Considering this is a "World Championship" major, the fact that there is a large number of men registered in MA1 that doubtfully even play in the advanced division (rated under 900!), while others didn't get in all because of the ridiculous registration, shows me how much of a joke Am Worlds is. The free-for-all registration process is a joke. If they want smaller fields, they need to fix this or change the name because this is a step backwards. :clap:
If you think it's a joke, I see two options -- 1) no need to participate if you don't like what the PDGA (our organization) does; or, 2) as I learned when I was a kid, "get out there, get motivated, and do better yourself." The PDGA Am members don't seem to be complaining in the majority.
I think it is ... short sighted ... to assume things like this. As a very poor tangential example. We all know all the ins and outs of our disc golf community. The Charlotte disc golf club built a ton of courses and maintains them all. More than half the people I meet on a course have NO IDEA the Charlotte disc golf club exists. Our name is on all the kiosks, tee signs, flyers, everywhere. These people have NO idea. I consider my self relatively in the know. I have no idea about sites crashing on Thursday nights, whatever that means. We can debate the definition of fair or my proper use of the word, but the perception is (not my opinion) 1. It feels that the PDGA just cares about the advanced men divisions. 2. Conclusions are being drawn that either Madison is not capable of running a larger event or the PDGA is settling for venues because there are not people bidding or bid sites are woefully lacking. If Bowling Green can handle 800+ players... and a once in a decade event like Am Worlds cannot... doesnt seem right
...If for example the best proven Am world players in the world worked 3rd shift or were on call, or in an emergency (maybe wife giving birth) they would have had no opportunity to register. That is not fair...what is fair is that the best players in all divisions have an opportunity, because the earned it, to have a reasonable amount of time to sign up. they put int the work throughout the year. Your entry into WORLDS, shouldn't solely be reliant on your mouse or internet connection speed or your ability to code a computer to autofill fields.
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So you didn't try to sign up the first day that Am Worlds registration was open and DiscGolf Scene crashed and the PDGA had to reschedule? Seems strange for a guy who purports to know how things should be. And that "perception" you're speaking of is coming from a specific group of players. Go out and ask a whole bunch of PDGA members who play mostly MA2 and MA3 at tournaments what they think. (And don't say they don't get a vote -- they pay dues just like every other Am)
No one is drawing a conclusion that Madison can't handle a larger event. What we're saying is they bid it at 576, and there is no compelling reason (no not even demand) for them to be required to go beyond that. I work in a world with competitive bidding all the time … getting the bid is a contract – binding on both the bidder and the requestor. It's a way to be sure all communication is right and works well. And I also see you finally decided what was "fair" to you -- the "best players" get preferential treatment over all the other Ams, even though "all those others" are the majority.
I had no idea about the smaller field size...nor did I have any idea about the field sizes of any other world championships I played in. Just just signed up the day I was supposed to. (I knew about Charlotte because I was part of the meetings)
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There are 2 issues.
Limited field size makes competition worse for determining the divisional champions it would have been WAY better to only have 144 advanced men, then spread out those spots to other divisions. Make it hard to qualify for Advanced Men division...or Advanced Masters.
Registration for a World Championships should, at first, be selective to weed out non-deserving players.
Really??? So one of the things you're complaining about is you not reading your invite???? It was right there in black and white.
And who in your mind is "non-deserving" ??? That statement sounds very elitist and self-serving for you to say that about a member-driven organization.
Agreed in full! Imagine being the highest rated person in your age/status group in the world, coming in second last year by 1 stroke, and not typing particularly fast...so not being able to play this year. It's somewhat akin to Federer losing to Djokovic at Wimbledon 2015, Federer not typing quickly, so someone says "Oh, sorry Roger, you're not able to play Wimbledon this year".
Some things are just wrong....like the 2 scenarios above.
Karl
Seriously – comparing a professional sport with money, qualifying rules, drug-testing, etc, to an Am niche activity??? … not close to apples/apples. Of course Federer with his ranking and continued play gets an invite. But if he takes two years off and doesn't play, yes, even the most accomplished tennis player in history would have to play in a qualifying event to get in.
No. There are 2 types of fair. Random Fair, and earned Fair. In one case everyone is equal. In the other people are not. I think a lottery would not be the best solution. That makes the event even more silly. Top point earners, past attenders, and rating should be selectors. Points I would vote against. Many top tier Women play open women because of low participation in their region. They wouldnt gain points. Same with your top 10% of ams. They play mostly open events locally. Someone that plays 30 local C tiers wouldnt get as many points as someone playing Bowling Green. I personally think points are worthless. or should only barely be considered. Using points, would drive a player to play more Am events that they might not want to play. Unless the PDGA allowed you to transfer Pro points into Am if you stay Am...
If the PDGA doesnt care about world championships, why do they devote whole magazine issues to its winners and to the courses leading up to the event.
So, this rant has no real "solution", even though there's not agreement there's a "problem" (for the majority).
Like I said, it is a joke. If the PDGA doesn't care about the ams or having a competitive am world championship, they should drop it to an a or b tier and call it the ams fun week or something.
The PDGA does care about the Ams. The PDGA is doing it the way the majority of Ams want it.
Because, yet again, the PDGA has a written mission statement for Am Worlds, and one for Pro Worlds and they are very different. The reason they do that is that their membership, made up mostly of Ams, wants it that way. They've been given a clear message, "we are interested in the Pro game and it's development." They've covered this in surveys, at least two that I recall. It turns out that a significant majority of Ams, perhaps delusionally, thinks they are going to be Pros, and thus vote for an emphasis there. That means the PDGA focus is on the Pro game, and that is where they spend their time. When Ams ask for a change, in mass, I promise the PDGA will consider that. They may not change their Pro focus but they will support some sort of merit based Am Championships if they are asked to do it.
I'm reading lots of complaints, but I don't actually see any real action. Try Survey Monkey. I would consider writing a letter to the PDGA asking them to revisit the notion with the membership. You could even ask them if they would support you in setting up a Survey Monkey questionaire.
No one thinks it's a bad idea, but complaining about it here isn't going to do much. When I was more involved, one of the things I recommended is that the leadership not read message boards or make decisions based on them. It's a disaster. To get what you want, something I would say sounds like a good idea, you need to approach them in a professional polite way. The polite I recommend simply because as a manager myself, non-polite demands are non-starters for every manager I've ever met, including myself. Set it up, and I will sign it myself.
Here, here, Lyle … but I want to call you out on one thing. Everyone who is a PDGA member, who wants to argue for/against/on the way the Worlds registration is, needs to quit saying "they" about the PDGA. The PDGA is a member-driven organization; it is "US", not some nebulous "they." "You" individually may not like the current system, but isn't it the leaders' responsibility to do it how the majority of members want it? You guys think it should be one way, but I doubt (I mean, seriously doubt) that the majority of the Am members want it changed to favor those with higher ratings. Basically because they'd be voting themselves out of the chance. The PDGA has done surveys like Lyle is saying – the current system, while not perfect, is closer to what the majority of Am members want.
