Building from the putt back

[navel]

Good video.
Last part is interesting, where he talks about pro baseball players and how they talk about swinging with their hands.

The same goes for ball golfers, and in disc golf pros talk the same way about the elbow instead. When you fall, brace, shift, resist and release the throw (on auto, as a kinetic sequence) the only sensation left is the leading curl of the whip. That curl being the elbow for us. Hold on to a club or a bat and that curl is moved out towards the hands.

 

[drk_evns]

I do a lot of putting coaching without players having a disc in hand for this very reason. I want them to see what small motions in their lower body can do to their hand and how someone like Heimburg can create such force on the disc with seemingly little effort. Soon as the disc goes in the hand everyone tries to do what they know.

It's also why I like starting them at the basket and isolating motions that allow them to generate enough power and then going back and adding more. Take the stupid out of the equation. Don't let our dumb brains get in the way!

The funny part is I only feel like it really clicked this way once I stepped back to 60 feet and figured out to have a putt powerful enough not to lunge forward. Practicing from 20-30 feet never got me there because I have plenty of power in my arm at that range. Inconsistent power, but enough power.

Once I started looking at it from this new perspective, my "jump" putts look a lot more like McBeth. It's just adding enough power to hop your entire body forward a foot or so, rather than the dramatic full-body lunge that you see from many people.

 

[azplaya25]

You throw a lot of glasses of water into Japanese Girls faces? What kind of monster are you

Besides disc golf, that is my only other hobby [emoji41]

 

[azplaya25]

The water cup motion reminds me of Cam Todd. Watch him throw the water into the basket.

 

[rhatton1]

The funny part is I only feel like it really clicked this way once I stepped back to 60 feet and figured out to have a putt powerful enough not to lunge forward. Practicing from 20-30 feet never got me there because I have plenty of power in my arm at that range. Inconsistent power, but enough power.

Once I started looking at it from this new perspective, my "jump" putts look a lot more like McBeth. It's just adding enough power to hop your entire body forward a foot or so, rather than the dramatic full-body lunge that you see from many people.

Yup. I try to get people to try all sorts of different putting strokes so they can feel how the weight shift works in each but I encourage them towards a down/up weightshift(McBeth/Cam Todd style as it is so efficient and repeatable and doesn't require perfectly flat ground to execute the same each time.

Backwards and forwards weightshifts open up far more potential things to go wrong. Down/up also transfers directly into straddle putts giving you the same action for both.

That little down up and pop forward a foot jump putt is so easy on the body and so efficient at generating power at distance and it is exactly the same with just a little less down/up as the same putt at 30' or 15'.

 

[BruisedOoze]

Yup. I try to get people to try all sorts of different putting strokes so they can feel how the weight shift works in each but I encourage them towards a down/up weightshift(McBeth/Cam Todd style as it is so efficient and repeatable and doesn't require perfectly flat ground to execute the same each time.

Backwards and forwards weightshifts open up far more potential things to go wrong. Down/up also transfers directly into straddle putts giving you the same action for both.

That little down up and pop forward a foot jump putt is so easy on the body and so efficient at generating power at distance and it is exactly the same with just a little less down/up as the same putt at 30' or 15'.

Since really starting last year I've been using a staggered stance, in a bring to left hip and forward motion. I've struggled with any meaningful accurate distance on the putt at 25' out, without compensating with spin. And if I didn't put the extra spin it would have a gross hyzer like angle and fade aggressively by the time it reached the basket. Arm never felt comfortable, and I don't think the Eagle philosophy of practice with 15' putts were helping here because not much is required for 15. Which is why the thread contents caught my attention.

I brought out the basket yesterday, started with a staggered stance with this thread in mind and unfortunately still had trouble putting it together. But then I though about your post, and recalling some of my better ranged putts on the course came from a straddled position. I never really practiced straddle aside from getting out from behind objects during practice, but when I plopped myself out at 30' I didn't find I was struggling making the distance on a line reliably. Sure my accuracy wasn't good, but it was more of a I just need to dial this in sort of deal.

The up/down with the body and the arm felt more connected when straddled. There are some serious issues in my staggered stance. I caught someone on the board talking about "under and over" in regards to putting (I believe RandyC), as in try to get your putt under a close obstacle and over a far obstacle, so maybe that mentality will help my staggered stance. It seems to be reflective of what I was doing in a straddle stance.

 

[timothy42b]

Backwards and forwards weightshifts open up far more potential things to go wrong. Down/up also transfers directly into straddle putts giving you the same action for both.

I've thought even with the backwards and forward shift, the power is probably coming from the hip hinge anyway, and that's mostly vertical. Examples would be Single Leg Dead Lift for staggered, or maybe kettle bell swings for straddle?

 

[azplaya25]

Took this gif from a round Bradley shot at Roy G here in Austin. Basically the exact same putt as Mcbeast.

What's interesting is he does that slight bend outward with the front knee. I heard Climo say he did that to keep the disc on line. Is that really all it is or is there some more lower body mechanics going on. It almost looks like crushing the can...

 

[sidewinder22]

Took this gif from a round Bradley shot at Roy G here in Austin. Basically the exact same putt as Mcbeast.

What's interesting is he does that slight bend outward with the front knee. I heard Climo say he did that to keep the disc on line. Is that really all it is or is there some more lower body mechanics going on. It almost looks like crushing the can...

Maybe an inverted version of crush the can rolling inward. I think it does add more torque and my knee seems to hate practicing it, but I do seem to make more putts and have more power.

