Not much money producing tournament videos?

[DiscFifty]

I get it that there isn't that much money in covering tournament videos. You're basically only making money from any ads sold that are placed in the video and then a small share of the 3rd party ads shown during your video and perhaps a lump sum from a major sponsor or event organizer, etc, etc.

What I don't understand is why aren't you simply following a plan such as...

Initially release it as PPV (pay per view) only and charge something like 1-5.00 to view it. The ppv would only be available for 1-3 weeks. The goal is to appeal to those die hard disc golf fans who want access to the content as soon as possible. Even if you only get 50-100 early viewers, that's still a decent bonus to help recoup some costs. And if the social media build up (of the event) is going viral due to a hot round or some drama, etc, etc, ...could you get 500-1000 early adopters????

I know most users here would probably socially announce in defiance they have no intention of "paying for it", the real question is how many would actually pay a few bucks to watch an exciting round of disc golf before "everyone else" gets access to it? I know I personally would pay 5.00 to watch the last round of the Aussie Open RIGHT NOW if I knew otherwise I'd have to wait a couple of weeks to watch it. Especially after hearing how that final round went down, I can't wait to watch it!

After the PPV period is over, release it as normal in all free media outlets.

Granted, haters are gonna hate, but they're not the ones you're marketing the ppv to anyway. They'll still watch the free version whenever it becomes available.

I know this type of conversation has been brought up before, but with all the major media content providers making this very easy to set up now, I don't see why all of you are not testing this out....right now. opcorn:

 

[skizzle34]

We are a sport that gets extremely upset when someone does not return something that is worth $15. I can count on one elbow the number of people I know that would be willing to pay to watch a tournament.

We are in a building period as far as video coverage goes and the worst thing any of the producers could do right now is drive traffic away from their videos. Not everything in this world revolves around making the most money possible by any means necessary. Obviously they are doing well enough to support themselves and I don't see any of them adopting a PPV system any time soon or possibly ever.

 

[VictorB]

Disc Golf Planet tried the PPV thing a few years ago and it bombed really hard from what I remember. Having something that pulls more people to viewing the videos is probably worth more right now than charging to watch live coverage. Right now, having those videos be free is what does just that. The turnaround time for the post-production videos is so quick right now, that you can basically have a normal day and see full lead card coverage the next morning (in some cases, not all)

If we ever had a disc golf channel that had a subscription fee I'd probably pay it, since I watch a lot of youtube videos, but that would require all of the current content producers to work together - which means sorting out profit shares and such, which could be a serious headache. These guys have M-F day jobs too, and I don't think the return on investment for setting up payment plans per video would be worth an even bigger investment in that time (but maybe I'm wrong)

If you want the content creators in disc golf to make some extra cash for their efforts, most of them currently have Patreon accounts where you can give as little as $1 per new video they put out, or as much as you can afford. I'd say that's the best route for those guys to make extra money, currently.

 

[JC17393]

I think the model that Smashboxx is now using with their podcast (the audio version, not their tournament video coverage) is a viable one that could be used for tournament coverage. It's basically what DiscFifty proposes...subscribers to their Patreon account get to download the audio podcast almost instantly after it airs on Youtube Tuesday night. Non-subscribers get it a couple days later. It seems to be working so far. I think they're three weeks into the deal and their Patreon shows they're already over $160 per podcast. I think they said that they're already at a point where they can slide a little bit of that cash to their regular guest contributors too. I imagine if they reach a certain threshold, a good deal of their weekly income can be used to supplement and improve their tournament coverage.

Most of the existing video channels have Patreon accounts you can subscribe to. They could easily utilize that to create subscriber perks such as making next day videos available to subscribers only (with free access coming after a week or something).

 

[JoakimBL]

I think the few extra bucks that you could potentially earn with the proposed PPV format, will cost so many viewers that potential advertisement money will be reduced drastically. A lot of the viewers that will not pay, will have lost interest when the free versions comes out. And if you also count the overhead of charging the money, you end up making less would be my guess. I think a better way to make some ekstra is to release the free versions in a lower quality, and have the high quality versions for subscribers/PPV/VOD or something. I'm not sure we are there yet, but the quality of the videos from Aussie Open are getting to a point, where the production value is high enough that you could probably charge a little for it. But in the long run, I would think it would be worth to grow the numbers more first.

 

[Aim For The Chains]

If the youtube videos were worth watching to the masses the videos would have millions of views and would be able to generate income without needing a PPV model.

That is not the case like a girls makeup channel or video gaming walk thrus etc... DG is pretty boring video.

 

[Anon]

PPV doesn't work in a world where all it takes is downloading a browser plugin, hitting the little 'download' button and uploading the video to a free Youtube account. All it takes is one malicious person to completely ruin any sense of exclusivity.

