• Discover new ways to elevate your game with the updated DGCourseReview app!
    It's entirely free and enhanced with features shaped by user feedback to ensure your best experience on the course. (App Store or Google Play)

Disc Golf World Tour

Pretty interesting wrap up article. Jussi has also said on FB they aren't going to do live anymore. Not worth the $ it sounds like

http://www.discgolfworldtour.com/la-mirada-open-review/

I agree, this is interesting.

Jussi seems like a force of nature and I respect the scope and scale of his vision. However, his execution isn't measuring up to his stated goals. And there's something vaguely haughty about his views on the current state of pro disc golf which has always rubbed me the wrong way.

Of course, he's free to do what he wants and I only express my views as a customer and audience member.

First, while reading his LaMi benediction, I thought that for an enterprise that Jussi had wanted to be the slickest, most professional, most attractive-to-sponsors enterprise in disc golf history, the writing was just not professional. I could understand what he had written, and while it might have been adequate for the standards of Reddit or the forums at DGCR or Facebook, it wasn't good enough if you wanted to project to corporate sponsors the professional, slick image you stated was your goal. I respect anyone who can speak and write in another language, especially when their native tongue has no connection to Romance languages or English. But when you repeatedly put down the current state of disc golf media, you can't then be unprofessional yourself. At least, if you want to be credible. Jussi, just take some of that production $ you're saving on not providing live coverage and skimping on prize money and hire a professional writer for you're public messages, press releases and pronouncements.

Jussi keeps talking about how unprofessional current disc golf broadcasts are. It's fine to say that, if you're producing something more professional. I just didn't see any difference in the DGWT production aside from the putting stats. That's something new, I guess, but in lieu of showing full rounds or any further live action? Nah. Not worth it.

Jussi's strategy has always been curious to me too. It seems like he wants to package something slick and clean to show to bigger and bigger sponsors. That's fine. But I just don't see why corporate sponsors are gonna go into business with disc golf without a large, growing audience. To sell disc golf to corporate sponsors, the top priority has to be building the audience first. Yes, it's nice to have a slick media package and a power point presentation to show at meetings in conference rooms but what good is any of that packaging if there's no audience for your content? This top-down approach to building a sport seems flawed to me. But what do I know.

And then there's the FPO thing. I understand Jussi's decision to have one division, considering his focus on the DGWT package. However, if he was interested in growing the audience numbers of his tour, turning off many potential women audience members just doesn't make any sense. What major corporation wants to sponsor a broadcast that turns off women? Hooters? Pink Taco? Maybe. But try selling to Pepsi, AT&T or Chevy the concept of sponsoring content that only men will watch. Doesn't matter how slick your package is, that's gonna be a short meeting.

I just don't get how promotors think they're gonna grow the sport without focusing first on growing the audience at a grass roots level.
 
Jussi's strategy has always been curious to me too. It seems like he wants to package something slick and clean to show to bigger and bigger sponsors. That's fine. But I just don't see why corporate sponsors are gonna go into business with disc golf without a large, growing audience. To sell disc golf to corporate sponsors, the top priority has to be building the audience first. Yes, it's nice to have a slick media package and a power point presentation to show at meetings in conference rooms but what good is any of that packaging if there's no audience for your content? This top-down approach to building a sport seems flawed to me. But what do I know.
.

after reading this wrap up article I have to say that it sounds to me like jussi is trying to put together a "slick and clean" product in order to attract an audience outside of casual/amateur disc golfers. So to me he is working on building his audience so that in the future he can attract the big sponsors. I don't think the live broadcast that they put out is going to attract new viewers, but I do think he knows that a larger audience is necessary.
 
A couple thoughts.

I think post-produced / edited footage is a lot more approachable than live stuff. Live in it's current state is for the die hards.
I've had multiple people tell me they've gotten into the sport by randomly watching one of our videos. Derek said a lady and kid came up to him at Lami and said they started disc golfing after happening on one of our vids. It's also much easier to put together a slick and clean product when you have the luxury of extra time that live doesn't provide.

Re: The womens audience. Google tells me 4% of my viewers are female. It's hard to fault Jussi for focusing on the guys when the number of lady viewers is so few. That said I really like filming the top FPO players. Their game is a lot closer to mine (although they're for sure better). That said when you're trying to attract eyeballs and ad revenue you have to go where the views are.
 
after reading this wrap up article I have to say that it sounds to me like jussi is trying to put together a "slick and clean" product in order to attract an audience outside of casual/amateur disc golfers. So to me he is working on building his audience so that in the future he can attract the big sponsors. I don't think the live broadcast that they put out is going to attract new viewers, but I do think he knows that a larger audience is necessary.

