PDGA Asks Golfers to not play courses...

[Nick Pacific]

People are only using the data that backs their side of the debate, there's much more to that 17 day thing than Nick posted.

All those tests on surfaces are inside, no test that I have heard of has been done on outside surfaces. Fluid evaporates, I would think that makes a difference.

A good portion of your transit time in NYC is spent outside, coming and going up and down stairs and thoroughfares getting to and from subway systems. Even the subways themselves aren't even close to being airtight like a plane, car or even a bus, there is open air in them coming and going and they stop constantly and open/close doors. And it's cold as a mofo down there right now in March, not even close to being a temperature controlled cruise ship cabin. Yet NYC is essentially the US epicenter of the virus, and most experts think a large portion of the virus has spread in their transit systems in air and on surfaces, in which a good portion of that time occurs outside the actual subway.

 

[DavidSauls]

So the latest information out of the plague ship Diamond Princess is showing the virus is detectable on some surfaces for 17 days :gross:

https://nypost.com/2020/03/24/coronavirus-found-on-diamond-princess-surfaces-17-days-later/

Included in the same article:

"However, the report stressed that the research "cannot be used to determine whether transmission occurred from contaminated surfaces" and whether the traces were active enough to get anyone sick."

 

[Cgkdisc]

PDGA, Global org that hosts World Championships. CDC, U.S. based. PDGA has to make calls suitable for the worst case areas globally. Even if fewer restrictions might be reasonable for other areas, the PDGA can't realistically update different country recommendations in this quickly changing global environment. Majority of PDGA policy criticism understandably coming from U.S. based players who may not know or recognize the various accommodations the PDGA has made over the years to address cultural and economic conditions in the countries embracing disc golf.

 

[jakebake91]

People are only using the data that backs their side of the debate, there's much more to that 17 day thing than Nick posted.

All those tests on surfaces are inside, no test that I have heard of has been done on outside surfaces. Fluid evaporates, I would think that makes a difference.

Yes. That may be true. But nobody knows how transmittable this thing could be in our disc golf settings, least of all us here. Let's just stay off the courses. I've maintained from the beginning that we should just exercise caution. Many states (including my home state of WI) have issued shelter/safer at home ordinances. That means only essential travel.

And again. Let's use perspective. I've used this analogy elsewhere here too, so pardon if you've read it already. So you all seem to say that there is a risk of exposure at the course, it's just super small. Pick a percentage chance, don't even care what it is. Say I gave you a bowl of 100 Skittles, and told you that whatever percentage of them you choose could potentially kill you or cause someone you know to die. Would you grab a handful and eat them? Betcha you don't, even on the .01% chance. This is the same thing.

That's just talking about the course itself, not the travel to and from. Seems stupid, I know. But eliminating as many potential variables to the exposure and transmission of this thing should be something we all are doing.

That's just my two cents.

 

[Jay Dub]

A good portion of your transit time in NYC is spent outside, coming and going up and down stairs and thoroughfares getting to and from subway systems. Even the subways themselves aren't even close to being airtight like a plane, car or even a bus, there is open air in them coming and going and they stop constantly and open/close doors. And it's cold as a mofo down there right now in March, not even close to being a temperature controlled cruise ship cabin. Yet NYC is essentially the US epicenter of the virus, and most experts think a large portion of the virus has spread in their transit systems in air and on surfaces, in which a good portion of that time occurs outside the actual subway.

You see how close New Yorkers are still standing to each other on the subway?

Again, you just want to spin so you can be right while you ignore all the other data.

 

[Jay Dub]

Yes. That may be true. But nobody knows how transmittable this thing could be in our disc golf settings, least of all us here. Let's just stay off the courses. I've maintained from the beginning that we should just exercise caution. Many states (including my home state of WI) have issued shelter/safer at home ordinances. That means only essential travel.

And again. Let's use perspective. I've used this analogy elsewhere here too, so pardon if you've read it already. So you all seem to say that there is a risk of exposure at the course, it's just super small. Pick a percentage chance, don't even care what it is. Say I gave you a bowl of 100 Skittles, and told you that whatever percentage of them you choose could potentially kill you or cause someone you know to die. Would you grab a handful and eat them? Betcha you don't, even on the .01% chance. This is the same thing.

That's just talking about the course itself, not the travel to and from. Seems stupid, I know. But eliminating as many potential variables to the exposure and transmission of this thing should be something we all are doing.

That's just my two cents.

Local experts here are saying to go out and enjoy the parks while keeping a safe distance. We are also on lock down and yet they still tell people to get out to the parks.
A local here contacted their park authorities and asked directly about disc golf. The reply was playing disc golf does NOT go against the guide lines of the local Gov and Med in regard to the stay at home order.

 

[jakebake91]

Local experts here are saying to go out and enjoy the parks while keeping a safe distance. We are also on lock down and yet they still tell people to get out to the parks.
A local here contacted their park authorities and asked directly about disc golf. The reply was playing disc golf does NOT go against the guide lines of the local Gov and Med in regard to the stay at home order.

Yes. Get out and walk/exercise. Stay away from groups. Don't touch public use objects, ie baskets. And to me, gas pumps and stations. Travel takes gas.

I'm not advocating staying inside and being a hermit. Not at all. I'm just not going to travel anywhere. I can take my kids and dogs and go walk around town. We can chuck plastic in the yard. That's just me and my take on it. There is no need to drive 15 miles to the nearest course to get exercise.

