Do YOU agree with the "Top Course" list?

[Miller]

Yeah but that doesn't mean I won't rate some as 5's on here. The Phenomenal thing is what gets me I guess.

For example I would rate Blue Ribbon as a 4.5 and depending on how I feel I could give it a 5 according to the current way things are scaled.

If it helps I will keep it consistent on mine so a course which is rated a 3 on my scale is probably a 4 on most others. Still don't think this "Brainstorm" is best of the best but its a cool name.

So just curious, but what would it take to make Blue Ribbon a five? Or what would be a five-star in your book scooter?

 

[srm_520]

I still think there is no 5 yet. maybe 4.5s but no 5's.

I'm confused, you've played for almost a decade and only have 4 courses listed. I know it has to be more than than that - and then the next question is - what is the best course you have played and why didn't it get a 5?

I just think it's a little presumptuous to say there are no five courses out there. Small percentage yes - but none isn't realistic.

 

[Cgkdisc]

I've played five of the current top 10. All of those five have issues, some significant, that would not make them 5s using a more absolute scale (which we don't have) versus the relative scale being used here.

 

[srm_520]

I've played five of the current top 10. All of those five have issues, some significant, that would not make them 5s using a more absolute scale (which we don't have) versus the relative scale being used here.

And having played so much for so long (plus having designed so much) I am more than willing to listen to your opinions. You marked Blueberry Hill a five saying it was your favorite course. In almost 300 courses, is it still your fav, and do you have a top five? What are the significant issues that you see that IYO mark some of these courses down?

 

[srm_520]

God bless Google - I found some of my answers. Any additions?

http://discgolfer.ning.com/profile/ChuckKennedy

Blueberry Hill, Highbridge, WI
Steady Ed Memorial, IDGC, GA (eventually)
Granite Ridge, Highbridge, WI
Highbridge Gold, Highbridge, WI
Oakwood Park, Cottage Grove, MN

 

[tallpaul]

I have also played five of the top ten and think they deserve to be near where they are rated. With that said, there is some midwest bias here. Really, it is the top 50, or perhaps 150 that are all great courses. Think of it, the top 150, only allows the top three from each state to get in!!!!
As Chuck notes in his favorites list, I personally, think Granite and Gold, at Highbridge, are as good, if not better, than Blueberry. This, of course, should make anyone want to go to Highbridge, first chance they get. I haven't even played Bear yet.
Just for adding my two cents to the "giving a course a five rating;" I haven't given any course a five rating yet. Sometime in the next year or two, once I've gone through another 50 or so, of the "very top" courses, I'll make some sort of a decision as to what is my absolute favorite. In general, I will have to add what Chuck said, and that is that even the very top courses are missing a "little" something, usually, that would keep them from being "perfect."
To resurrect a subject that has some importance; how can a cold climate course get a five rating, when you can barely play the thing from December to May?

 

[timg]

To resurrect a subject that has some importance; how can a cold climate course get a five rating, when you can barely play the thing from December to May?

I don't think weather is relevant to a course's rating. All courses are unplayable (or tough to play at least) at some point due to heavy rains, snow, unbearable heat if you're further south, etc.

 

[scarpfish]

Regarding "there are no 5 disc courses", well, I don't think there was ever an intent to have a course with a perfect record, but people reviewing a course have to have the option to say its perfect (or close enough to perfect).

I sort of look at 5 stars as the 99th percentile of courses and with 3000 in the directory there are probably only about 20-40 of them in the world. And perhaps if I played enough courses to see one, I'd give a 5 star review. The only two courses I've played in the Top 50 are Water Works and Walnut Ridge and I gave them a 4 and 4.5 respectively, so although they are my two favorite courses, I don't consider them perfect (or close enough to perfect).

Think of it, the top 150, only allows the top three from each state to get in!!!!

Well, except for Rhode Island. We may have to use the top three holes there.

 

[tallpaul]

lol on the Rhode Island. I know there are a few states that don't have that many great courses; but, there are others that have 10 that anyone would be absolutely thrilled to play. Timg, you are correct about the weather situation. The mega heat at some of the southern courses would be as tough to take in the heat of summer, as the winter conditions elsewhere. Too bad San Diego's terrain is not great compared to other areas, or we could simply end the debate by declaring San Diego courses automatic 5's!!!; due to sunny skies. I was playing with a private course owner this past weekend, who claims winter in Wisconsin, is his favorite time to play!!!!

 

[tallpaul]

Midwest rules for summer play.

 

[optidiscic]

Weather is relative....as long as the course does not get pulled or closed for winter I don't think it should factor into ratings.......for this reason I don't think a ski hill course should ever be rated amongst the top...no matter how well designed...I prefer my courses to be disc golf courses only. I don't think a perfect course exists but I do think there are 5 disc rated courses. The best rated restaraunts still have a minor flaw and it's all subjective to the reviewer.
As far as weather influencing things theres a gripe with all weather......bugs in summer, scorching heat in texas, snow in winter, rain during half of yr in northwest, sunburns in SoCal, leaves in fall, foliage, mud, the weather can drag down the fun but at the same time it improves the fun factor as well. Weather is a wash IMO!

 

[tallpaul]

I can see, without realizing it, until I went to another thread, that this subject is being discussed elsewhere. I didn't mean to bring up a subject that as most are noting, should not really be a factor. This was simply a topic I hadn't noticed being talked about for a while. Prerube and Biscoe must have thought the same. I still say Midwest rocks for summer play. Northern Cali not to bad I imagine, either. My one trip there was awesome.

