanks for any advice or tips,
M

 

[Aim For The Chains]

do you grip the rim or the flight plate with the thumb? Staying loose in the reach back allows for faster movement into the hit but does nothing if you are holding onto the disc wrong.

You want to pinch the disc not pull it into your palm with the finger tips.

Ever read this? :https://www.dgcoursereview.com/dgr/resources/articles/gripittoripit.shtml

 

[zj1002]

The biggest thing I preach about grip - just focus on maintaining it all the way to the target. Its not always about pinching hard at certain points, but more about holding it all the way through its release. The main rip point will be the index/thumb lock. As long as your momentum and throw is directed at the target area, the disc will rip itself out in that exact direction.

 

[geoz]

Just curious but is it better to be gripping the flight plate or the rim. I've always pinched the flight plate between my thumb and pointer finger knuckle as close to the rim as possible. I use a four finger grip on the rim

 

[Aim For The Chains]

Its more about creating a single pressure point. Where will vary given a grip (fan grip for example obviously will have more pressure on the flight plate naturally) but the principle doesn't change with any grip. You are just trying to leverage the disc so the opposite (heavy side) of it rips from the smallest (clean) point possible while still having a TIGHT handle on it as to not actively let go.

note the different pressure points:
https://www.dgcoursereview.com/dgr/resources/articles/gripittoripit.shtml#pressure
None of them apply pressure to the rim pulling it to the hand.

Rip Point vs. Lock Point
Now that I have mentioned the term rip finger, it's about time I got around to explaining it. Every grip has both a rip point and a lock point (on some grips these are at the same spot). Most grips use either the index or middle finger as a rip point and the remaining fingers on the rim as a lock point. The rip finger is the last finger in contact with the disc before it leaves the hand. The lock point constitutes the point of pressure into the hand that adds force to the clockwise rotation of the disc out of the hand when the lock point is broken. On a power grip, the rip finger is the index finger while the middle, ring, and pinky fingers together constitute the lock point. While it may seem that the lock fingers leave simultaneously with the rip finger, the disc actually pulls off of the lock fingers a fraction of a second (around 1/30th of a second) earlier. This is not a conscious action, but it occurs incidentally during a well-executed throw with a strong finish.

 

[Shamis]

If you can throw a saint 450 I think you must be doing everything right. Try a higher speed driver.

 

[RFrance]

This is the same question I had yesterday on the practice field. I'm at the point of slowing way down just to try to feel the hit and wondering if I increased the grip on the reach back it would eliminate the difficult task of timing the grip. I was thinking of not griping too tight as to mess up my form but enough to where I can keep a little momentum.

 

[sidewinder22]

Try a 2 finger grip, then modify that to 3 or 4 fingers.

 

[mm1315]

Ok went to the car and grabbed a couple discs to take pics. Basically like I said middle and ring grip like a vice, index curls round to guide and pinky either off disc or resting on the rim. Thumb placement is always the same over the line where flight plate meets rim. As far as the "faster drivers" higher than a wraith they don't really fit my hand well or hurt when I grip them. I do have a boss, giant and world for certain shots but mainly rely on wraiths and saints.

Top down view, underside with and without index curled and last is grip on the smaller rimmed Saint showing slightly different finger position.

 

[Aim For The Chains]

your thumb is too close to the rim edge IMO unless trying to throw a more nose down up-shot and should have a pressure point more in line with the middle or index fingers. Might help align the disc better in your hand too as it looks to sit low in the palm.

 

[horsethief]

I have my index finger like yours (a hook), but my pinky, ring and middle finger are different. The finger nail is like up against the flight plate, and the tips are into the rim, hopefully that makes sense. I think if you grip too tight, too early, you can lock out your wrist so you won't feel where to engage it (which is possibly what you're doing because you're numbers line up with a "half-hitter"). I try to keep my grip pretty loose except for my pinky and ring finger, i would say i hold those two as medium strength (to keep the disc up against my palm), all the way until the hit, then I clamp down hard with everything right when it's trying to pull out from my pinky and ring finger.