 

[flatflip]

What's interesting is he does that slight bend outward with the front knee. I heard Climo say he did that to keep the disc on line. Is that really all it is or is there some more lower body mechanics going on. It almost looks like crushing the can...

There are two separate actions going on here: as he rises (kind of a standard standing up movement, the posterior chain engaging), his disc gets on line -- what Climo calls "painting the pole." He then gets to a point where a lateral shift happens -- note that he finishes with his pelvis 90 degrees to the basket. That's where the forward drive comes from. The knee bend engages the glute medius to brace for this shift, and translates the momentum into the upper body.



I'm still figuring out the biomechanics of the kick the can drill, but to the extent that it engages the glute med for the brace, I think it serves the same function.

I really think there is a "putting power pocket." For me, it is right below my belly button, at my center of gravity. I get the disc moving vertically in line with the pole and shift towards the basket when it hits the pocket. When it's working right, the arm is just a conduit for the energy from the legs to the disc.

Somehow Heimburg just does this with a sagittal shift instead of a lateral one.

 

[flatflip]

(((after messing around with it in the backyard)))

Still learning the anatomy here, but I'm pretty sure it's more than the glute medius. The g. med. is the mover of the knee outward, which develops tension in the TFL / IT band. The IT band springs back to catch the lateral shift I was talking about earlier.

If putt like this too much without unkinking the IT band, your knee will definitely be talking to you.

 

[azplaya25]

Interesting putting article by Dave D...

https://www.innovadiscs.com/disc-golf-pro-tips/make-more-putts/

 

[azplaya25]

https://youtu.be/g1c_BFftA8o

Fantastic video about not muscling shots in your short game for better touch. Been doing that "lag and drag " drill with putts and upshot, just a nice, effortless dinglearm with a light fan grip. Feels so much more consistent to just use your body to swing your arm, even on super short "touch" shots.

 

[Sad2980]

This concept is really resonating with me, but I have a question about what this feels like during the backhand. On my better puts, I can feel the one inch punch at the very end of the putt. Given the right timing, everything comes together and the putt really slings out effortlessly.

I can see how this could apply to the backhand with the elbow, but I'm having trouble getting the feel for leading with my elbow and feeling the whip. I'm pretty sure my elbow is coming through too close to my body, but when I try to bring it wider, the disc doesn't feel like it has entered the pocket. I suppose my question is - what does the whip feel like in the elbow and how do you achieve the right position without muscling up.

 

[azplaya25]

This concept is really resonating with me, but I have a question about what this feels like during the backhand. On my better puts, I can feel the one inch punch at the very end of the putt. Given the right timing, everything comes together and the putt really slings out effortlessly.

I can see how this could apply to the backhand with the elbow, but I'm having trouble getting the feel for leading with my elbow and feeling the whip. I'm pretty sure my elbow is coming through too close to my body, but when I try to bring it wider, the disc doesn't feel like it has entered the pocket. I suppose my question is - what does the whip feel like in the elbow and how do you achieve the right position without muscling up.

My form is still a work in progress, but you may be struggling with the same thing I struggle with which is still using too much muscle. Your arm should be completely loose in the backswing. You need to feel the weight of the disc and swing that weight from the moment you pick up the disc. Focusing on leading with the elbow or how far the disc is from your body is just going to lead to you manipulating things. Your body will do everything correctly if you convince it that you are swinging something heavy. Just really focusing on abandoning the disc to its own momentum in the backswing

 

[hanger129]

Digging this thread back up after coming here from a Drew Gibson post on Disc Golf Form Review. Putting mechanics are something I desperately need help with since I struggle to get the disc to the basket without throwing it insanely high in the air.

Are there drills to get the feeling of what SW22 describes below? I've seen mention of the hammer toss and elephant walk drills but I'm not clear on how those tie in. I'm especially having trouble trying to replicate / get the feel for the motion emboldened below.

Originally Posted by sidewinder22
If you standstill centered(feet inline) in athletic ready position tilted forward slightly over knees and make a fist with knuckles vertical (forget the disc) about 6" above navel and hand right next to your abs and arm/shoulder relaxed next to body/holding beverage, and as you shift slightly from center back and forth don't move your hand or arm, but feel a little uppercut action with the fist in the backswing and then mirror forward crossing center so your fist rotates palm up and palm down back and forth following the momentum of the shift, just a little 1" twitch/punch back and forth from your center.

I see a lot of mentions of popping the disc out, which I can do occasionally but it doesn't feel like it has anything to do with my thumb (as described towards the bottom of the OP) but instead from the pads of my fingers which is something I've described in other places.

I'm having trouble sorting through what appear to be conflicting ideas and finding the signal from the noise.

 

[hanger129]

So I just finished watching the video below. Is the idea supposed to be that you push off with your back leg and catch your weight with the front leg in order to generate the whip in your wrist that will release the disc?

 

[geelaaboy]

Loving this thread

Keep it coming guys - these 1st 4 pages are glass - ceiling breaking stuff!

 

[azplaya25]

This drill has helped my putt more than anything

https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3709656&postcount=16

 

[navel]

So I just finished watching the video below. Is the idea supposed to be that you push off with your back leg and catch your weight with the front leg in order to generate the whip in your wrist that will release the disc?

Pretty much, but less herky jerky. It should feel like a smooth wave-like push against the ground moving the pressure but staying pretty centered.

Like standing on a swing:

Important! Small resistance and push against the ground creates motion out from the body, without the need of moving the whole body with the swing: