Mandatory Question

[Paulie]

It must be asked

Take a look at these mandos.

Mando A is obvious.

Mando B I'm not sure.

X1 lands to the left of the mando tree but before it. Is this in violation of the mando? I've been playing it like it is. I treat the mando like a laser line from tee to tree that my disc should never land to the left of. If it's in flight to the left, okay. It just shouldn't land to the left.

X2 is right in line before the mando tree. Since it's in line/on the line, I count it as in. Right?

Or does it only matter once the disc has landed past the mando?

 

[ChrisKramer]

Unless the mando defines an "island fairway," you must pass to the right (in case "B") of the tree. If you land short of the tree (but in bounds) you haven't missed the mando and can play from your lie. The mando defines flight path not landing area so, both X1 and X2 are safe. X3 is a violation since it flew to the left of the tree. The important criteria is on which side of the mando your disc flew.

 

[Cgkdisc]

You only miss the mando if your disc lands past the line thru the mando object on the "wrong" side. Your X1 and X2 throws are both good in Mando B. You would have to land past the Mando B tree similar to the X1 shot in Mando A to miss it.

 

[ChrisKramer]

Wait a sec Chuck, I thought the mando defined the flight of the disc, not the landing area. Am I wrong?

 

[jeverett]

Wait a sec Chuck, I thought the mando defined the flight of the disc, not the landing area. Am I wrong?

It's kinda both.. for example, if your disc in-flight passes the wrong side of the mando, hits the ground, rolls backwards, and ends up short of the mando, that's still fair. You've 'missed' the mando if the disc passes the wrong side of the mando and comes to rest past the invisible line extending out (in both directions) 90 degrees from the mando object.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Flight path AND landing area for missing the mando. Flight path only for making the mando.

 

[ChrisKramer]

I getcha, as long as the disc comes to rest short of the mando, you are OK. The landing zone refers to a disc stopping past the mando having passed to the wrong side. I think we said the same thing with different words. In any event, in case "B," both X1 and X2 are safe, X3 is out since it is past the mando AND passed to the wrong side. His original question had the line from the tee to the mando as an integral part of the rule. This is where I got confused since the mando line is 90º to the line of play, not parallel to it.

 

[Cgkdisc]

The default line is 90 degrees to the line of play. However, the TD can actually mark both the missed mando line and made mando line and neither has to be 90 degrees to the line of play nor do they have to be in line with each other.

 

[araytx]

It must be asked

Take a look at these mandos.

Mando A is obvious.

Mando B I'm not sure.

X1 lands to the left of the mando tree but before it. Is this in violation of the mando? I've been playing it like it is. I treat the mando like a laser line from tee to tree that my disc should never land to the left of. If it's in flight to the left, okay. It just shouldn't land to the left.

X2 is right in line before the mando tree. Since it's in line/on the line, I count it as in. Right?

Or does it only matter once the disc has landed past the mando?

You can think of it like this. Just like there is a "line to the basket" on the sign defining the fairway, you don't necessarily have to play that line. Seeing where the basket is on diagram B, you might actually be well served (depending upon what other obstacles exist on the hole) to throw short and to the "wrong side" of the mando, because your approach to the basket might be an easier shot. I am sure there are scenarios where X1 might actually be a better shot that either X2 or an X4 which makes the mando.

 

[Paulie]

Got it. This actually makes the basket easier to play. Thanks.

 

[freakinback]

Thanks. I did not know the answer to this either. Suddenly a course I play got a little easier.

 

[412Disc]

well I learned something new

 

[bombmk]

In general I would say that a mando marking should indicate the line. It being a sign with a distinct extension from which to extrapolate the line. Otherwise you are left with estimating the line of play.

To extrapolate a little on this discussion and perhaps expand peoples knowledge even more, its maybe also worth noting that whenever your line to the basket goes the wrong way around a mando (basically the example given in the OP)- the mando becomes your target for all things stance/marking related.
You have to mark with your mini towards the mando and have to take you stance behind your marker in relation to that as well. Not towards the basket.

http://www.pdga.com/rules/80312-mandatories
D. When marking the lie, if the line of play does not pass to the correct side of the mandatory, then the mandatory itself shall be considered the hole for the application of all rules regarding stance, markers, obstacles, and relief. For the purposes of taking a legal stance, the mandatory object which has not yet been passed, and is nearest the tee, will be considered to be the hole.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Knowing exactly where the default line goes doesn't matter much if it's not formally marked. If a player lands on the bad side of the mando close to the hypothetical line, it's pretty much going to cost the player one shot regardless whether the player officially missed the mando or not. So just give the player a choice. If they say they didn't miss it yet, they have a tough shot trying to get around the mando on their next throw. If they agree they missed it, they get a penalty and go to the default drop zone on the good side of the mando and have a chance to park their throw. Net results in either case is a score 3 higher than the tee shot to the missed side of the mando.