Being the Rule Nazi?

[thedrew300]

I know you are supposed to call every thing. But if you are in the intermediate or rec division and a guy with no mini flips his disc instead of marking it, how many of us would seriously call him?

I would tell him he wasn't allowed to flip his disc, and if he kept doing it, I would call him.

 

[BionicRib]

In that they stand more than 30cm away?

Combination of the two.....30cm and line of play.....Ask ten random players at a tournament how far they can have their foot behind the disc......I bet you get 7 different answers.

 

[Old Bassman]

I know you are supposed to call every thing. But if you are in the intermediate or rec division and a guy with no mini flips his disc instead of marking it, how many of us would seriously call him?

I would tell him you can't do that and loan him a mini.

 

[Rondpitt]

I know you are supposed to call every thing. But if you are in the intermediate or rec division and a guy with no mini flips his disc instead of marking it, how many of us would seriously call him?

I will ask the same question in another way --

If you are in the ___blank___ division and a player does ___ blank___ (or doesn't do ___blank___) , how many of us would seriously call them? ( I get points for including the ladies)

At some point we will ALL call -- something. But, what good is it if we all have a different set of rules for when we actually do? I contend that there is more DRAMA when our slid---ing scale of rules is used than when we just simply read out of the same book.


I expect we can quickly find anecdotal evidence for when a stomped on rule is finally called (after being earlier ignored) and the drama is predictably entertaining.

I vote for less drama.
Ron

 

[mashnut]

I know you are supposed to call every thing. But if you are in the intermediate or rec division and a guy with no mini flips his disc instead of marking it, how many of us would seriously call him?

Everyone who actually cares about the rules. If someone is sloppy about things like that, they're going to be sloppy about their stance in awkward lies and lots of other things. Just because they're not going to beat you doesn't mean they're not going to beat someone else in the division. You're doing a major disservice to the rest of the field by selectively enforcing rules.

In the situation you describe, I would definitely mention it before they threw so they had the opportunity to fix it. It's always a friendlier move to warn someone before they do something illegal so you don't have to call a penalty on them, but I would certainly say something.

 

[prerube]

If you are just telling them that they are breaking a rule then you are not calling them. So you are selectively choosing which rule to call as well.

also if someone is clearly new to the sport, I would bet most of us would be more lenient on calling rules against them.

 

[Jay Dub]

Q: "But what if...?"


A: Call the rule unless it's a lower division. In that case advise and if they continue to fault call them on it.

Very easy to understand.

 

[prerube]

I would tell him you can't do that and loan him a mini.

That is what I did, but I wanted the discussion. I carry super cheapo 3/$1 minis I bought at the dollar store for this purpose. I also carry a spare putter to give to new players who are putting with the CFR Vulcan they got when they signed up.

 

[BionicRib]

I know you are supposed to call every thing. But if you are in the intermediate or rec division and a guy with no mini flips his disc instead of marking it, how many of us would seriously call him?

I'm not directing this comment to you prerube......just pointing out something it made me think of.

I would bring it to his attention offer a mini or just tell him to stand behind his disc........but if I got an answer that included......."this is rec man who cares" "or this is novice who cares" or "this is intermediate who cares"......or "this is advanced not pro, who cares" I would be more inclined to warn and stroke him because that crap really bothers me. Everybody payed to play the tournament for different/similar reasons, but there are a set of rules made up for "everybody" to follow. People who act like that lack integrity IMO. There the same kind of people who change the rules of Monopoly in the middle of the game because things are not going there way. Man up people! Play by the rules! And this is coming from someone who has played 30+ tournaments and has handed out two warnings and no strokes.

Again.......there is a way to approach bringing up/warning/stroking people to limit fiascos. And without having officials around to see everything that is going on there are going to be arguments no matter what. If you're playing in a tournament in the lower am divisions and you're playing with someone who doesn't fully understand the rules......help the guy out! If his pride gets hurt and he lashes out at you in anger because of his ignorance......then hand out strokes till he stops coming to tournaments because we don't need people like that anyways......end rant

 

[mashnut]

If you are just telling them that they are breaking a rule then you are not calling them. So you are selectively choosing which rule to call as well.

also if someone is clearly new to the sport, I would bet most of us would be more lenient on calling rules against them.

Nope, I just said that if possible I'll point it out before they actually break a rule so I don't have to call it. I would always rather warn someone they're about to break a rule over sitting back and watching it happen then calling it. If they choose not to listen or I can't warn them in time, I'll call them on it.