 

[broomerang]

I'm just saying that if your touching your face right now during a viral epidemic than you're not too bright.

If your coughing onto things, licking public surfaces, your a nasty mofo.

If you're standing too close to people your practicing social distancing wrong.

Man I'm not a germaphobe but I would NEVER be putting my hands in my mouth, licking my fingers, while playing disc golf OR especially riding the subway. Even during "normal" times.

 

[elmexdela]

I'm just saying that if your touching your face right now during a viral epidemic than you're not too bright.

If your coughing onto things, licking public surfaces, your a nasty mofo.

If you're standing too close to people your practicing social distancing wrong.

Man I'm not a germaphobe but I would NEVER be putting my hands in my mouth, licking my fingers, while playing disc golf OR especially riding the subway. Even during "normal" times.

idk this whole paul macbeth finger licking thing is catching on

im not steve west and i dont have a graph or anything but my observations are a dramatic increase in finger lickers since macbeth has been world champ

 

[broomerang]

idk this whole paul macbeth finger licking thing is catching on

im not steve west and i dont have a graph or anything but my observations are a dramatic increase in finger lickers since macbeth has been world champ

That's the chart we want but the chart we deserve is how licking ones fingers relates to Par.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Paul's just angling for a KFC sponsorship because he's "finger lickin' good."

 

[Kegelexercise]

OK...I wanted to stay as much out of this as I can, and am going to do my best to continue to do so, but a couple of things came up that I can't help but comment on.

Wisconsin's "safer at home order" - this is verbatim from the order as written. This is my home state too. (source: https://milwaukeerecord.com/city-life/read-the-full-text-of-wisconsins-safer-at-home-order-and-then-please-stay-safe-at-home/)

c. Outdoor activity. To engage in outdoor activity, including visiting public and state parks, provided individuals comply with Social Distancing Requirements as defined below. Such activities include, by way of example and without limitation, walking, biking, hiking, or running. Individuals may not engage in team or contact sports such as by way of example and without limitation, basketball, ultimate frisbee, soccer, or football, as these activities do not comply with Social Distancing Requirements. Playgrounds are closed.

Disc golf, obviously, differs so materially from the team sport Ultimate Frisbee, that it should go without saying, but I'll mention it anyway.

Regarding the 17 day transmission thing - this is almost certain to be a gross over-exaggeration, at least as far as actual infection potential goes. Further reading here: https://newatlas.com/health-wellbeing/covid19-novel-coronavirus-surfaces-days-aerosol-transmission/. And yes, I've done my own independent research as to how legit a source NewAtlas is - clearly I am comfortable sharing their work.

Look, I am not going to tell anyone else how they should manage the risks. I've already decided my course of action here. But, let's be careful with the more sensationalized bits of news we're hearing, OK?

 

[Jay Dub]

I just played 18 at the closest course to me. Very few people there and I accidentally made one long putt all others were C1 pick ups.

 

[DavidSauls]

I just played 18 at the closest course to me. Very few people there and I accidentally made one long putt all others were C1 pick ups.

I could boost my rating by 80 points, doing that.

 

[Jay Dub]

I could boost my rating by 80 points, doing that.

lol that has been discussed on local pages. Everyone's C1 putting is going to improve.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Post apocalypse disc golf will be laying up into a 5-meter diameter circle (C.5) to hole out, then just add one stroke.

 

[ru4por]

A good portion of your transit time in NYC is spent outside, coming and going up and down stairs and thoroughfares getting to and from subway systems. Even the subways themselves aren't even close to being airtight like a plane, car or even a bus, there is open air in them coming and going and they stop constantly and open/close doors. And it's cold as a mofo down there right now in March, not even close to being a temperature controlled cruise ship cabin. Yet NYC is essentially the US epicenter of the virus, and most experts think a large portion of the virus has spread in their transit systems in air and on surfaces, in which a good portion of that time occurs outside the actual subway.

I would venture a guess that the vast portion of NYC transmission is aerosol transmission, not surface. Crowded subways cars and platforms are the real source. Even given the 17 day information, in conflict to earlier studies, there is no information on how easily the virus is transferred by touch. Touch also requires a couple of mechanisms of transfer. I doubt subway riders are licking benches, so the virus must be transferred to the bench, to the hands of a host, then from hands to mouth/nose/eyes. Again, no solid info of how well any of those transfers work. We do have data on how the virus moves in aerosol from person to person.
Again, just me thinking out loud.

 

[ru4por]

People are only using the data that backs their side of the debate, there's much more to that 17 day thing than Nick posted.

All those tests on surfaces are inside, no test that I have heard of has been done on outside surfaces. Fluid evaporates, I would think that makes a difference.

Yeah....even my musing are very far from science and should not be used to help make a decision.

The best decision is to use as much caution as possible, by staying inside period.

 

[Orioles_Lefty]

Yeah....even my musing are very far from science and should not be used to help make a decision.

The best decision is to use as much caution as possible, by staying inside period.

Yes, the absolute right choice is scientifically proven. I understand that some see it as overkill or a great violation of individual liberties. As has been argued on my state's DG page, to fall in line with recommendations (that fall short of official orders) to not play or to stay inside is to betray one's backbone.

I just can't see why contributing to the extent one can to a collective good, public health, is so controversial.

 

[LateWesternSky]

I'm just saying that if your touching your face right now during a viral epidemic than you're not too bright.

People subconsciously touch their face all the time. I believe there are studies that show the average person touches their face 20 times per hour.