This just doesn't make sense to me. I guess I need to have it explained to me exactly how Jussi plans to build an audience without showing the actual sport he's trying to build an audience for.

And if he knows a larger audience is so necessary, why turn off huge segments of the potential audience so easily?
 
A couple thoughts.

I think post-produced / edited footage is a lot more approachable than live stuff. Live in it's current state is for the die hards.
I've had multiple people tell me they've gotten into the sport by randomly watching one of our videos. Derek said a lady and kid came up to him at Lami and said they started disc golfing after happening on one of our vids. It's also much easier to put together a slick and clean product when you have the luxury of extra time that live doesn't provide.

Look, I understand the appeal of non-live vids. And I understand that production budgets are so tight that producers just can't afford to do both live broadcasts and non-live vids to the standards that they would like and that they (in this case, Jussi) have to basically decide between doing one or the other. I just don't see why watching pre-produced vids is any more appealing to a newbie than watching an NT live, no matter how far from the production of MNF or UFC 200 it might appear. I had the final round of The Memorial on my HD set all day long during a big BBQ at my home and many of my non-disc golf friends sat down and watched for a stretch and got into it. I didn't hear any complaints about the lack of state-of-the-art graphics or other window-dressing, because the action was compelling and the camera work and commentary were excellent. It was clear that we were watching world class athletes competing at the highest level and that message shined brightly.

Re: The womens audience. Google tells me 4% of my viewers are female. It's hard to fault Jussi for focusing on the guys when the number of lady viewers is so few. That said I really like filming the top FPO players. Their game is a lot closer to mine (although they're for sure better). That said when you're trying to attract eyeballs and ad revenue you have to go where the views are.

A) when I asserted that Jussi was turning off a significant chunk of his potential audience with his policy regarding FPO, I didn't mean to say he was turning off only women. He's turning off most women and he's also turning off other folks (some men) who enjoy watching FPO. I'm not here to argue whether that's a correct or incorrect reaction, it just is. It's turning some people off.

B) if it's true that women only represent 4% of a disc golf audience and women represent 8% of disc golfers, I'd say that's a pretty big red flag someone will have to explain to potential corporate sponsors when they ask, "why does your organization, which you are asking my company to sponsor, turn off so many of our loyal customers?" Why are fewer women watching disc golf than playing it?

C) I'm not sure what the significance the 4% figure is if the number of views for Round 2 of The Memorial was 60% of the viewers of Round 1 over the first 24 hours after airing. If showing so much of an FPO tournament is such a bad call, strategically, why did such a big sponsor (Discraft) agree to it? I'm just guessing here, but I bet it was their idea to begin with.

D) you mention ad revenue & views. Were the total views of LaMi (no FPO) sufficiently higher than the total views of The Memorial (w/FPO) that excluding potential viewers made strategic sense?

Conclusion: You say that Jussi "has to go where the views are." But Jussi specifically stated in his post on his site and over and over in the past that he wants to get views from outside the current disc golf community. He wants new viewers, new audience members, not "where the views are." How does he plan on attracting viewers with no previous experience with disc golf if over half of those potential new viewers will be asking, "where are the women at?"
 
I agree, this is interesting.

Jussi seems like a force of nature and I respect the scope and scale of his vision. However, his execution isn't measuring up to his stated goals. And there's something vaguely haughty about his views on the current state of pro disc golf which has always rubbed me the wrong way.

Of course, he's free to do what he wants and I only express my views as a customer and audience member.

First, while reading his LaMi benediction, I thought that for an enterprise that Jussi had wanted to be the slickest, most professional, most attractive-to-sponsors enterprise in disc golf history, the writing was just not professional. I could understand what he had written, and while it might have been adequate for the standards of Reddit or the forums at DGCR or Facebook, it wasn't good enough if you wanted to project to corporate sponsors the professional, slick image you stated was your goal. I respect anyone who can speak and write in another language, especially when their native tongue has no connection to Romance languages or English. But when you repeatedly put down the current state of disc golf media, you can't then be unprofessional yourself. At least, if you want to be credible. Jussi, just take some of that production $ you're saving on not providing live coverage and skimping on prize money and hire a professional writer for you're public messages, press releases and pronouncements.

Jussi keeps talking about how unprofessional current disc golf broadcasts are. It's fine to say that, if you're producing something more professional. I just didn't see any difference in the DGWT production aside from the putting stats. That's something new, I guess, but in lieu of showing full rounds or any further live action? Nah. Not worth it.

Jussi's strategy has always been curious to me too. It seems like he wants to package something slick and clean to show to bigger and bigger sponsors. That's fine. But I just don't see why corporate sponsors are gonna go into business with disc golf without a large, growing audience. To sell disc golf to corporate sponsors, the top priority has to be building the audience first. Yes, it's nice to have a slick media package and a power point presentation to show at meetings in conference rooms but what good is any of that packaging if there's no audience for your content? This top-down approach to building a sport seems flawed to me. But what do I know.

