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OAT Vs. turn over

you want me to show proof that we have different definitions of oat.

here is an example of oat:\:



flutter is, to me, a defining characteristic of oat. how do you define it?

I DID this once only better and not on camera.
Just after I released the disc I did a full 360 int he air, fell of the right of the pad and landed doing the splits. My bro was with me and almost literally laughed his a$$ off.
It was one of my best drives ever though..released it just in time....
 
IMO OAT is when you throw Off Axis which means not horizontal....it can be / or \ but never flat It does not always cause flutter. Flutter is caused by poor timing of the snap not coinciding with the release. You can release off axis with good timing and get a good snap and clean release that is off axis and the disc will start out on a hyzer or anhyzer line rather than a flat line. OAT being a bad thing is often exaggerated as it is a useful tool if used properly. Why else would so many overstable and stable discs be soooo much more popular than understables? You can't tell me all those players are strong and skilled enough to release flat and clean and throw superstables over 300+ ft.

To answer the question OAT occurs out of your hand and has no flat portion to its flight at the beginning and a turnover occurs after a flat portion of it's flight. It gets muddy when you are really overpowering a slower understable as it will turn out of your hand as its flat portion of flight is done immediately after release. Sounds like your flipping a beat lightweight champ teebird if there is a flat portion to its flight b4 diving into the ground. A newer heavier champ tee bird should not behave this way unless your arm is blessed by Zeus.
 
you want me to show proof that we have different definitions of oat.

here is an example of oat:\:



flutter is, to me, a defining characteristic of oat. how do you define it?

ohhh, c'mon man. don't put videos of Jukeshoe out there like that!
 
Sounds like your flipping a beat lightweight champ teebird if there is a flat portion to its flight b4 diving into the ground. A newer heavier champ tee bird should not behave this way unless your arm is blessed by Zeus.

True about light, well 170, but it is in new condition. I also have a star 173 that does not turn over no mater what.
 
Isnt flutter from the kind of OAT where the disc is on a different plane than the rest of the throwing motion? Like if you threw a disc with the bottom facing the direction you are hucking it for an extreme example.

Thing is, theres different ways to OAT (which only mean off axis) and most of those ways I would agree are going to make a disc like a putter flutter, it still would be possible for the disc to be released at an agle that lends its aerodynamics better to avoid flutter.

Just a guess really.
 
IMO OAT is when you throw Off Axis which means not horizontal....it can be / or \ but never flat

OAT = Off-Axis Torque... not whatever it means in your opinion
It is adding spin to the disc other than the flat spin around the center of the disc. You can hyzer or anny it without OAT, you can throw it flat with OAT.

OAT can be caused by every part of a throw, and the goal is to eliminate all but the OAT you wish to use to shape the flightpath.

Google OAT + Garublador to find some valuable threads if you want to get in deeper.

To also elaborate, flutter is always OAT since the disc has movement other than a flat spin around its center axis. Flutter on a highspeed disc is uncommonly severe OAT since the weight balance paired with a discs rotational inertia usually smooths out the flutter. I'd also bet that the vast majority of fluttering incidents are caused by only bad releases where the disc is being released at different times - ex. releasing fingers from the bottom of the disc before thumb on top, which adds very undesirable directional forces from the top or bottom of the disc.

I sense an incoming craving for oatmeal tomorrow.
 
Seems to be 2 understandings of oat. Flutter which is related to timing and releasing non horizontal. No wonder there is so much confusion. Term is dumb anyway I prefer flutter to OAT I think it describes the phenomenon much better. Releasing non horizontally is another mistake but not related to flutter.
 
OAT = Off-Axis Torque... not whatever it means in your opinion
It is adding spin to the disc other than the flat spin around the center of the disc. You can hyzer or anny it without OAT, you can throw it flat with OAT.

OAT can be caused by every part of a throw, and the goal is to eliminate all but the OAT you wish to use to shape the flightpath.

Google OAT + Garublador to find some valuable threads if you want to get in deeper.