 

[culinarywiz]

Are we looking for the best signature holes on the best 18 courses ever to be compiled on one track of land?

Perhaps all we need to do is take the best mountain top vista shot from Colorado as hole one. Then take the best lake shot from Minnesota, then the best tight wooded shot from Kentucky, then throw in a shot from the coastal lines of California, then mix in a couple plains shots from Kansas and Oklahoma, then finish it all with a glorious hole 18 that has us shooting down snow banked valleys in Alaska - but only in the perfect daylight and temperate hour.

Hindsight being 20-20, I now agree that the "Perfect" course has never been created, and we should all refrain from rating 5's from here on out!

 

[Cgkdisc]

You marked Blueberry Hill a five saying it was your favorite course. In almost 300 courses, is it still your fav, and do you have a top five? What are the significant issues that you see that IYO mark some of these courses down?

My ning list is favorite courses not necessarily "best" courses. Since I'm a blue level player with a rating hovering around 950 for years, Blueberry, Steady Ed, Granite and Oakwood are all blue level courses. Unfortunately, Oakwood isn't maintained very well and Steady Ed still has a ways to go for amenities and landscaping that has been planned but not in the budget yet including getting the shorter Red tees cemented so beginners visiting the IDGC have a less difficult course layout to play.

My two highest rated rounds of 1017 and 1021 were in PDGA competition on Blueberry. Contrary to what some might think, I don't always play courses I've designed particularly well because I know what shots will really test blue level players. I try to include a full variety of shots in my designs including options for forehands and overheads and I don't throw those well. Even though Highbridge Gold is a gold level course, it also has a set of White tees (still over 7000 feet) that are cement so people can still enjoy the course without playing the gold version. My favorite part of that course is the two par 5s which I think are both in the top 10 of par 5s anywhere. There's also a par 6 but it's only cool since it's one of the longest holes in the world, not because of a challenging design.

 

[Scoot_er]

So just curious, but what would it take to make Blue Ribbon a five? Or what would be a five-star in your book scooter?

Blue Ribbon is in my top 5 courses and that is after only one round but like Chuck said it would be a 5 if it had some elevation to go along with the aesthetically pleasing setting.

Anyway Centrailia, Pickard, and CR Hill are also some of my favorites but they are all probably 4.25s. Can't wait to play a few recent Houck/Olse designs though since they probably a are 4+.

 

[superberry]

Guys you are all missing the point . . . it may be a 3 to Tom, who has rated other courses like Flip City (5) and Winter Park (4). He has a reason to declare that even if you do not agree. I in fact gave Winter Park a 4.5, doesn't mean he is wrong or I am wrong it is a friggin opinion. The overall scores are the average of all scores.

Ask him why he thinks it is not a 4.5 dont just say he is wrong! People will come to any course anyways, it isn't like a 4 is a bad course! And by a true sense of the scale there is no such thing as a 5.5 so get over yourself. It may be a great course, but it is not above the scale, the other courses ratings just need to be adjusted over time. I don't know I haven't played it, so I can't say I agree with you or tomjulio, but I will make my own determination if I am able to play it regardless of what either of you have rated it as.

tomjulio is WRONG for rating Winter Park a 4!


The ratings are completely subjective no matter how you try and slice it. Mine are, I admit it, I base some factors on my preferences (why wouldn't I). Knowing some about PDGA design and ratings, and having played over 100 courses all over the US, I think I know a little more about relative course ratings than quite a few people. But it doesn't matter and I won't get bent out of shape or call you wrong - even if you think I'm wrong - because these are all just opinions. Of course, there is something to be said about the quantity of reviews and a large number of diverse people all thinking a course is excellent. But my interpretation of Phenominal is different than others. I like that I have the ability to sort courses (as many as I want) by rating. I have sorted every course with 3 reviews or more by rating, viewed and researched each one, and probably added everything rated down to a 4 to my wishlist. AND that's the purpose of the Top 10 - to expose others to what some people think (and collectively agree) is a top notch course.

I wanna see a Top 20 on the front page! And I'll continue to look at the Top 100+ and probably want to play each one, and have a great time playing each one!

 

[superberry]

I do not hold a 5 disc rating up as god-like. To me, "Best of the Best" can apply to more than one course (and should). There can be multiple best of the best because every course can offer something unique and different.

I also very often go back and sort my own reviews by rating so that I can make sure they are all in line and relative to one another. I have adjusted on numerous occasions based on having played a better course, or similarly rated course.

Put thought into your reviews and explain why.

 

[NDABRUSH]

some people think that there is only room for one 5(best of the best) and that's their story and they are sticking with it. People can be religious about anything, especially their opinion. No new or contradictory information can make it through their"shield of ignorance".

 

[chow]

I agree with alot of the good arguments around this question about weather not being a factor.

I will change my "overrated" opinion of Beaver Ranch until I get a chance to play it dry and in all it's glory.

That said, I expect to be blown away ....

Continue with love fest....

 

[tomjulio]

tomjulio is WRONG for rating Winter Park a 4!
!

you're absolutely right! I'm knocking down to a 3.5 now. :gross:

in seriousness, it' a pretty soft 4. lack of tees is huge! and the the park in itself doesn't scream DISC GOLF (ie..Flip City, Idlewild, etc etc)...it screams "GREAT COURSE ON A SKI HILL THAT YOU GUYS DID AN AWESOME JOB ON!"..and with Silver Creek a solid 4 right next to you, it's hard to think of Winter as anything higher than a 4. But a well deserved four at that.