And then there's the FPO thing. I understand Jussi's decision to have one division, considering his focus on the DGWT package. However, if he was interested in growing the audience numbers of his tour, turning off many potential women audience members just doesn't make any sense. What major corporation wants to sponsor a broadcast that turns off women? Hooters? Pink Taco? Maybe. But try selling to Pepsi, AT&T or Chevy the concept of sponsoring content that only men will watch. Doesn't matter how slick your package is, that's gonna be a short meeting.

I just don't get how promotors think they're gonna grow the sport without focusing first on growing the audience at a grass roots level.

Killed it. :clap:
 
Re: The womens audience. Google tells me 4% of my viewers are female. It's hard to fault Jussi for focusing on the guys when the number of lady viewers is so few. That said I really like filming the top FPO players. Their game is a lot closer to mine (although they're for sure better). That said when you're trying to attract eyeballs and ad revenue you have to go where the views are.

Gotta get the right angles... :p
 
Let's try an analogy with the casino.

The disc golf community (big and small members) have joined together largely and are playing blackjack. If everyone plays the odds then there will be positive growth. It's a grind, but clearly visible.

Jussi comes along and is pointing to the flashing lights of the slot machines. He swears the Lucky Ducky is going to hit big. Odds are not in his favor.

Here's the worst part, Jussi is a part of the community so even if he throws money away going for the jackpot he can still fall back on the steady growth of those playing blackjack. It's greedy imo, but a win/win for him most likely.
 
I thought the Memorial coverage, event, was awesome. What I didn't realize was how high they set the bar. As good as the Memorial coverage was I bought into the DGWT and was really expecting something on another level. I really enjoyed the DGWT coverage, but the Memorial in my opinion was much closer to a "broadcast quality" event.
 
The disc golf community at large would rather play disc golf than watch it. The vast majority of players out ther edon't really even know that there are pros, let alone pay attention to the tournament scene. Even the guys who are aware of the tourney scene would again rather play the tournamen than watch the top players in the world play. This is our problem. Disc golf is just as slow a watch as our mother sport. The player base has to grow bigtime in order for the viewer base to be significant enough to draw big sponsors.

Oddly, on the gender thing, I'm probably 1000x more likely to watch female disc golf players than LPGA pros. I'm not sure why that is.
 
btw...isn't there supposed to be video coverage by other media outlets? They had to wait 1 week before releasing their vids I thought?
 
btw...isn't there supposed to be video coverage by other media outlets? They had to wait 1 week before releasing their vids I thought?

15 minutes to go. The commentary version is rendering, but I'll post the non-commentary version here at midnight.
 


A better no commentary version is uploading, which will be followed by the commentary version. Maybe at like 4 ish am is my guess.
 
So, at 38:36 Catrina's disc hits the spotter as it's rolling back towards in bounds, from a down hill slope. Other than just an "oops", could the benefit be given to her that the disc would have ended up in bounds? Or are they played like trees and other spectators as in whatever happens after it hits or touches it, happens and that's what you got.

Not saying anything about the spotter, **** happens, just curious. In this instance not sure if anyone on the card would have been able to see what happened clearly enough anyway.
 
So, at 38:36 Catrina's disc hits the spotter as it's rolling back towards in bounds, from a down hill slope. Other than just an "oops", could the benefit be given to her that the disc would have ended up in bounds? Or are they played like trees and other spectators as in whatever happens after it hits or touches it, happens and that's what you got.

Not saying anything about the spotter, **** happens, just curious. In this instance not sure if anyone on the card would have been able to see what happened clearly enough anyway.

Doesn't matter what might have happened, the rules are clear.

804.03 Interference
A. A thrown disc that strikes a person or animal is played where it first comes to rest.​
 
I watched some of the live coverage of the Memorial and the last few holes of the DGWT event. Not a knock on the people doing the production of either, but this sport does not seem to translate well live. For it to be done right would require budget and equipment far outside the realm of any rational endeavor. And even then, it would be a tough sell.

The edited translation is where it's at, and IMO, where it will be in the future. Well paced half hour segments with good graphical information and informative commentary that does not try to be dead serious is what I'm in the market for. Watching the CCDG videos in particular fueled my interest in the sport.

I've only been playing disc golf for about six months, but have been involved with disc sports for over 35 years. I don't want it to be all corporate and money driven like the mainstream sports. I don't want to see dress codes and advertising everywhere I look. Disc sports deserve a better fate than that. I think at least some people on here will know where I'm coming from on this.
 
Top