 

[Lazerface]

Another thing to consider is the tournament organizers themselves. They may want their tournament available to everyone an not support a PPV model. If the TD is allocating the $$ for the coverage they are going to have some say in how it is released.

Generally speaking, I think the current outlets are better off offering content the way they do. Patreon and other methods of getting support are the best options in the current environment. The viewership numbers have a long way to go and a PPV model may work better in the distant future.

 

[JC17393]

Another thing to consider is the tournament organizers themselves. They may want their tournament available to everyone an not support a PPV model. If the TD is allocating the $$ for the coverage they are going to have some say in how it is released.

On the flip side, if a PPV or subscriber model can cover the costs of coverage such that the TD doesn't need to allocate as much or any money for the coverage, it might be viewed as advantageous.

I think the main push behind a PPV or subscriber model for video coverage is to make it worthwhile for the people doing the work, but it's also about setting new levels of value of the coverage. If a subscriber system can assure a crew of a certain level of compensation, then they can be justified in asking for more if someone wants them to do something outside of that subscriber system (e.g. something available for free from the start). In that way, it's more of a stepping stone than an end solution.

 

[BionicRib]

Fwiw I think disc golf planet bombed because they told everyone a membership would give them unlimited access to everything and then they started charging separate costs for particular events. I think it rubbed people the wrong way.

 

[tdschrock1]

Initially release it as PPV (pay per view) only and charge something like 1-5.00 to view it. The ppv would only be available for 1-3 weeks.

Few people would pay to watch, saying, 'I'll just watch in a few weeks' and a few weeks later, 'why watch an old disc golf tournament video?'.

Overall views would go down and popularity would wain, meantime a free, possibly lower quality video would garner more views and possibly have a higher chance of the said sponsorship.

In short, I don't think disc golf as a spectator sport is going to be a very lucrative business in the current climate. I (and most disc golfers) will pay $15 for a disc without much coaxing, but not $5 to watch a round to support a good quality producer.

 

[Royalhghnss]

I get it that there isn't that much money in covering tournament videos. You're basically only making money from any ads sold that are placed in the video and then a small share of the 3rd party ads shown during your video and perhaps a lump sum from a major sponsor or event organizer, etc, etc.

What I don't understand is why aren't you simply following a plan such as...

Initially release it as PPV (pay per view) only and charge something like 1-5.00 to view it. The ppv would only be available for 1-3 weeks. The goal is to appeal to those die hard disc golf fans who want access to the content as soon as possible. Even if you only get 50-100 early viewers, that's still a decent bonus to help recoup some costs. And if the social media build up (of the event) is going viral due to a hot round or some drama, etc, etc, ...could you get 500-1000 early adopters????

I know most users here would probably socially announce in defiance they have no intention of "paying for it", the real question is how many would actually pay a few bucks to watch an exciting round of disc golf before "everyone else" gets access to it? I know I personally would pay 5.00 to watch the last round of the Aussie Open RIGHT NOW if I knew otherwise I'd have to wait a couple of weeks to watch it. Especially after hearing how that final round went down, I can't wait to watch it!

After the PPV period is over, release it as normal in all free media outlets.

Granted, haters are gonna hate, but they're not the ones you're marketing the ppv to anyway. They'll still watch the free version whenever it becomes available.

I know this type of conversation has been brought up before, but with all the major media content providers making this very easy to set up now, I don't see why all of you are not testing this out....right now. opcorn:

It's an interesting idea, one that I've mulled over before. With the current landscape I think we'll stick to not doing it though.

Green Mountain Championships in Vermont used to do it (PPV) every year. Anyone know how well that worked for them?

PPV doesn't work in a world where all it takes is downloading a browser plugin, hitting the little 'download' button and uploading the video to a free Youtube account. All it takes is one malicious person to completely ruin any sense of exclusivity.

Yeah this is one of my concerns. I currently don't have an easy way to distribute it to a closed circle, and ensure it stays within that circle. I can set a youtube video to private, but that involves tons of overhead to ensure the right people can see it. I can set a youtube vid to unlisted, but then anyone can share that link with anyone outside the people that paid for it, and now everyone has it.

Another thing to consider is the tournament organizers themselves. They may want their tournament available to everyone an not support a PPV model. If the TD is allocating the $$ for the coverage they are going to have some say in how it is released.

Generally speaking, I think the current outlets are better off offering content the way they do. Patreon and other methods of getting support are the best options in the current environment. The viewership numbers have a long way to go and a PPV model may work better in the distant future.

Good point about the TD's. They want it out as fast as possible to maximize views for their sponsors. Delaying release will hurt that.

I agree with your conclusion.