 

[mm1315]

Thanks for the tips guys. Not sure my fingers are long enough to grip like you do horsethief but I'll try the same pressure points and last second grip. I have nerve issues so I can't truly "feel" the hit, or the disc in my hand for that matter which I think is what causes the majority of my issues. DG is a game of touch which I don't have, I rely on technique and repetition. Figured I needed to start "from the ground up" so to speak starting with reworking my grip and moving on to the rest.

 

[broomerang]

How many fingers is completely up to a person, however based on your photos it looks like your thumb is so close to the edge. Causing it to move the pinch point into the palm of your hand, in other words pulling the disc in. You are losing distance because the last moment before release you still have a lot of hand touching the disc.

As Aim said you want as little possible touching the disc as it rips out, everything up to the point of the hit/rip is just guiding the disc to the proper release angle. I would recommend moving the thumb a little more into the flight plate and also focusing on the feeling of pinching the disc between your rip finger (looks like the middle one from pic) instead of pulling it into your palm.

You must have great form to throw 450 with that grip and accuracy is something to be seriously proud of over distance. I would say you will probably have trouble modifying your thumb placement at first, experiment with it, but don't let it ruin your form for an extra 50 feet. In the end 450 is a long way and there's nothing wrong with that. There are very few courses that reward a 500+ foot drive with a guaranteed stroke.

 

[mm1315]

Went out to the field on my lunchbreak and definitely see what you guys are saying about thumb placement and pinch finger. Feels awkward but so did the run up at first so I'll keep working on it. You're right I do have a lot of hand contacting the disc at release. As far as extra distance it's more of there are just certain holes at my local courses where I get long putts 80 feet or so that I just wish I were a little closer, within 60 feet I have a considerable better percentage. Also there are a lot of uphill shots where that little extra bit of distance would help considerably.

The most frustrating thing is I see pros like schuesterick and Ulibarri throwing a mid on a hole I have to throw a teebird on or they throw a fairway where I throw my saint/wraith. Yes I know they're pros and have been playing a long time, but why settle for less than perfection?

 

[horsethief]

Went out to the field on my lunchbreak and definitely see what you guys are saying about thumb placement and pinch finger. Feels awkward but so did the run up at first so I'll keep working on it. You're right I do have a lot of hand contacting the disc at release. As far as extra distance it's more of there are just certain holes at my local courses where I get long putts 80 feet or so that I just wish I were a little closer, within 60 feet I have a considerable better percentage. Also there are a lot of uphill shots where that little extra bit of distance would help considerably.

The most frustrating thing is I see pros like schuesterick and Ulibarri throwing a mid on a hole I have to throw a teebird on or they throw a fairway where I throw my saint/wraith. Yes I know they're pros and have been playing a long time, but why settle for less than perfection?

You are closer than you think. There's an extra 50-80' waiting there on tap, you just need to get a feel for when to engage your wrist to let it out. As with everything, it helps to slow down a little to find it and develop the feel. Maybe try the water bottle drill (SW did a video on it recently) to see if you can "feel" it

 

[chowee21]

So I read the article, and i have a question...

When i place the disc in the "seam of the hand" with my "wrist down", I can only get my index, middle, and ring finger on the rim; my pinkie can't be put on the rim.

When I rotate my hand to get the 4th finger, the disc is about 15 degrees counterclockwise from the "incorrect disc placement" situation.

Thoughts?

 

[sidewinder22]

This is the important part, disc between the biggest knuckles of the index and middle fingers:

 

[Aim For The Chains]

This is the important part, disc between the biggest knuckles of the index and middle fingers:

^Yep. You might find it most comfortable if the pinky doesn't sit on the rim and maybe just below it like the pointer on a putt but obviously reverse and giving downward nose pressure control.

 

[chowee21]

^Yep. You might find it most comfortable if the pinky doesn't sit on the rim and maybe just below it like the pointer on a putt but obviously reverse and giving downward nose pressure control.

Hmmm I feel that I get more power and distance from a 4 finger grip... but it is not on the hand seam as shown.

I guess i need to get out and throw and try a couple different things.

 

[mm1315]

I have the same issue since my fingers are short, if I want to 4 finger grip I would have to tilt my wrist down more to keep the angle/nose down. Honestly it's just not comfortable so I just use 3 fingers.