To also elaborate, flutter is always OAT since the disc has movement other than a flat spin around its center axis. Flutter on a highspeed disc is uncommonly severe OAT since the weight balance paired with a discs rotational inertia usually smooths out the flutter. I'd also bet that the vast majority of fluttering incidents are caused by only bad releases where the disc is being released at different times - ex. releasing fingers from the bottom of the disc before thumb on top, which adds very undesirable directional forces from the top or bottom of the disc.

I sense an incoming craving for oatmeal tomorrow.

Very helpful...I wish I had a prize to give you. thanks.
 
optidiscic;522278 Releasing non horizontally is another mistake but not related to flutter.[/QUOTE said:
Now I'm in trouble....
The guys on the Discing down thread are talking about hyzer flipping as good form... That's not horizontal

Hyzers aren't horizontal...

Anhyzers aren't horizontal...

I'm a little confused...

Then again, that's what happens when I don't have time during the day to play, so I read forums at night.
 
Seems to be 2 understandings of oat. Flutter which is related to timing and releasing non horizontal. No wonder there is so much confusion. Term is dumb anyway I prefer flutter to OAT I think it describes the phenomenon much better. Releasing non horizontally is another mistake but not related to flutter.

ok there we go
 
OAT = Off-Axis Torque... not whatever it means in your opinion
It is adding spin to the disc other than the flat spin around the center of the disc. You can hyzer or anny it without OAT, you can throw it flat with OAT.

OAT can be caused by every part of a throw, and the goal is to eliminate all but the OAT you wish to use to shape the flightpath.

Google OAT + Garublador to find some valuable threads if you want to get in deeper.

To also elaborate, flutter is always OAT since the disc has movement other than a flat spin around its center axis. Flutter on a highspeed disc is uncommonly severe OAT since the weight balance paired with a discs rotational inertia usually smooths out the flutter. I'd also bet that the vast majority of fluttering incidents are caused by only bad releases where the disc is being released at different times - ex. releasing fingers from the bottom of the disc before thumb on top, which adds very undesirable directional forces from the top or bottom of the disc.

I sense an incoming craving for oatmeal tomorrow.

thats how i define flutter.:\
 
ok guys, when you throw a disc without it spinning what happens....it just falls to the ground right?

Discs need spin/snap to keep them from going left, and power to keep them going forward otherwise they dip on the left like when there is no spin or when you throw it with low/no spin and it fades. The disc maintaining its flight depends on forward momentum and glide, power, etc. The wing of the disc will act like the wing of a plane keeping it in the air longer. The rotation of the disc keeps the weight centered so the disc can keep forward momentum and that "wing effect" going. That is the basis for all throws with a disc.

You can manipulate this effect by adding or subtracting variables of the throw. Discs, power, form, snap, arm speed, angle of release. Even weather phenomena change flight characteristics a little. Humidity or lack of it, altitude, wind, temperature. All of those things are variables in how your disc will react when thrown.

A disc when thrown at its power requirement will fly straight if flat. This changes when variables come in. A flat throw with more than the appropriate amount of power will cause the disc to turn to the right a little in the air (rhbh). That effect is magnified when you change the angle of the wing of the disc and add the same power. Be it a hyzer release or anny release.

You can throw the disc off axis to achieve a certain effect without overpowering it or forcing it. This is not OAT. A hyzer or anhyzer shot is not necessarily a shot that requires OAT, and the discs not being horizontal doesnt automatically qualify it for OAT. You are simply changing the flight path by increasing or decreasing angle of release. You can also throw it too hard from a release and "make" a disc do something. That is what i define as OAT. Sometimes the results arent so good, others have found a way to make it more predictable.

IMO, OAT is most prevalent in beginners and people who have never thrown anything but a disc that was wayyyy too big for them. Generally these peoples bags will look like this 10+ warp speed drivers, Putter, Mid (maybe). They tend to throw EVERYTHING with an "S" shot because that is the only way they have ever known to get something to go straight. They generally also putt with a bit of anhyzer. Most dont use mids, but if they have them, they probably are still in the process of figuring out what theyre for.
 
So again what the hell is oat lol. I prefer flutter and then too much anny or too much hyzer but oat WTF after 3 yrs on this site. It is still not clear
 
I, for one, hate this term. I feel like I need to spread around terms like frolf and call my golf discs frisbees to counteract the introduction of technical disc golf nomenclature.
 
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