Provisional throws

[Jay Dub]

I was going to start a new thread but will just ask here:

When teeing off, player A goes OB and wants to throw a provisional off the tee. What is the order at this point? The player was 1st on the tee for this hole, do they throw again right away or wait until all others throw before taking their provisional throw? or does it matter?

I searched the PDGA rules just now and didn't find the answer.

 

[Cgkdisc]

I was going to start a new thread but will just ask here:

When teeing off, player A goes OB and wants to throw a provisional off the tee. What is the order at this point? The player was 1st on the tee for this hole, do they throw again right away or wait until all others throw before taking their provisional throw? or does it matter?

I searched the PDGA rules just now and didn't find the answer.

A provisional will potentially count as a player's next throw. So the default would be to throw it after everyone else has thrown. But similar to a player's request to putt first for speed of play near the basket, the person who wants to throw a provisional can ask the group's permission to throw right away.

 

[Steve West]

Now, now, Chuck. You know you are supposed to quote the rule, to make sure it hasn't changed since you learned it.

802.02 Order of Play
D. If a player is making another throw from the same lie, or a re-throw, that player remains next in the throwing order. A re-throw is an additional throw from the same lie which is played instead of the original throw.

But, the real answer is: "It hardly matters", because of:

E. To facilitate flow of play, a player who is not next may throw if the player who is next consents, or if throwing will not impact the player who is next.

So what really happens is the group figures out how they want to do it, and that makes it OK.

"D" is just for cases when a group can't seem to agree about anything and a default is needed.

 

[Cgkdisc]

Now, now, Chuck. You know you are supposed to quote the rule, to make sure it hasn't changed since you learned it.

A provisional call cannot fall under the Order of Play rule. If it did, the group could say the thrower lost their right to call a provisional since the thrower didn't call it and throw it right away after their first throw, or at minimum, call it a courtesy violation if they call it after at least one other player has thrown. Correct?

 

[Steve West]

A provisional call cannot fall under the Order of Play rule. If it did, the group could say the thrower lost their right to call a provisional since the thrower didn't call it and throw it right away after their first throw, or at minimum, call it a courtesy violation if they call it after at least one other player has thrown. Correct?

Rule?

 

[Cgkdisc]

Rule?

809.02 A Provisional can be called any time before players leave the tee, and for that matter,
any time until the next away player makes their second throw since the rule does not specifically state that a provisional needs to be called immediately following the errant throw.

 

[Steve West]

809.02 A Provisional can be called any time before players leave the tee, and for that matter,
any time until the next away player makes their second throw since the rule does not specifically state that a provisional needs to be called immediately following the errant throw.

Unclear on the concept, huh? OK, for your elucidation: Typing a number followed by what you think the rule should say is not quoting a rule. Otherwise, I could do this:

809.02 Any player with a PDGA number below 5000 receives enough penalty throws so that Steve wins.

Try again. (Hint: modern computers usually offer a feature called "copy and paste".)

 

[krupicka]

I was going to start a new thread but will just ask here:

When teeing off, player A goes OB and wants to throw a provisional off the tee. What is the order at this point? The player was 1st on the tee for this hole, do they throw again right away or wait until all others throw before taking their provisional throw? or does it matter?

I searched the PDGA rules just now and didn't find the answer.

From your question, it appears that the thrower has decided to throw a provisional prior to anyone else throwing. In that case, Steve quoted the correct answer.

802.02 Order of Play
D. If a player is making another throw from the same lie, or a re-throw, that player remains next in the throwing order. A re-throw is an additional throw from the same lie which is played instead of the original throw.

 

[cheesethin]

A provisional call cannot fall under the Order of Play rule. If it did, the group could say the thrower lost their right to call a provisional since the thrower didn't call it and throw it right away after their first throw, or at minimum, call it a courtesy violation if they call it after at least one other player has thrown. Correct?

The playing order rule is a conditional statement. 'If' the player is to re throw. And since time saving provisionals are by the players choice (with card consent), the condition in the playing order rules is only met at the point in time when the player chooses to re throw.

Being next in the order is essentially at the players discretion by virtue of them choosing to re throw.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

 

[roblee]

I think Steve is correct: "It hardly matters". Another reason is a player can decide to throw a provisional or to abandon a throw after the players leave the tee (or the previous lie). Just has to be before you make the next throw. i.e. You leave the tee, walk down the fairway, two other players take their second throw and as you approach your disc you discover you are so restricted it may take 3 shots to just get back to the fairway. State you are abandoning your lie & return to the tee. 30 sec rule does not apply until you reach the tee (or previous lie).