 

[ejvogie]

I would tell him you can't do that and "loan" him a mini.

I've never loaned a mini. "Loan" implies that I get it back at some future time. :|

I'd tell him he can't do that and advise him to stand behind his disc without flipping it.

 

[TalbotTrojan]

What if people acutally asked about the rules as they played? I often have people get annoyed at me because I ask if I am taking a legal stance or am outside of the circle. It is rather amusing but people tend to be a lot more cautious of the rules becasue I am being consious of the rules.

 

[bombmk]

I sent a comment to prerube personally as the thread had deviated a bit at ome point, but now that it is somewhat back on track I figured would be fitting to include here as well.

He wrote:
"Last week I was putting on my knees in the mud and someone said I did a falling putt when I slipped and caught myself before falling into the mud. The player who called it was 100% correct in calling it, but deep down I was defensive over the call. I think it is just our nature. I don't think he intended on calling it, but once he mentioned that I did a falling putt I acknowledged it seconding his call. "

Very commendable move. Previously.

But you are no longer allowed to call or second a stance violation on yourself with the rules changes for 2013.

 

[krupicka]

Of course for the first occurrence, a second isn't needed either.

 

[JC17393]

What if people acutally asked about the rules as they played? I often have people get annoyed at me because I ask if I am taking a legal stance or am outside of the circle. It is rather amusing but people tend to be a lot more cautious of the rules becasue I am being consious of the rules.

I *love* when people ask about rules as we play. Of course, I *love* to discuss and parse the rules...I'm strange that way.

I've played long enough that I've gained a rep as someone who knows, follows and calls the rules. I can say there is something to the idea that if people believe others in the group are being conscientious about the rules, they'll follow suit because I've seen it. All it really takes is to have one instance early in the round to establish precedence. It doesn't have to be someone calling a violation, either. Anything in which someone in the group can cite a rule...asking about stance, checking if one's outside 10m, even someone throwing one last putt after the two minute warning. If it prompts even a brief discussion of a rule, and someone, or a couple someones, can establish they know what they're talking about, it sets the tone for the round.

 

[Grungedude42]

Played a round with a self proclaimed "rule nazi"... whose favorite go-to disc was a cracked Roc.

 

[larrod25]

Nope, I just said that if possible I'll point it out before they actually break a rule so I don't have to call it. I would always rather warn someone they're about to break a rule over sitting back and watching it happen then calling it. If they choose not to listen or I can't warn them in time, I'll call them on it.

This is the way to go for people who clearly do not know the rule, or are not aware they are about to break one. During the USDGC this year, on the lead card (I forget which day, but not the last), Josh Anthon lined up to throw his second shot from behind Nikko's lie. Just before he started his run up, Nikko pointed it out. I thought that was pretty cool, as the tourney was up for grabs at that point. I may have the players backwards, but either way it was a classy move by a pro.

 

[Steve West]

Of course for the first occurrence, a second isn't needed either.

I prefer to see the rules we're talking about:

801.01 Application of the Rules

E. A rules violation that results in a warning may be called by any player in the group, or by an official. All players in the group shall be advised of the warning, and it shall be noted on the scorecard.
F. A rules violation that results in one or more penalty throws may be called by any player in the group, or by an official. If called by a player, it must then be seconded by another player in the group.

 

[araytx]

Nope, I just said that if possible I'll point it out before they actually break a rule so I don't have to call it. I would always rather warn someone they're about to break a rule over sitting back and watching it happen then calling it. If they choose not to listen or I can't warn them in time, I'll call them on it.

^^^
THIS!

When I used to referee we called this "preventive officiating" and it is considered very good practice. Tell the second baseman that you noticed in warmups he was dragging his foot across the base BEFORE catching the ball when turning a double play. Let the left tackle know between plays that the linesman says he flexes back a little far and he's dangerously close to being not on the line of scrimmage. I'd do the same in a tournament... talk to him BEFORE he ever actually broke the rule.

 

[prerube]

There is a guy I mentioned in another thread who calls rules all of the time, many are wrong or misinterpreted and he breaks real rules every 2-3 holes. he is a proud rules Nazi

In one game he: Played out of order, shook a tree infront of me while I was putting, talked loudly during a game altering putt, refused to look for another players lost disc, started his run up at his marker, stood beside his marker, played the casual relief rule incorrectly.
Simpletwist's wife played in a tournament with this player and left after the first round when she found out she would be on his card again.