 

[Anon]

Yeah this is one of my concerns. I currently don't have an easy way to distribute it to a closed circle, and ensure it stays within that circle. I can set a youtube video to private, but that involves tons of overhead to ensure the right people can see it. I can set a youtube vid to unlisted, but then anyone can share that link with anyone outside the people that paid for it, and now everyone has it.

Yup. There really isn't a good answer for it. PPV on TV really only works because the entire distribution chain is locked down and - in most cases the - event is happening LIVE so it plays upon the 'fear of missing out' aspects of our personalities.

But even in the case of traditional TV delivery plenty of people have hacked cable boxes/dvr's and can gain access to the content for free and stream/distribute it to those who are unwilling to pay.

 

[DG_Before_Breakfast]

I don't really see paying for anything except live broadcasts here. Once you can find out who won, the appeal is lost for me. *Maybe* I would pay a little bit to see it in the first couple weeks after the tournament, if someone I like won, or it was a local tournament, but I doubt it. Even live broadcasts are a problem because they are just too darn slow. You would need to have the kind of multi-group/hole coverage, constant background stories, side banter, etc that Ball golf does to make that watchable, and then I think even avid ball golf fans still watch in the background for most of tournament, while doing the crossword, fixing the RV, or sipping Mint julips...

 

[DiscFifty]

It's an interesting idea, one that I've mulled over before. With the current landscape I think we'll stick to not doing it though.

As far as someone ripping it off and uploading it to Youtube under a false account, that scenario potential is already there and would really only impact the bottom line if you solely depended on the ppv income.

Youtube makes it fairly easy to setup a ppv movie. As long as you have 1000+ subscribers, you can access their ppv support.

https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/3249127?hl=en

Just seems like a logical format, ppv now, free later, would be a no brainer for someone taking the time to produce any...quality video. Maybe only 1 week would be the sweet spot. Enough time for "gotta see it now" types that would ante up a bill or 2, not too much time has passed after the tournament to keep things fresh for those waiting for the free version. And let's face it, there are plenty of videos that get released days, weeks, months after a tournament and they still get typical # of views.

 

[tankmlee]

As far as someone ripping it off and uploading it to Youtube under a false account, that scenario potential is already there and would really only impact the bottom line if you solely depended on the ppv income.

Youtube makes it fairly easy to setup a ppv movie. As long as you have 1000+ subscribers, you can access their ppv support.

https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/3249127?hl=en

Just seems like a logical format, ppv now, free later, would be a no brainer for someone taking the time to produce any...quality video. Maybe only 1 week would be the sweet spot. Enough time for "gotta see it now" types that would ante up a bill or 2, not too much time has passed after the tournament to keep things fresh for those waiting for the free version. And let's face it, there are plenty of videos that get released days, weeks, months after a tournament and they still get typical # of views.

Bobby from DD actually talked about this in one of their podcasts, they used to charge people for Tournament video and then these start ups, looking at you Ian(<3) started releasing those videos for free and broke the pay per video model, but in general disc golf enthusiasts dont seem to like subscription based things, they would rather just throw money at companies they decided are worth it, speaking of which im probably going to add to the Patreon of CCDG because i have watched almost every single one of their videos so hopefully i can see some more big tournaments get covered. but if they told me i had to pay for the videos i would never watch the newest videos.

 

[AzteC]

I'd pay for quick and high quality tournament footage. But I feel like I'm in the minority.

 

[Emoney]

I would make the Pros pay 5$ (or whatever amount) extra on the tourney fees that goes directly to a "hired" video guy.
I feel this would be the best route. Eliminate company adds so it doesn't feed the trolls.

Sell it as a way for the pros to grow the sport, their brand, and their wallet after said growth.

Lots of Ams buy the plastic they see being thrown in the tourney vids. So the players are kind of making money off the video.

I don't understand why pros aren't on this forum in the "discs " section. Like Mcbeth talking about what destroyers he likes. It's easy money that no pro has taken advantage of.

 

[skizzle34]

I would make the Pros pay 5$ (or whatever amount) extra on the tourney fees that goes directly to a "hired" video guy.
I feel this would be the best route. Eliminate company adds so it doesn't feed the trolls.

Sell it as a way for the pros to grow the sport, their brand, and their wallet after said growth.

Lots of Ams buy the plastic they see being thrown in the tourney vids. So the players are kind of making money off the video.

I don't understand why pros aren't on this forum in the "discs " section. Like Mcbeth talking about what destroyers he likes. It's easy money that no pro has taken advantage of.

Because they don't want to feed the trolls and since they don't have day jobs where they sit locked at a desk they have better things to do with their time

 

[da Crippler]

If there was money in tourney coverage, ESPN, or some other major sports network, would be doing it. Curling gets more coverage than disc golf does.:\